They need illegal aliens!!

Alot of you aren't eve touching on the subject of compassion, you keep on thinking what is good for me, how will this affect me. Well there are alot of things in life that will not be taken up to paradise, but I tell you how you think about and treat the poor and displaced will be taken up before God and you will be judged. Did not Jesus say who so ever does upon the least of your brothers you do unto me? Remember that this world will pass away and America will burn in flames like it or not, I just believe as christians we should put more emphasis on helping those in need to get the support they need and to share the gospel with them. Compassion is one of the chief things we as christians should give to others and when you say america has run out of compassion or has given enough I need to believe that there are still some who think human life has more value than the value of a dollar.

Agape_ said:

Alot of you aren't eve touching on the subject of compassion, you keep on thinking what is good for me, how will this affect me. Well there are alot of things in life that will not be taken up to paradise, but I tell you how you think about and treat the poor and displaced will be taken up before God and you will be judged. Did not Jesus say who so ever does upon the least of your brothers you do unto me? Remember that this world will pass away and America will burn in flames like it or not, I just believe as christians we should put more emphasis on helping those in need to get the support they need and to share the gospel with them. Compassion is one of the chief things we as christians should give to others and when you say america has run out of compassion or has given enough I need to believe that there are still some who think human life has more value than the value of a dollar.

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Agape, do you not realize that the illegal invasion HURTS Americans?

Where's the compassion?

Are you also ignorant of the fact that the reason that the invasion is going on is because it supports the beast system? Yes, I said it. The elites are sponsoring this invasion out of their globalist (satanic) agenda. As such, you're not only supporting movements of people that will destroy others' countries, but you're also supporting a system, unknowingly, which is bent on diluting the cultural distinctions of nations, all for the benefit of a few elites who become rich through such.

How compassionate.

I'd garner that Jesus would not be on the side of the illegal invasion.

You're also taking a text about the Israelis being brought out of Egypt, and Moses's writings to his people to not be harsh to aliens of Israel, for they were once aliens. I wasn't aware that the writings about the nation of Israel had any relevance to the U.S. of today. Now, I do see relevance, in terms of not mistreating aliens, but I also would argue that if the law says that it is a crime to break into ones country, uninvited, is it that far to see a parallel of obeying the laws of a country, such as immigration laws, to that of paying taxes to the government, as in "rendering to Caesar which is Caesars".

No matter, America is going down the drain quickly anyway so plan on moving to China and becoming illegal immigrants there in the next 50 years.

This forum needs to lighten up, so check this out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YhEl6HdfqWM

Weasel7711 said:

No matter, America is going down the drain quickly anyway so plan on moving to China and becoming illegal immigrants there in the next 50 years.

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No thanks. I'll stay and stand up for my country and my way of life. Unlike you who'll be impotent to the destruction of your country.

China is not very receptive to Christian views.

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

Agape, do you not realize that the illegal invasion HURTS Americans?

Where's the compassion?

Are you also ignorant of the fact that the reason that the invasion is going on is because it supports the beast system? Yes, I said it. The elites are sponsoring this invasion out of their globalist (satanic) agenda. As such, you're not only supporting movements of people that will destroy others' countries, but you're also supporting a system, unknowingly, which is bent on diluting the cultural distinctions of nations, all for the benefit of a few elites who become rich through such.

How compassionate.

I'd garner that Jesus would not be on the side of the illegal invasion.

You're also taking a text about the Israelis being brought out of Egypt, and Moses's writings to his people to not be harsh to aliens of Israel, for they were once aliens. I wasn't aware that the writings about the nation of Israel had any relevance to the U.S. of today. Now, I do see relevance, in terms of not mistreating aliens, but I also would argue that if the law says that it is a crime to break into ones country, uninvited, is it that far to see a parallel of obeying the laws of a country, such as immigration laws, to that of paying taxes to the government, as in "rendering to Caesar which is Caesars".

Click to expand...

Hurts americans? I do believe that americans are enjoying one of the most powerful economies on the planet stuffing themselves with trivial culture statements and useless products all the while turning a blind eye to the needy in all the other countries out there. Maybe americans should be hurt once in a while oweing to the fact that many americans don't even realize how their lifestyle exploits labour and resources from developing nations in order to fuel materilaism.

People in America need to wake up and see that the world does not revolve around you, to you many trivial conforts could feed people in developing nations for months and to simply deny this fact is a err in responsibility. Jesus of course does not condone law breaking but remember that Jesus himself was the biggest lawbreaker of his time because those laws were immoral and contridicted the teachings of God.

