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The Priesthood

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WAB

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Just as a bit of background, here are the requirements of the Old Testament for entry into the priesthood for the Jews.

In Ezra 2:61,62 we read… “And of the children of the priests: the children of Ha-ba’-iah, the children of Koz, the children of Bar-zil’la-i; which took a wife of the daughters of Bar-zil’la-i the Gil’e-ad-ite, and was called after their name. These sought their register among those that were reckoned by genealogy, but they were not found; therefore were they, as polluted, put from the priesthood.” (KJV).

Then in Nehemiah 7:64, referring to the same group… “These sought their register among those that were reckoned by genealogy, but it was not found; therefore were they, as polluted, put from the priesthood.”

So we see that if someone were to be accepted into the priesthood of Israel, their genealogical record had to be available. Since the destruction of the temple in Jerusalem in 70 A.D., when all the genealogical records were destroyed, and the death of the priests then living, there has been no O.T. priesthood. And of course as a result there has been no animal blood sacrifice.

In the Revelation (or Apokalupsis, which means: disclosure, or manifestation) of Jesus Christ given to us through the writing of John, we read in chap. 1, verses 5
b, 6... “…Unto Him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in His own blood, And hath made us kings and priests unto God and His Father; to Him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.” (KJV, caps added). And obviously John was still alive at the time he wrote this.

To clarify the Middle English a bit, here is the same from the NKJV…. “…To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood, and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.”

Just who are the “us” that were so loved, and washed from their sins in the blood shed on Calvary’s Cross and have been made kings and priests that the apostle John is referring to? Well, for one, he includes himself. To find out who others of the “us” are, we need only back up to verse 4... “John, to the seven churches which are in Asia…”

The first of those seven churches is “…the church of Ephesus…” (Rev.2:1). This is one of the churches that Paul ministered to, and is mentioned in Acts 19, where we learn that Paul stayed over two years there, speaking boldly, both in the synagogue (for three months) and then “…in the school of Tyrannus.” And of course Paul wrote the Epistle to the Ephesians.



Just as an aside here… in speaking to representatives of the church in Ephesus with whom he met at Miletus on the way back to Jerusalem, Paul says in verse 25 of Acts 20... “And now, behold, I know that all of you, among whom I went about preaching the kingdom, will no longer see my face.” (NASB).

The aside is relevant, because many of those who would describe themselves as “mid-Acts dispensationalists” claim that Peter and those whose gospel allegedly applied only to the Jews, preached “the kingdom” which in their view was solely for those of the nation of Israel, and that Paul never preached a “kingdom” gospel. Paul would disagree.

As a matter of fact, in Acts 14 after Paul was miraculously brought to life after having been stoned and been taken up for dead (vs.19), and then having preached the gospel in Derbe, Paul and Barnabas went on “…to Lystra, Iconium and (Syrian) Antioch, strengthening the souls of the disciples, exhorting them to continue in the faith, and saying ‘We must through many tribulations enter the kingdom of God.’” (vs.21,22).

Then in Colossians 1:13, Paul writes: “He (referring to the Father mentioned in verse 12) has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love.”

And in Col.4:10,11... Aristarchus my fellow prisoner saluteth you, and Marcus, sister’s son to Barnabas, (touching whom ye received commandments: if he come unto you, receive him;) And Jesus, which is called Justus, who are of the circumcision. These only are my fellow-workers unto the kingdom of God, which have been a comfort unto me.”

To return to the seven churches… the second of the seven is mentioned in Rev. 2:8
ff and is described as a persecuted church, and was at Smyrna, which Paul visited on his third missionary journey.

The third church mentioned is the one at Pergamos (or Pergamum), and again, Paul passed through there on the third journey.

The fourth church is located in Thyatira, and is mentioned in Acts 16:14,15... “Now a certain woman named Lydia heard us. She was a seller of purple from the city of Thyatira, who worshipped God. The Lord opened her heart to heed the things spoken by Paul. And when she and her household were baptized, she begged us saying, ‘If you have judged me to be faithful to the Lord, come to my house and stay.’ So she persuaded us.” (i.e. to go to her house in Thyatira).


