The Simpsons and Quality

[Leprechaunist]

The Simpsons was very likely the best-written show on television for nearly eight or nine years. Possibly more. However, the quality of the show has been declining steadily for at least the past decade. Everything that once made it so wonderful -- its emotional realism, its connection to everyday life, its well-defined characters and world -- is more or less gone now. The dialogue is sloppy, the quality of the jokes is often juvenile, bizarre meta-references are at an all-time high, and the show has not been quotable for years.

The only thing keeping this monstrosity on the air still is the amount of ratings it pulls in. As long as people continue to watch the show, it will remain on tv indefinitely, no matter how terrible it becomes. Is that a scary thought, or what?!

Am I right in my estimation of the show? When do you think the decline officially started? Was it the death of Maude, as so many seem to think? Was it the fact that Homer became a little *too* stupid somewhere between seasons 9 and 12? Was it an inevitable fall, or are today's writers just plain awful?

Or do you think I'm wrong? Is the show still watchable?

Let's discuss the former greatest show on tv and its current quality.

 

[Blackguard_]

Am I right in my estimation of the show? When do you think the decline officially started? Was it the death of Maude, as so many seem to think? Was it the fact that Homer became a little *too* stupid somewhere between seasons 9 and 12? Was it an inevitable fall, or are today's writers just plain awful?

"a little from column A and a little from column B"

I think it was Homer getting too stupid. Early in the series he seemed more lazy (including intellectually) and aloof then actually stupid. For example when he put effort into something like being the Beer Baron or the Capital City Goofball or Plant Safety Inspektor he could even be quite clever.

I think what really killed the show was the simple fact The Simpsons is a relic of the Post-80's Pre-Grunge era( case in point: Bart). So the show stayed funny for the 90's becasue it wasn't far removed from the culture it formed in. But when the 00's rolled around and those darn kids started to equate bizarreness (what they'd likely call "random") with funny, resulting in the rise of wackjob TV like Aqua Teen Hunger Force and most of Adult Swim. This is also why Futurama was good; it wasn't made very far into the 00's.

So those darn punk kids(or whatever turned them into darn punk kids) ruined the Simpsons, as society equated bizarrness with humor more and more, the Simpsons used more and more bizarre humor.

This is also why cancelled shows shouldn't be brought back, because now is simply not then. For example, the new Family Guy has the same problems as the Simpsons. What happened is The Simpsons followed the humor zeitgeist into the 00's and I and many other fans didn't.

If they started writing the Simpsons like it was 1992 again, the Adult Swim/New Seth MacFarlane crowd would complain about it being dull or something since they have a different (worse) idea of humor. If they'd like it, they are either hypocrites bashing it now to look cool or are insane.

 

[Leprechaunist]

"a little from column A and a little from column B"

First off, great reference. You've earned my respect already.

So those darn punk kids(or whatever turned them into darn punk kids) ruined the Simpsons, as society equated bizarrness with humor more and more, the Simpsons used more and more bizarre humor.

You make a really good point. The writing style these days is completely different than in the "classic era." Whereas we once had more organic humor arising from character interactions in well-developed, tight plots, we now have ridiculous pieces of weirdness loosely strung together into plot lines that don't really make much sense.

One of the worst consequences of increased wackiness: a fair amount of jokes in the show these days consists of characters acting "out of character" and doing things they would not normally do. The worst example of this trend has been the bullies, who no longer even vaguely resemble their original roles on the show; but there are many, many other examples, including the main characters -- particularly Marge ("This is more violent than the hip hop awards!")

I think the Simpsons can be wacky and bizarre and still be funny -- provided that the wacky world it presents still has some kind of internal logic and sense of character. The heart of the show was always its well-defined characters and human touch...now that both of these elements are gone, what's left but a husk of its former self?

 

[USincognito]

I haven't watched a new episode in quite a while and while The Amazing Race is airing I won't, but I read a letter to the editor of TV Guide the other day complaining about the same thing. A part of me wants to blame this on the loss of creative writers on the staff. I also wonder if Azaria, etc. are just showing up and getting a paycheck instead of giving feedback to Groening, etc. about the direction their characters are taking.

I disagree with humor being entirely dependent on Zietgeist. There's a reason why Monty Pythons Flying Circus is still funny after all these years despite being a manifestation of the bizarro humor that typified the late 60s/early 70s (think R. Crumb comics). Clever, well executed comedy is nearly timeless. I'm just not sure the writing staff is coming up with clever material and the voice talent is executing it well enough.

 

[Blackguard_]

I disagree with humor being entirely dependent on Zietgeist. There's a reason why Monty Pythons Flying Circus is still funny after all these years despite being a manifestation of the bizarro humor that typified the late 60s/early 70s (think R. Crumb comics). Clever, well executed comedy is nearly timeless.

Sure good humor like good art and music is timeless, but that doesn;t mean the zeitgeist can;t ever have horrible taste.

I guess you're right its not as dependent on zeitgiest (or maybe it moves in waves or cycles like music and fashion?) as I thought, as the "bizarro spray and pray" approach to comedy has been arround awhile, such as The Jerk, Airplane! (a "comedy classic" based on bad puns and sight gags every 15 seconds), and the Hot Shots! movies . The Naked Gun used bizareness a lot better.

And I thought Monty Python used bizarre humor becasue it was British. . Holy grail and Life of Brian minus the aliens was great, but meaning of life and a lot of their skits are just too "wacky =funny now laugh gosh darn it!!" for me.

I'm just not sure the writing staff is coming up with clever material and the voice talent is executing it well enough.

Yes, but its like bad art; if enough of your audience can't tell good art from bad, why not BS it? Perhaps the zeitgeist enables the writers to get by with lazy writing? The popularity of bad music allows musicians to get by with bad music, why can't the same thing happen with TV cartoon humor?

I think zeitgeist plays a role, as the problems of the Simpsons are also in Family Guy and American Dad, and the problems of the Simpsons also are the foundation of Adult Swim's new shows and their popularity, so its not just old fans watching the one show with those problems out of habit/nostalgia/desperate hope it will get better. While it may not purely be the zeitgeist, the Simpsons don;t exist in a vacuum either.

And do you mean to tell me in your 38 years you've never seen something stupid become popular?


Another thought; didn't the Flintstones decline after the show started getting more bizarre i.e. that invisible magic green guy from The Future, (the Great Gazoo?)? Maybe why people notice the problems in The Simpsons but not see the same thing in say, the Adult Swim lineup is because the barrage of bizarreness is a betrayal of the universe the Simpon's had established, but not thats not the case in a new Adult Swim show?

 

[Leprechaunist]

Another thought; didn't the Flintstones decline after the show started getting more bizarre i.e. that invisible magic green guy from The Future, (the Great Gazoo?)?

So join America's favorite TV family -- and a tiny green space alien named Ozmodiar that only Homer can see -- on Fox this fall. It'll be out of this world! Right, Ozmodiar?

It's wonderful the way the Simpsons has always made fun of its own success and inevitable downfall -- it goes back as far as season five, maybe even earlier.

I completely agree that the "bizarre humor" that seems so popular in comedies today is more or less out of place on the Simpsons, which has established itself over the years as character-based and plot-driven. Its humor is best when it comes from watching the characters react naturally to situations.

 

[USincognito]

Ugh. This was the first episode of the new season I've seen and it was mediocre at it best moments. Normally the Halloween episodes are one of the best, if not the best of each season. If the quality I saw last night for a showcase episode was demonstrative of what your average week is like, then I see what you guys are talking about.

 

[bornagainhippy]

still as good as ever. stop ya whinging