Jesus taught us all to love your neighbor as yourself which is the second greatest commandmant he gave to us. Now think about all those suffering out there and are being ignored by people in America, are you really treating them as you would yourselves? How cruel that the Americans not only applaud the shutting down of borders and closing doors to refugees but they also applaud trade regulations that exploit the same people for all they are worth without paying heed to the cries of the mothers and children starving because of being disadvantaged.

The bottom line is that America was founded upon greed, rich people from europe wanted to exploit the people and resources of this country and they did it to the point of extinction. Now Americans still continue on the warpath for almighty profit without any moral objections to how people suffering. You must realize that the thoughtless embrace of this system is what causes people to find opportunities in the first place. Your lifestyle directly supports the oppression of developing countries and their people.

Agape_ said:

Hurts americans? I do believe that americans are enjoying one of the most powerful economies on the planet stuffing themselves with trivial culture statements and useless products all the while turning a blind eye to the needy in all the other countries out there. Maybe americans should be hurt once in a while oweing to the fact that many americans don't even realize how their lifestyle exploits labour and resources from developing nations in order to fuel materilaism.

People in America need to wake up and see that the world does not revolve around you, to you many trivial conforts could feed people in developing nations for months and to simply deny this fact is a err in responsibility. Jesus of course does not condone law breaking but remember that Jesus himself was the biggest lawbreaker of his time because those laws were immoral and contridicted the teachings of God.

Jesus taught us all to love your neighbor as yourself which is the second greatest commandmant he gave to us. Now think about all those suffering out there and are being ignored by people in America, are you really treating them as you would yourselves? How cruel that the Americans not only applaud the shutting down of borders and closing doors to refugees but they also applaud trade regulations that exploit the same people for all they are worth without paying heed to the cries of the mothers and children starving because of being disadvantaged.

The bottom line is that America was founded upon greed, rich people from europe wanted to exploit the people and resources of this country and they did it to the point of extinction. Now Americans still continue on the warpath for almighty profit without any moral objections to how people suffering. You must realize that the thoughtless embrace of this system is what causes people to find opportunities in the first place. Your lifestyle directly supports the oppression of developing countries and their people.

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Spoken from a truly brain-damaged, liberal indoctrinated goon.

I see that the universities have done a number on you. The key is in realizing that these Marxists are full of you know what.

America is not responsible for any other country. However, the U.S. offers more foreign aid that any other nation in the world combined. To argue that the U.S. is not compassionate is to condemn everyone. If you want the U.S. to bankrupt itself, which it already is, then you can go on and talk your talk.

Third world nations are poor, not only because of dictators who suppress the economy, but also because of the fact that the peoples have inherently different capabilities. You need to understand that. No Sub-Saharan African society has ever been advanced. Now ask yourself why that is. Some cultures are bastions of advancement, but others are not. That's the real truth that you need to come to grips with.

Borders are for protecting. Without protection, of which are government seems intent on, you'll become a third world country.

Your call for Americans to suffer disgusts me to no end. The economy is strained as it is, and given our federal debt, trade deficits, "trading" pacts, such as NAFTA, GATT, CAFTA, etc., while it is all being propped up on a fiat money system, it's all going to come crashing down relatively soon. Economists have stated that there is no way that the U.S. can avoid a depression within twenty five years, and the social security system will bankrupt itself, as it is a ponzi scheme. If America falls, so does the world. You need to think about that and your fellow man.

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

You're comparing criminals with innocents? Of course, being from Northern Ireland, you don't quite have to deal with as massive a problem in the UK as we have here in the U.S.

I'm fully aware that the UK (primarily on the main Isle) is undergoing massive demographic shifts via immigration, but comparatively speaking, it's very small compared to what the U.S. is undergoing. Furthermore, Northern Ireland, as a part of the UK, has very little change from invaders, as you don't have a common border with a third world country.

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Actually, the second largest spoken language in Northern Ireland isn't gaelic, as some may think, it's mandarin chinese. Northern Ireland has a bigger problem with immigration than most people think, just because we are an island with no "borders with third world countries" does not make us immune to immigration. don't think that because you live in the good old USA you have the monopoly on illegal immigrants.

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

Spoken from a truly brain-damaged, liberal indoctrinated goon.

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Would you like me to address you in an equal unmannered way? Is this the way conservatives behave?

... and by the way, speaking in percentages Spain offers more help than the US, the UK doubles it, and let's not speak about Norway and Denmark. The US is below the mean of the G7 in Official Development Aid. It is not like it is the meanest nation on earth but to claim it is the most generouls makes no sense either.

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp
http://www.oecd.org/document/40/0,2340,en_2649_33721_36418344_1_1_1_1,00.html

0.29 ODA/GNI Spain 0.22 ODA/GNI USA

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

No thanks. I'll stay and stand up for my country and my way of life. Unlike you who'll be impotent to the destruction of your country.

China is not very receptive to Christian views.