This too is an interesting scripture, as many dispensationalists deny that water baptism is valid for those who believe and become members of the Body-of-Christ/Church. Paul thought it was.

The fifth church is at Sardis, which is between Laodicea and Thyatira, and since it is only mentioned in Revelation, Paul may not have preached there, but that is not certain.

The sixth church is at Philadelphia, between Sardis and Laodicea, and again, is mentioned only in the Revelation.


The seventh is the church at Laodicea, and we find this church mentioned in Colossians 2:1... “For I want you to know what a great conflict I have for you and those in Laodicea, and for as many as have not seen my face in the flesh…” Although one could come to the conclusion that Paul was including the church at Laodicea as among those who had not seen Paul’s face in the flesh, yet I have three maps (from different sources) detailing the missionary journeys of Paul, and Laodicea appears as a stopping point on all of them during his third journey. Actually, Laodicea and Colossae were very close together.

So… why go through all this? To show that contrary to what many “mid-Acts” to “hyper” dispensationalists teach, Paul preached the same gospel message that Peter preached, and they were in 100% agreement on the issues of baptism (in water by immersion), the kingdom of God, and the priesthood of all genuine believers. (note: I happen to be an Acts 2 dispy).

To get Peter’s take (actually, the Lord’s take through what Peter wrote) on the issue of priesthood, let us look at what Peter has to say in 1 Peter 2:1,2 .… “Wherefore, laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speaking, As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby.”

And now verses 9,10... “But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness unto His marvelous light; who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.” (NKJV).

Who do you think Peter is referring to as those who “…once were not a people but are now the people of God…”? Certainly not the nation of Israel, the Jews, for it does not take much research to find that the Jews were the chosen people of Yahweh. Plus, the Jews had been promised, and had obtained, mercy… multiple times throughout the O.T.


Also, Deuteronomy 32:21 says… “They (the children of Israel) have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities; and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation.” There is no way to legitimately say that God is not referring to a Gentile people both here and in First Peter.

Peter included Gentiles (those who at one time were “not a people”) in his first epistle. In his second letter, he says (three times) in the first chapter, that he is writing to remind his readers of what he had presented in his first letter., so we may infer that he is writing to the same people.


So… what bearing does what we have seen so far have on “The Priesthood Of All Believers”?

First of all, we should know just what the function of the O.T. priest was. Their primary function was to make blood sacrifices to atone for, or provide a covering, for the sins of the people.

Only the High Priest was allowed into the Holiest of All, where for a period of time the presence of God abode. He (that is the high priest) could not enter without the blood of sacrifice; first for his own sins, and then for the sins of the people. See Hebrews chap. 8 & 9.

But Christ came…. “Not with the blood of goats and calves, but with His own blood He entered the Most Holy Place once for all, having obtained eternal redemption.” (Heb. 9:12)

The wonderful truth is, that if we are “in Christ” we have access to the Most Holy Place, at any time, and without any entry fee. The price is paid! That is what our Lord declared from the Cross… “It is finished!” That is the Greek phrase tetel’estai, which means exactly that; the price is paid. There is nothing more that anyone can do to make us acceptable in His sight.

As a result, everyone who puts their trust in the finished work of Calvary’s Cross as the only acceptable payment for their sin is now a member of “…a royal priesthood…” with direct access into the Presence of our Wonderful Saviour and His Father…. (and ours).
WAB


edited to remove smilie which popped up uninvited....






 

TubaFour

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To add to your point WAB, Romans 12 teaches precisely that all believers are priests, who are to offer sacrifices to God.

I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship.

aL
 
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eph3Nine

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TubaFour said:
To add to your point WAB, Romans 12 teaches precisely that all believers are priests, who are to offer sacrifices to God.

