This evening...

[muffler dragon]

This evening I went to Barnes & Noble with my family. My daughter loves to play with Thomas the Tank Engine and my wife and I had some coffee from an outside source (had to put that in, because the Starbucks here is very suspect). Anyway, I sat down with a commentary on the Torah. It was the third one I looked at, but didn't sit down with it for any particular reason other than it looked like it was the most straight-forward at the time.

My wife saw that I was reading it. I have not talked with her much about my theological excursions that I have taken with all of you, but I figured this might be a good time to give her a taste. I've started to really investigate a kosher diet also which segued us into the discussion.

To make a long story short, I brought up some of the wonderful conversations I have had here and the meat that is being offered up on a regular basis. I then told her about some of my recent boot-quaking experiences that are rocking my foundation and world. She concurred on the shattering that these things would have.

We moved into a discussion about actually attending a Jewish service. I mentioned the difference between Friday evening and Saturday morning. So upon her approval, we're going to see what we can do about attending the Friday service at the synagogue I had mentioned I might attend a few weeks ago. If they offer some sort of child-care, you can count us in. If they do not, then it will take some time to bring that to fruition as we don't have any family here and we already abuse our few friends enough. But the intent is to make it happen and move forward by the grace of G-d.

I just wanted to share this with you. We covet your prayers as we begin this journey, and I personally thank you for the fellowship that you afford me on a daily basis. I'll be sure to keep you aware of how things are progressing.

With all my love,

Nathan

 

[Sephania]

How wonderful that your wife is willing, and is supporting you, I have seen many a time where this draws a line in the sand and it can become a huge gaping hole before long as this is a great achilles heel for the enemy to use. I will pray that you are both in harmony with whatever the L-RD is calling you to so that you both may grow stronger in him!

 

[simchat_torah]

It's too bad you llive in NC Nathan. Cause otherwise, my wife and I would take you to services with us

That is .... of course after I cooked you a nice kosher meal

 

[Talmidah]

It's too bad you llive in NC Nathan. Cause otherwise, my wife and I would take you to services with us

That is .... of course after I cooked you a nice kosher meal

Actually its too bad all of you don't live in California. Then I'd cook you all a nice kosher meal and take you to services

 

[Henaynei]

I say come to Florida and spend Shabbat with us!!!

What a blessing your Woman of Valor is Nathan!! You and G-d chose well!!

 

[iitb]

You're lucky you don't live in Colorado, 'cause I don't cook!

 

[simchat_torah]

that, and you'd have to put up with Justin.

That's nothing compared to going hungry.

 

[visionary]

If you are in Alabama, I would love to invited you over after attending the Messianic congregation found in this neck of the woods. I also can cook kosher, and vegetarian kosher if you wish.

 

[Henaynei]

LOL -- looks like Nathan has the itinery all mapped out - now all they need is a covered wagon.....

MOve over Joseph Smith!!!

 

[muffler dragon]

If I knew how to post pictures on this forum, I would show what I'd be showing up in when I visit any of you in the future. But for now, you can visit the type of car I have at www.3kgt.com
I wanted one for the longest time, and then finally got the chance. Anyway, different topic for a different time.

I wanted to write for a couple more reasons:

1) Thank you for the warm responses regarding my wife's interest. She truly is an amazing woman. I pray that the L-rd moves our hearts simultaneously. More than likely it will be a matter of me learning and then teaching her, but it will be a growth process for me in return as well. Especially when she destroys my logic and treats me like a red-headed step child.

2) I wanted to ask if you (everyone who is interested) would mind letting me know where you reside? My business travel takes me to a number of different places in the continental US. I usually know my schedule well in advance, and it would be great to put a face with the name. Presently, I spend the majority of my time in New England, along the eastern seaboard, and the southeast. My territory includes 18 states, but I will also be spending some time in major metropolitan centers outside my normal region.