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you take people way too seriously

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

Blah, Blah, Blah, Blah. Don't you get it through your head that some people groups build more advanced civilizations than others, as they have a higher intellectual capacity for such?

It's not about exploitation, whether your liberal mind wants to believe that propaganda.

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And so one has to assume that the egyptians had a better capacitity than the europeans but then it was later reversed?

graysparrow said:

Is this the way conservatives behave?

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I consider myself conservative and I do not like the name calling. There is room for all views in our world. Even when we disagree, we need to respect that the other person is allowed to have their view as well. I think this is an issue with both sides. Everyone needs to grow up a little bit.

That said, the second link you provided stated "The largest donor in 2005 was the United States, followed by Japan, the United Kingdom, France and Germany." I think that is a positive for the US helping other countires."

The other article about promises to the UN seemed written with an agenda. I actually think that the US should pull out of the UN completely. (personal opinion) The corruption there seems to be widespread. The more investigations done, the worse it is turning out to be. The UN wastes so much of the aid given for undeveloped countries, that the US could do better on their own. (I just heard yesterday that a third of the money the UN received for the Tsunami went to high priced salaries and not the people. I do not know if it is true, but I believe it until shown otherwise given the UN track record.)

The article also does not account for all funds. The U.S. private citizens give a tremendous amount of money to help those in need in other countries. I have the philosophy that individuals are very generous and want to help others. If they are made aware of the need, they usually step up and give a lot to the cause. I do not know that it is soley the governments job to assist third world countries. A governments main purpose is to provide security and need to their own people. Yes, the U.S. is wealthy as a whole, but we have our own problems here to address.

It seems to me it is all our own decisions what to do with our money.

So, if someone wants to help the people of third world countires maybe they should stop complaining that the government is not doing enough and do something themselves. It is easier to blame others than take action.

GraceLikeRainFallsDown said:

I consider myself conservative and I do not like the name calling. There is room for all views in our world. Even when we disagree, we need to respect that the other person is allowed to have their view as well. I think this is an issue with both sides. Everyone needs to grow up a little bit.

That said, the second link you provided stated "The largest donor in 2005 was the United States, followed by Japan, the United Kingdom, France and Germany." I think that is a positive for the US helping other countires."

The other article about promises to the UN seemed written with an agenda. I actually think that the US should pull out of the UN completely. (personal opinion) The corruption there seems to be widespread. The more investigations done, the worse it is turning out to be. The UN wastes so much of the aid given for undeveloped countries, that the US could do better on their own. (I just heard yesterday that a third of the money the UN received for the Tsunami went to high priced salaries and not the people. I do not know if it is true, but I believe it until shown otherwise given the UN track record.)

The article also does not account for all funds. The U.S. private citizens give a tremendous amount of money to help those in need in other countries. I have the philosophy that individuals are very generous and want to help others. If they are made aware of the need, they usually step up and give a lot to the cause. I do not know that it is soley the governments job to assist third world countries. A governments main purpose is to provide security and need to their own people. Yes, the U.S. is wealthy as a whole, but we have our own problems here to address.

It seems to me it is all our own decisions what to do with our money.

So, if someone wants to help the people of third world countires maybe they should stop complaining that the government is not doing enough and do something themselves. It is easier to blame others than take action.

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Dear Grace

I am very happy to see that good manners are still alive in these times. For that I commend you.

As for the article while it does offer a good image of the US, however it does not proclaim it as the best donor on earth, specially on public foreign aid. Yet, private giving has also been given its attention, though you probably missed the lasts tables. Which I am posting here






Of course the US gives more than Norway but it is a much larger nation. That's like saying California contributes more to the Federal Treasury than Rhode Island.

The data is not restricted to founding through the UN offices. An organization which, by the way, is an American idea and in which the US enjoys major priviliges most nations lacks.

Every nation has its own problems to care for but I do think we have a basic responsability to care for people so at least they have a meaningful chance of a dign life. This chance is simply not available to many people very often completely innocent. What every rich nation commited freely to share was a mere 0.7% GNP a figure that should have been reached by the 70's but yet it has not been fulfilled except by a minority of contries from what the US is excluded.

So my criticism is of course extended to most rich nations, including my own.

It seems to me that we should also be involved in how our nation spends the money that comes from our taxes and I think quality aid to foreign nations is a much better expenses than big flags, pomp and regalia.