I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship.

aL

we are never referred to as priests...there was an entire NATION of them...we are HIS BODY , not His priests.
 
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WAB

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eph3Nine said:
I cant see WAB's post cuz he is on ignore, but anything having to do with the PRIESTHOOD has to do with ISRAEL and NOT with the Body of Christ. THEY alone were the nation of PRIESTS.

The problem being that you tend to ignore evidence that is contrary to your extreme position.

Shalom.... WAB
 
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WAB

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eph3Nine said:
we are never referred to as priests...there was an entire NATION of them...we are HIS BODY , not His priests.

The post that you have decided to ignore shows that you do not get your theology from the Word of God, but from commentaries written by hyper-dispensationalists.

Nevertheless, the Lord loves you too...

Shalom... WAB
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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we are never referred to as priests...there was an entire NATION of them...we are HIS BODY , not His priests.
:eek:
WAB said:
The post that you have decided to ignore shows that you do not get your theology from the Word of God, but from commentaries written by hyper-dispensationalists.

Nevertheless, the Lord loves you too...

Shalom... WAB
Here is one minister in the Lord that preaches no Doctrine but straight from Scripture. He has no great love for the "carnal" church preachings of today, but don't let that deter you from one of the most thorough studies I have seen yet on the Royal Priesthood/Kingship. Blessings.

http://hisremnant.org/eby/articles/kingdom/priest/priestindex.html

..........It is interesting to note that the Melchizedek Priesthood is also a priesthood flowing in two directions. "And Melchizedek, king of Salem, brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the Most High God. And he BLESSED HIM (Abraham), and said, BLESSED BE ABRAM of the Most High God, possessor of heaven and earth, and BLESSED BE THE MOST HIGH GOD" (Gen. 14:18-20). How interesting that Melchizedek blessed ABRAM, and then goes on to also BLESS THE MOST HIGH GOD. God is raising up a priesthood who will not only be able to bless men but they will be able to bless God, for they BECOME THE BLESSING OF GOD, redounding to His praise continually. These are those priests who do nothing of themselves, but fulfill the word, "Lo, I come to do THY will, O God," doing only those things which they see the Father doing. .........

"Thank God, the way into the Holiest of all is open to us, so, 'Having therefore boldness to enter into the Holiest by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way, which He hath consecrated for us, through the veil...and having an High Priest over the house of God; let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith' (Heb. 10:19-22). When the Lord died on the cross, the veil that hung before the entrance to the Holy of Holies, separating us from the presence of God, was rent from the top to the bottom, signifying that the way into the presence of God was now open, so that we as the priests of God can enter into His presence. Under the old order only the High Priest could go into the Holy of Holies, and that only once a year, but now every priest can enter into His presence, and in spirit abide there, but we can also go in and out, at will, to receive grace from God to minister to others.

 
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eph3Nine

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WAB said:
Just who are the “us” that were so loved, and washed from their sins in the blood shed on Calvary’s Cross and have been made kings and priests that the apostle John is referring to? Well, for one, he includes himself. To find out who others of the “us” are, we need only back up to verse 4... “John, to the seven churches which are in Asia…”


Since John is a minister to the circumcision (ie: the Nation Israel) and didnt even KNOW about the Body of Christ, it is safe to assume that the "US" who are made kings and priests refers to the audience to whom he was speaking. Israels "church" and gospel of the KINGDOM was the ONLY game in town...NO MYSTERY Gospel til Paul. NO Christianity til Paul. ALL JEWISH.

So many unstudied folks who continue to drag the church the Body of Christ BACK into the KINGDOM church age....we are NOT an extension of Judaism. NO NO NO.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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eph3Nine said:
WAB said: [/size]Since John is a minister to the circumcision (ie: the Nation Israel) and didnt even KNOW about the Body of Christ, it is safe to assume that the "US" who are made kings and priests refers to the audience to whom he was speaking. Israels "church" and gospel of the KINGDOM was the ONLY game in town...NO MYSTERY Gospel til Paul. NO Christianity til Paul. ALL JEWISH.

