The Samaritan Woman at the Well ...NEVER married ?

[TillICollapse]

Seems a straightforward question, I am assuming ...

I have heard some say that the Samaritan woman at the well in John 4 was NEVER married, even though Jesus referred to her having 5 husbands and she said she was not married (which I presumed meant she was not *currently* married at that time). This is how some equate sex=marriage, that Jesus was basically telling her a "sexual partner count" and not an actual husband count.

So how is the conclusion arrived at which says she was *never* married and that Jesus was addressing a sex-partner count ?

 

[football5680]

I do not agree with the "She was never married" view but they might come to that conclusion because the woman says she was not married so they try to think about what it could actually mean if she was not truly married so they think it would mean the different sexual partners.

My rebuttal to this view would be that God does not equate the act of having sex with marriage so she wouldn't have a husband to begin with. For this to refer to sexual partners it would mean that premarital sex would be impossible because you get one free pass and then after that everything would be adultery because God recognized your marriage when you had sex. The Old Testament also makes the differentiation between wives and concubines which means sex did not make somebody your wife or husband. She may have said she wasn't married because she just didn't want Jesus to be in her business. It is pretty obvious that it was an uneasy conversation between them.

I believe Jesus was speaking about her being married and getting a "divorce" 4 times and the husband that she is currently with is not her true husband because God does not recognize divorce.

What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate. (Mark 10:9)

If her first marriage is valid, which means she did not marry too close of a relative and meets the other requirements then her first husband is her only husband. She is not living with her first husband so she was right to say she has no husband. Jesus said it was allowed at one point due to the hardness of the Israelites heart but it was not supposed to be that way. He then says if you get married and then divorce and then get remarried you have committed adultery because God only recognizes the first marriage.

 

[contango]

An interesting theory I heard (and the person presenting it stressed it's a theory, the text doesn't explicitly say it's so) is that the woman was a concubine who had had five husbands but things hadn't worked out with any of them, and now she was living with someone possibly as her sixth attempt.

The text doesn't make it clear either way but the theory appears plausible based on what the text does say.

 

[St_Worm2]

Seems a straightforward question, I am assuming ...

I have heard some say that the Samaritan woman at the well in John 4 was NEVER married, even though Jesus referred to her having 5 husbands and she said she was not married (which I presumed meant she was not *currently* married at that time). This is how some equate sex=marriage, that Jesus was basically telling her a "sexual partner count" and not an actual husband count.

So how is the conclusion arrived at which says she was *never* married and that Jesus was addressing a sex-partner count ?

Hi TIC, I read a crazy allegory about her five husbands being five pagan gods who the Samaritans had come to worship, that the woman actually represented the depraved and sinful Samaritan people, and that the 6th man, who was not her husband, was YHWH. Fortunately for us, "the devil (for those who promote this idea) is in the details" of the Samaritan's actual history.

Aside from that, I have never read or heard of what you have proposed (quite the opposite, in fact). The Lord's words are clear, she had had five "husbands", but the man she was presently sleeping with was not her husband. She then confirms that what He said was indeed the truth (see verses 19, 29 & 39), a truth she was clearly hoping to avoid.

Though not the primary purpose and truth of this passage, I believe the Lord makes another important point for us here by rejecting the notion that when two people choose to live together, it constitutes marriage. Rather, it simply means they are living in sin.

Yours and His,
David

 

[MJohn7]

What makes a proper marriage then? Is not vows?

 

[MJohn7]

He then says if you get married and then divorce and then get remarried you have committed adultery because God only recognizes the first marriage.

That's not what neither Jesus nor paul said.

 

[St_Worm2]

For this to refer to sexual partners it would mean that premarital sex would be impossible because you get one free pass......

The Old Testament also makes the differentiation between wives and concubines which means sex did not make somebody your wife or husband. She may have said she wasn't married because she just didn't want Jesus to be in her business. It is pretty obvious that it was an uneasy conversation between them.

More excellent points ..