3) Be it that I have no idea what the word 'kosher' truly means, I should have specified that I am investigating a Biblical-based diet. If they are one in the same, then great; however, I don't know how many rabbis are down here to bless the meat. So I don't know how well I'll be able to adapt to a strict rendering. It's come about more from the sense of looking to avoid or incorporate things in the Bible that the L-rd has stated. Therefore, would you mind taking the time to help elaborate more on my list below and add anything you feel would be helpful or pertinent. I'll try to list the things I eat, because I don't go out on a huge limb.

Meat:

Beef: There is absolutely nothing finer to me at this present time than a Kosher Pastrami and Swiss sandwich with mustard. But once again, that's a deviation from what I am trying to achieve in this post.

Swine - not okay

Poultry:
Chicken
Turkey

Seafood:
Saltwater fish: Tuna, can-a-day presently. Mahi Mahi, don't get to try many others.
Freshwater fish: Salmon, catfish
Fish in general, are any not to be eaten.
Shrimp - I presently eat, but not often. Would not be hard to remove myself from if it is outside of the realm.
Crab - used to eat crab cakes when I was growing up, but not much any more.

Vegetation:

As I will eat most of them, are there any to avoid?

Lastly, please let me know what else is simply not good to consume.

Thanks for all your time.

Nathan

 

[Henaynei]

I urge you to under take this journey with your foods slowly and gently - it is a lifetime of learning and can give you the grandest case of spiritual indigestion you have EVER seen if not taken in small bites and VERY thoroughly masticated...... the nuiances you will pick up on further study

That said I will try to address your questions

Therefore, would you mind taking the time to help elaborate more on my list below and add anything you feel would be helpful or pertinent. I'll try to list the things I eat, because I don't go out on a huge limb.

Meat:

Beef: There is absolutely nothing finer to me at this present time than a Kosher Pastrami and Swiss sandwich with mustard. But once again, that's a deviation from what I am trying to achieve in this post.

Swine - not okay

Kosher meat is not meat the "rabbi blessed" It is meat that has been slaghtered according to a strict set of rules that encompass sanitation, avoidance of cruelty, and removal of the most blood possible. This is usually done by one trained by a rabbi expert in these issues. All foods are considered already blessed when they have been thusly treated and are those allowed by the instructions of HaShem This why a Jewish person does not bless their food prior to eating - rather they bless G-d for providing proper foods to consume.

For meat this means the animal MUST BOTH chew it's cud AND have a cloven hoof...... so lamb, goat, venison, buffalo, elk etc are all kosher as well.

Poultry:
Chicken
Turkey

That is pretty standard. Rather than tell us which fowl are kosher, HaShem has listed those that are not..... see instruction manual

Seafood:
Saltwater fish: Tuna, can-a-day presently. Mahi Mahi, don't get to try many others.
Freshwater fish: Salmon, catfish
Fish in general, are any not to be eaten.
Shrimp - I presently eat, but not often. Would not be hard to remove myself from if it is outside of the realm.
Crab - used to eat crab cakes when I was growing up, but not much any more.

For creatures that live in water to be kosher they MUST have BOTH fins AND scales. This eliminates ALL shellfish, and fish such as catfish, shark, dolphin (the mammal kind), swordfish, monkfish and numerous others......

Vegetation:
As I will eat most of them, are there any to avoid? [/qoute] The issue with vegetation is the unintentional ingestion of forbidden creatures.... i.e. bugs!! Inspect all your vegetation throughly. Often you can find packaged salad fixings in the store that have a heksher (kosher symbol) [there is thread on these symbols up in the Halakah forum I think]. Also several of the major frozen veggies have a heksher.

Bless HaShem and be blessed

b'Shalom
Henaynei

 

[sojeru]

I know many will disagree with me here.
However, dairy is not to be eaten WITH meat
Dairy can eaten immediately before you eat meat.
Some say that after you eat dairy you are to wash out your mouth and then you can continue your meal with meat.
Some dont do this at all but only eat the dairy first and then afterwards move on with meat.
Some just have like a 15 minute interval before they continue with the eating of meat.
but again, both together, a no no.
this is all a question of Halacha.