So many unstudied folks who continue to drag the church the Body of Christ BACK into the KINGDOM church age....we are NOT an extension of Judaism. NO NO NO.
As far as I know, only messianics do that I think, not sure. That is a whole different "religion", which the catholics appear to want to follow in a lot of ways.

Since I am no longer "jewish" and under "Law", I guess I will go get my Trusty Bible, take out Paul's epistles, and just throw the rest away. Hmmm. Why didn't I think of that. :eek:

http://hisremnant.org/hennessy/list.html
Apart from the Law (3 parts)

...Mosaic Christians are not really doing anything different from what other Christians have been doing for centuries. Which is simply replacing one set of doctrines and religious practices that they no longer consider Scriptural with those they see as more correct. But changing the particulars doesn’t change the substance.

No matter how you rearrange the eyes, ears and nose on Mr. Potato Head, he is still a potato. Likewise, no matter how many doctrines Christians add or subtract, if you end up with a written set of do’s and don’ts to be practiced regularly, you are still clinging to some form of religion!

In the case of these Mosaic Christians, they are simply exchanging a number of traditional Christian practices and holy days they correctly perceive to be of Gentile origin (like the Sunday Sabbath) for a more Jewish expression of Christianity built around the commands of Moses. But they aren’t rejecting religion per se. They are just reorganizing it.....

“Apart from the Law,” means just what it says. It means completely separate and independent from any activity having to do with the Mosaic Law. After coming into the New Covenant through the blood of Jesus, any attempt to return to the practices of the first Covenant (which is based on the blood of goats and bulls, even though not practiced today), could only be interpreted as a form of works righteousness. Those who foolishly think they are pleasing God by doing so ignore the clear teaching of the Bible “that without faith, it is impossible to please God.” (Heb. 11:6) And since the “Law is not of faith” (Gal. 3:12) - it is therefore impossible to please God by the practice of it. By reason of deduction, that tells us Law-keeping will only displease Him. Something only a fool would do deliberately.

http://hisremnant.org/eby/articles/k...iestindex.html
The Royal Priesthood
 
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eph3Nine

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little lambchops said:
Since I am no longer "jewish" and under "Law", I guess I will go get my Trusty Bible, take out Paul's epistles, and just throw the rest away. Hmmm. Why didn't I think of that. :eek: [/unquote]




I dont believe anyone has EVER even intimated that we throw the rest of the Bible away! ALL of the Bible is for our LEARNING, but NOT all of the Bible is written ABOUT us or TO us as the Body of Christ.

The Body of Christ did not even EXIST, except as a SECRET, HID IN GOD since before the world began. The majority of the Bible we study is written TO and ABOUT a PEOPLE , JEWS, and a NATION who God chose out of all other nations. We GENTILES at that time were "strangers to the commonwealth of Israel, aliens to the covenants of promise, without hope and without God in the world". Thats NOT my assumption, but Gods WORD on the subject.

UNTIL Paul there wasnt a BODY OF CHRIST. It was the KINGDOM CHURCH full of jewish believers. The Body of Christ is PART of the MYSTERY information given ONLY to Paul and he was the charter member!

We LOVE the OT as it shows us what Gods plan and purpose WAS to the Nation Israel and how it DIFFERS from the wondrous plan of salvation given to US today in GRACE!


RELIGION is mans way of reaching GOD thru efforts of his own! God only approved ONE "religion"...the "religion" of the Jews, who thot they could meet Gods standard of righteousness thru performance...ha ha ha ha. If the Jew cant do it, what makes anyone think THEY CAN today?

We arent offered "religion" in the plan for OUR salvation today. We are told that Christ did it ALL! Everything is completed that was necessary to secure our reconciliation with God today. FINISHED. NOTHING to be added. Believe it and you will be saved. How EASY is that? No dependence on your own performance, which could never save you anyway, and total dependence on the performance of another.