Thanks Football!!
(BTW, I hope you are not a Broncos fan .. )

 

[mmksparbud]

The story is in John 4--Jesus asked her to go and get her husband and she said she had no husband--And Jesus said "Thou hast said well, I have no husband: For thou hast had 5 husbands: and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: in that saidest thou truly." John 4:16-18---It's pretty obvious that Christ considered her as having been married 5 times, and the man she was with now He knew she was not married to. I don't understand what the confusion is--Jesus recognized 5 marriages. As it was men who divorced their wives, she was either divorced several times or some of them died. Christ obviously understood she was living with a man now without being married to him. Whatever the circumstances were of her marriages--Christ said she had been married 5 times. There is no mention of her remarriages not being accepted by Christ as marriages. He said the man she was with now wasn't a husband--He didn't say that none of her marriages except the first was the only "real" marriage. He recognized 5 and that she had not had a marriage ceremony with the guy she was now "shacking up" with.

 

[MJohn7]

Marriage ceremonies are customary and have changed throughout history and are sometimes vastly different in various cultures. I dont get so technical and legalistic, i try to look at the heart of the matter, so vows seem to be what constitutes marriage.

 

[MJohn7]

Does God consider an unbelievers marriage valid? How about Muslims, Hindu, or any other religion? None of these were married by a minister of the Church. Are they guilty of fornication or is their marriage recognized? I suppose only God can judge that.

 

[Nanopants]

It's a spell, don't ya know. Say the magic words and *poof,* thou art married. And if there are any doubts, we'll write something official on a slip of paper. Better not lose it >_>

 

[St_Worm2]

What makes a proper marriage then? Is not vows?

Marriage is always, to one degree or another, formal, official, and public, so vows and witnesses, for instance, are part and parcel of all marriage ceremonies. This is all true Biblically speaking as well (where marriage is also considered to be a covenant made before man and God).

Yours and His,
David

 

[mmksparbud]

Christ was speaking to a particular woman, in a particular culture with set laws as to what constitutes marriage in that area and at that time.
Though ceremonies themselves may change from culture to culture, there is always an understanding of what a marriage is and what the rituals are to solidify that union, and what it takes to dissolve that union.

 

[Nanopants]

Where is the scriptural basis for this covenant between man and God? I'm sincerely interested.

 

[MJohn7]

Marriage is always, to one degree or another, formal, official, and public, so vows and witnesses, for instance, are part and parcel of all marriage ceremonies. This is all true Biblically speaking as well (where marriage is also considered to be a covenant made before man and God).

Yours and His,
David

Yes, but still yet, the vow between them and God seems to be what matters most, and the vow between themselves too.

 

[St_Worm2]

Where is the scriptural basis for this covenant between man and God? I'm sincerely interested.

I was speaking of a publicly made covenant between the two getting married, recognized as such both before the eyes of men and those of God. Marriage is not done in secret because it is not sinful, right ..

 

[MJohn7]

I was speaking of a publicly made covenant between the two getting married, recognized as such both before the eyes of men and those of God. Marriage is not done in secret because it is not sinful, right ..

So if a marriage isn't done in front of witnesses its not valid? I think only God can judge such matters. Conspiracies are done in secret, marriage vows are between 2 people, its not like they are marrying the world.

 

[Nanopants]

I was speaking of a publicly made covenant between the two getting married, recognized as such both before the eyes of men and those of God. Marriage is not done in secret because it is not sinful, right ..

Hmm. Ok, let me rephrase that. Where is the scriptural support for a marriage covenant recognized in the eyes of God? Without any I presume you'd have to speak for God to tell me God recognizes it...

 

[St_Worm2]

Guys, I'm sorry, but I have to go. I will get back to you later today (Dv) and answer your most recent questions to the best of my ability .. and hopefully to your satisfaction ..

Yours and His,
David

 

[TillICollapse]

As always, thanks for the responses ... I haven't responded to anyone in particular, since this was more of a sit-back-and-read-what-is-said thread for me. So I appreciate it