The Trinity

[Jon0388g]

There are a few intricacies within this topic that I'd like to discuss, so I'll write each one in a list - and hopefully we can progress through them one by one.

1. Does the Godhead consist of three co-eternal Beings, equal in nature, purpose and power, or is God only the Father? Do they hold the same authority?


2. Is Jesus Christ the very "I AM," God Himself on earth? If not, was He a created being?


3. Is the Holy Spirit just a term used to define the Spirit of Christ? Or is the Holy Spirit the third person of the Godhead, individual in character and role?


4. Was Ellen White anti-trinity in her early career, and switched to a supporter in her later work/was she unspecific early on, and progressed to more specific statements concerning the trinity?


5. Did the Trinity doctrine originate within the Catholic church?






I'd like this to be a Bible based discussion, with as many texts as we can find on this matter. (Obviously question 4 and 5 the exceptions).



Jon

 

[Jon0388g]

1. Does the Godhead consist of three co-eternal Beings, equal in nature, purpose and power, or is God only the Father? Do they hold the same authority?

When Christ gave the instructions concerning baptism, He stated:

"Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost" Matthew 28:19

This is evidence for three seperate entities of the Godhead. The word "name" emphasises this.


In John, we also find Jesus talking of the "Comforter":

"And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even] the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you." John 14:16-17

Christ said that the Father would send "another". He also said that the world did not know this other Comforter.

Carrying on:

"But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 14:26

"Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you." John 16:7

"Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come." John 16:13

Christ says the Holy Spirit will not speak "of himself." Does this mean the mystery of the exact nature/role of the third is not fully disclosed to mankind?

"He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you." John 16:14

He....Me - does this show a distinct seperateness when Christ was referring to the Spirit of Truth?



Jon

 

[TrustAndObey]

Jon, I may not address all your questions in the right order, so bear with me, I have to get this out as I think of it.

I don't believe Jesus was a created Being (the man portion of Him was created in the womb however). I believe He was with Father God from the very beginning.

I did a lot of study on the spirit when I first started thinking about becoming Adventist and the word "ruwach" was translated to spirit. The Holy Spirit is ruwach as well.

God's breath.

Equally as important to us, and equally Divine....but obviously a completely different role in God's purpose.

Jesus asked Father God to take the cup of suffering from Him when He knew what He was about to endure.

Obviously He would not have asked Himself to take something from Himself.

He also said "not MY will, but YOUR will be done." Father God has a separate will than Son of God obviously because Christ did have to take the cup of suffering. It was Father God's divine plan, and could not be changed.

John 10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Jesus referred to Him as HIS Father as well. His GOD too.

John 3:16 really doesn't make sense if you go with the Roman Catholic view of the Trinity.

There's a lot more I'd like to say, but I'm distracted with a news cast right now.

I'll bbl.