THATS what we are offered in the dispensation of GRACE...that they werent offered thru Peters Kingdom gospel /ie:Judaism.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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“Apart from the Law,” means just what it says. It means completely separate and independent from any activity having to do with the Mosaic Law. After coming into the New Covenant through the blood of Jesus, any attempt to return to the practices of the first Covenant (which is based on the blood of goats and bulls, even though not practiced today),

The way into the Holiest of all is open to us, so, 'Having therefore boldness to enter into the Holiest by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way, which He hath consecrated for us, through the veil...and having an High Priest over the house of God; let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith' (Heb. 10:19-22). When the Lord died on the cross, the veil that hung before the entrance to the Holy of Holies, separating us from the presence of God, was rent from the top to the bottom, signifying that the way into the presence of God was now open, so that we as the priests of God can enter into His presence. Under the old order only the High Priest could go into the Holy of Holies, and that only once a year, but now every priest can enter into His presence, and in spirit abide there, but we can also go in and out, at will, to receive grace from God to minister to others.
THATS what we are offered in the dispensation of GRACE...that they werent offered thru Peters Kingdom gospel /ie:Judaism.So, please dont accuse us of throwing anything away. We LOVE the OT as it shows us what Gods plan and purpose WAS to the Nation Israel and how it DIFFERS from the wondrous plan of salvation given to US today in GRACE!
I was only kidding about that EPH as I read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation as One Book.

But one verse comes to mind about LAW and GRACE. This kind of reminds me of obeying the Whole Law of Moses or the Whole Law of Christ. Thoughts on this?

Reve 3: 9 "Indeed I will make [those] of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie -- indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you............15 "I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. 16 "So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. 17 "Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing' -- and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked --
 
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eph3Nine

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LittleLambofJesus said:
I was only kidding about that EPH as I read the Bible from Genesis to Revelation as One Book.

But one verse comes to mind about LAW and GRACE. This kind of reminds me of obeying the Whole Law of Moses or the Whole Law of Christ. Thoughts on this?

Reve 3: 9 "Indeed I will make [those] of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie -- indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you............15 "I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. 16 "So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. 17 "Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing' -- and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked --


Gen thru Acts= God dealing with the Nation Israel

Romans thru Philemon= God dealing with the BODY

Hebrews thru Rev= God resumes his program with Israel.

So...my comments would be that these, that you quoted from Revelation, are words specifically TO and ABOUT the Nation Israel in AGES to COME (Eph 2:7). They have NOTHING whatsoever to do with we the Body of Christ.

OUR instructions are found in OUR epistles...the ones written TO and ABOUT us...Romans thru Philemon.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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“Apart from the Law,” means just what it says. It means completely separate and independent from any activity having to do with the Mosaic Law. After coming into the New Covenant through the blood of Jesus, any attempt to return to the practices of the first Covenant (which is based on the blood of goats and bulls, even though not practiced today), could only be interpreted as a form of works righteousness. Those who foolishly think they are pleasing God by doing so ignore the clear teaching of the Bible “that without faith, it is impossible to please God.” (Heb. 11:6) And since the “Law is not of faith” (Gal. 3:12) - it is therefore impossible to please God by the practice of it. By reason of deduction, that tells us Law-keeping will only displease Him. Something only a fool would do deliberately.

http://hisremnant.org/eby/articles/k...iestindex.html
The Royal Priesthood

This kind of reminds me of obeying the Whole Law of Moses or the Whole Law of Christ. Thoughts on this?

Reve 3: 9 "Indeed I will make [those] of the synagogue of Satan, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie -- indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet, and to know that I have loved you............15 "I know your works, that you are neither cold nor hot. I could wish you were cold or hot. 16 "So then, because you are lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will vomit you out of My mouth. 17 "Because you say, 'I am rich, have become wealthy, and have need of nothing' -- and do not know that you are wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked --
So...my comments would be that these, that you quoted from Revelation, are words specifically TO and ABOUT the Nation Israel in AGES to COME (Eph 2:7). They have NOTHING whatsoever to do with we the Body of Christ.
So you agree revelation is about Israel's Demise and not the World? I agree, as it appears to be Israelites who Chose Christ and those that didn't. The OC jewish priesthood is also "absent" today I think. Pretty fascinating book.