Also, there is no such thing as a Rabbi blessing the meat.
it may be understood like this by those who do not practise.
and the only time a "blessing" ACTUALLY goes on is when I person blesses G-D for the food before the eating of a meal...not a snack, not a bite- but a meal.

So what makes beef Kosher?
the WAY it is killed...
what makes chiken, Turkey, etc kosher? again- the way it is killed.
much chicken today is killed by electrical wires attached to their legs- bad.
some have their necks wrung- bad
but to CHOP the neck in a certain manner- KASHRUT

Also, Shabbat Shacharit Service (the morning service) would be perfect for you and your family.
on Friday evening it would be better for you alone...
this is the way it works for Jews with a family.
The Husband goes to the synoga on friday evening while the wife stays at home and prepares the shabbat evening meal- she puts the children to bed- and she prepares herself emotionally and physically to have relations with her husband that shabbat night.
So while the husband is at the synoga- the wife is at home preparing- making that home welcoming for shabbat.
this is the practice with Askenazim and Sefaradim.
now on the Sabbath DAY there are slight differences between the practices of Ashkenaz and Sefarad.

However, in thinking of it- if you can find a baby sitter- it would be good if your wife goes with you a nice amount of times- but more so better for Shacharit services.

Blessings on your endeavors

Shalom u'brachot
Antonio

 

[Henaynei]

I don't disagree about the seperation of milk and meat at all - I just don't think it is among the first steps for someone starting out raw (as it were) in trying to understand and implememt proper eating.

Allow such a one to successfully navigate elementary school before trying to keep up with Junior High


"Little moves, Elle, little moves...." {name that movie!}

 

[simchat_torah]

I have read somewhere that when first entering a Kosher lifestyle, the Rabbis reccomend starting with eliminating pork. You wouldn't believe how many items have pork in them... I'm quite serious.

From there, begin eliminating shellfish, catfish, etc.

And you will slowly but surely progress in a kosher observance.

The Rabbis teach that if you pile all of the wood on a camel's back immediately, you will break their back. You must place one log at a time if you want them to succeed in carrying the whole lot.

Shalom,
yafet

 

[simchat_torah]

Vegetation:

As I will eat most of them, are there any to avoid?

All vegtables are 100% kosher

Seafood:
Saltwater fish: Tuna, can-a-day presently. Mahi Mahi, don't get to try many others.
Freshwater fish: Salmon, catfish
Fish in general, are any not to be eaten.
Shrimp - I presently eat, but not often. Would not be hard to remove myself from if it is outside of the realm.
Crab - used to eat crab cakes when I was growing up, but not much any more.

Think of it this way:
If it has scales, and fins... its all good.

Thus, catfish are right out: no scales.
So are crab & lobster for obvious reasons.
As well, shrimp.

If you think about it, those are all the bottom feeders. Do you really want to put animals that eat poop into your body anyway????? I didn't think so

Beef: There is absolutely nothing finer to me at this present time than a Kosher Pastrami and Swiss sandwich with mustard. But once again, that's a deviation from what I am trying to achieve in this post.

This all depends... are you trying to end up eating only Rabbinical Kosher, or strictly Torah kosher? Torah *can* be interpretted in many ways. One of the interpretations states that you can not mix meat and dairy. Another interpretation states you can.

I reccomend not worrying about which interpretation when first walking in light of the Torah. At first, just begin eating a diet that you know is 'clean food'. From there, you can choose which path you want to follow as far as interpretation goes.

Blessings,
Yafet

 

[blessed2]

We covet your prayers

Covet for nothing, Muffler dragon, Know our prayers are always with you in this journey.

P.S. Wish you lived in Arkansas, then we could find our way in this together.

 

[muffler dragon]

You wouldn't believe how many items have pork in them... I'm quite serious.

It's amazing how the L-rd moves. The statements made by a few on here about moving slowly is exactly how the L-rd has impressed it upon my heart. And the very first thing to remove is pork.