As for the last part I do not see the dicotomy. I think you can get involved yourself in helping and yet demand the same from the goverment.

graysparrow said:

... and by the way, speaking in percentages Spain offers more help than the US, the UK doubles it, and let's not speak about Norway and Denmark. The US is below the mean of the G7 in Official Development Aid. It is not like it is the meanest nation on earth but to claim it is the most generouls makes no sense either.

http://www.globalissues.org/TradeRelated/Debt/USAid.asp
http://www.oecd.org/document/40/0,2340,en_2649_33721_36418344_1_1_1_1,00.html

0.29 ODA/GNI Spain 0.22 ODA/GNI USA

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Hello...anyone home? I clearly stated that the U.S. sends more foreign aid than any other nation in the world, combined. Per-capita or not, no other nation sends as much.

graysparrow said:

And so one has to assume that the egyptians had a better capacitity than the europeans but then it was later reversed?

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Egyptians were not black. That is why I said "Sub-Saharan Africa".

The Egyptians were very advanced for their time, as was ancient Babylon, located in the fertile crescent of present-day Iraq. The ancient Chinese were also advanced. Yet, there has never been an advanced civilization to come out of sub-saharan Africa.

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

Hello...anyone home? I clearly stated that the U.S. sends more foreign aid than any other nation in the world, combined. Per-capita or not, no other nation sends as much.

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Official figures show otherwise per-GNP, not per-capita which would be misleading rate as some poor nations are heavily populated (India, China, Vietnam)

graysparrow said:

Official figures show otherwise per-GNP, not per-capita which would be misleading rate as some poor nations are heavily populated (India, China, Vietnam)

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Regardless, with an economy as massive as the United States, and with Bush spending til his heart is content, any one spending use is going to be an increasingly smaller percentage of the GDP.

I'm not for international socialism, much like you seem to advocate through your wealth distribution system. I'm for charities and aid via private organizations and churches.

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

Egyptians were not black. That is why I said "Sub-Saharan Africa".

The Egyptians were very advanced for their time, as was ancient Babylon, located in the fertile crescent of present-day Iraq. The ancient Chinese were also advanced. Yet, there has never been an advanced civilization to come out of sub-saharan Africa.

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I never suggested that Egyptians were black, even though some pharaos probably were. Anyway there were some advanced societies in Africa, even the subsharian one. One of them was the Christian Kingdom of Aksum, which gave way to modern Ethiopy, the only African nation to survive colonization (except for the brief period of Italian ocupation from 1936 till 1941 after a war in which they used chemical warfare).

That nation had a very tough time surviving the islamic assault for centuries before it had to resist the Portuguese one (ironic)

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

Sub-saharan Africa has not had one civilized, advanced society in history. Meanwhile, European and European-descended culture has boatloads.

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Civilized according to whom? the western concept of civilization? cos that's sooo civilized. Africans have respect for each other, they respect family, tribal loyalties. Walking along a street in any typical african city, they will greet you by clapping their hands to you as a sign of respect. can you see that happening in belfast or london or paris or new york or atlanta.

As for civilizations, check out the "Great Zimbabwe"... ruins of an ancient civilization dating from c. AD 400 - 1500 ie the time when the rest of the world was in the dark ages (and the Irish saved Christianity). Largest ruin in Africa. Please get your facts right.

You suggested a few pages back that if America had been set up in Africa it would be fabulous. That's called colonialism, they tried it a hundred and fifty years ago. White men came and tried to make Africa what they wanted. It didn't work so they split and now the place is a mess. Yes, up sprang dictators, and I am not justifying them in any way, but you gotta remember this is a story written in an african context, not a western one. Things are different. Previously, the only government known to them was of tribal leadership and bitter opression from the brits/belgians/french/portuguese etc. So when the colonial powers gave up and left and left the countries in tatters, natural tribal leaders stood up. To most tribes, the chief was king. He owned everything, and expected the alliegance from the people. Therefore you see characters like Idi Amin and more recently Bob Mugabe. The problem was that when these leaders took chage of nations with huge revenue and riches that they weren't used to they became greedy and thus we have the calamity of modern Africa. Yes i know i'm grossly generalising here, but that's a basic introduction to the confused politics of Africa.

Don't dare suggest that it is because they are less civilized or that they are somehow lesser human beings because they are African.

GeorgiaGuyinAtlanta said:

I'm for charities and aid via private organizations and churches.

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That's great. So what, the churches and charities just raise this aid and dump it on these countries leaving them dependant on us... been done before, it doesn't work

What the third world needs is justice. A radical reshaping of trade laws to allow third world countries to develop their own products, sell them on a level market and build their own prosperity. There's no point in Africa and Latin America, Asia and India being so fertile and producing so much natural resources if we insist on dumping our surplus on them. They will never learn to develop a decent economy if we force them to rely on us. Aid is not enough. Justice is what is needed.

We are all made imago dei therefore we all have the right to be treated with dignity and respect, to be given justice and to treat others accordingly. We are not to be so fiercely patriotic that we do not show compassion to our fellow man. The kingdom of my God does not have boundaries on this earth.