I outline that statement above, because since I have decided that I would really like to begin this journey, I have seen pork on a daily basis. I have seen it in bbq (obviously), pizza, soup and sandwiches. And I've only been wanting to move in this direction for less than a week. Strange how when I want to really remove something from my life, it becomes more apparent and more difficult to avoid.

I want to thank you all for your thoughts thus far on this, and to be honest, it doesn't sound like it will be impossible to achieve. Just a matter of being obedient and watchful. Which leads me to the question: how do I know if something is kosher or not? I am well aware of Hebrew National hotdogs, but that's all I've ever looked for in a grocery store. They answer to a Higher Authority, ya know. The part that I really find humorous and quite cool is the fact that they only sell seven weiners to a package. Throws the whole bun thing out the window.

Anyway, please let me know what distinguishes kosher from otherwise.

Oh, nearly forget, can you find kosher in just any store or do I need to look for even a particular chain or health food store?

Love, peace and hair grease.

Nathan

 

[The Thadman]

I know many will disagree with me here.
However, dairy is not to be eaten WITH meat

Not in Torah, but I think people can anticipate my responses as of now.

Peace!
-Steve-o

 

[The Thadman]

I want to thank you all for your thoughts thus far on this, and to be honest, it doesn't sound like it will be impossible to achieve. Just a matter of being obedient and watchful. Which leads me to the question: how do I know if something is kosher or not? I am well aware of Hebrew National hotdogs, but that's all I've ever looked for in a grocery store. They answer to a Higher Authority, ya know. The part that I really find humorous and quite cool is the fact that they only sell seven weiners to a package. Throws the whole bun thing out the window.

Anyway, please let me know what distinguishes kosher from otherwise.

Oh, nearly forget, can you find kosher in just any store or do I need to look for even a particular chain or health food store?

Love, peace and hair grease.

Nathan

It's a real question of whether or not you want to follow Biblical or Rabbinic kosher. Biblical kosher you can keep with some research at your local food store, where Rabbinic kosher you'll have to go a bit more out of your way, and in some cases go to special stores for things like meat.

For Biblical kosher, you just keep the rules set down in the Torah, most of which are in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14. The research is primarily sorting through the lists of ingredients used in making the food. Remember that almost anything made with gelatin now adays is not kosher, as most gelatin is made from boiling it out of pig bones.

Rabbinic kosher, on the other hand, is dependent on both the Torah and rabbinic halacha, and as a result is a bit more strict (i.e. no milk and meat together). Food must be prepared and/or approved by a rabbi is usually marked by a rabbi's "seal of approval" (for example, the Orthodox Rabbinate's symbol is a "U" in a circle). A good list of them can be found here:

http://kosherquest.org/html/Reliable_Kosher_Symbols.htm

This seal of approval designates that the research has already been done for you in terms of what is right with halacha.

Also keep in mind that anything that's marked as Rabbinic kosher is Biblically kosher, but not everything that's Biblically kosher is Rabbinic kosher.

I personally follow Biblical kosher, because I believe that any form of rabbinate does not have the authority to add additional failsafes (no matter how well intentioned) to the kosher laws already laid down in the Torah. But this is how I see it

Hope this helps!
-Steve-o

 

[Talmidah]

how do I know if something is kosher or not? I am well aware of Hebrew National hotdogs, but that's all I've ever looked for in a grocery store. They answer to a Higher Authority, ya know. The part that I really find humorous and quite cool is the fact that they only sell seven weiners to a package. Throws the whole bun thing out the window.

Anyway, please let me know what distinguishes kosher from otherwise.

Oh, nearly forget, can you find kosher in just any store or do I need to look for even a particular chain or health food store?

You can look for a kosher symbol on the package. Here is a list of kosher symbols: Kosher Symbols There are kosher products throughout the regular supermarket. If you are fortunate enough to live near a kosher market, that would make it convenient for you as well. I buy meat only at a kosher market, but other products I pick up at the regular store.