Matt 23:38 "See! Your House is left to you a Wilderness;

rev19:3 Again they said, "Alleluia! Her smoke rises up forever and ever!" 4 And the twenty-four elders and the four living creatures fell down and worshiped God who sat on the throne, saying, "Amen! Alleluia!"

Lamentations 2:1
How the Lord has covered the daughter of Zion With a cloud in His anger! He cast down from heaven to the earth The beauty of Israel, And did not remember His footstool In the day of His anger.

Ezra 3: 12 But many of the priests and Levites and heads of the fathers' [houses,] old men who had seen the First Temple, wept with a loud voice when the foundation of this temple was laid before their eyes. Yet many shouted aloud for joy, 13 so that the people could not discern the noise of the shout of Joy from the noise of the Weeping of the people, for the people shouted with a loud shout, and the sound was heard afar off.
 
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eph3Nine

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...RELIGION is mans way of reaching GOD thru efforts of his own! God only approved ONE "religion"...the "religion" of the Jews, who thot they could meet Gods standard of righteousness thru performance...ha ha ha ha. If the Jew cant do it, what makes anyone think THEY CAN today?

We arent offered "religion" in the plan for OUR salvation today. We are told that Christ did it ALL! Everything is completed that was necessary to secure our reconciliation with God today. FINISHED. NOTHING to be added. Believe it and you will be saved. How EASY is that? No dependence on your own performance, which could never save you anyway, and total dependence on the performance of another.

THATS what we are offered in the dispensation of GRACE...that they werent offered thru Peters Kingdom gospel /ie:Judaism.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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eph3Nine said:
...RELIGION is mans way of reaching GOD thru efforts of his own! God only approved ONE "religion"...the "religion" of the Jews, who thot they could meet Gods standard of righteousness thru performance...ha ha ha ha. If the Jew cant do it, what makes anyone think THEY CAN today?

We arent offered "religion" in the plan for OUR salvation today. We are told that Christ did it ALL! Everything is completed that was necessary to secure our reconciliation with God today. FINISHED. NOTHING to be added. Believe it and you will be saved. How EASY is that? No dependence on your own performance, which could never save you anyway, and total dependence on the performance of another.

THATS what we are offered in the dispensation of GRACE...that they werent offered thru Peters Kingdom gospel /ie:Judaism.
Don't forget, they also have no temple or Sanctuary to fulfill the Whole Law of Moses or the Levitical Preisthood ordinances so it is basically a "shell" of the original Mosaic Covenant from Mt Sinai..

Matt 23:38 "See! Your House is left to you a Wilderness; :eek:

John 19:30 So when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, "It is finished! [#5055]" And bowing His head, He gave up His spirit.


http://www.christianforums.com/t2791094-question-for-jews.html

“Apart from the Law,” means just what it says. It means completely separate and independent from any activity having to do with the Mosaic Law. After coming into the New Covenant through the blood of Jesus, any attempt to return to the practices of the first Covenant (which is based on the blood of goats and bulls, even though not practiced today), could only be interpreted as a form of works righteousness. Those who foolishly think they are pleasing God by doing so ignore the clear teaching of the Bible “that without faith, it is impossible to please God.” (Heb. 11:6) And since the “Law is not of faith” (Gal. 3:12) - it is therefore impossible to please God by the practice of it. By reason of deduction, that tells us Law-keeping will only displease Him. Something only a fool would do deliberately.

http://hisremnant.org/eby/articles/k...iestindex.html
The Royal Priesthood
 
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heymikey80

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eph3Nine said:
Since John is a minister to the circumcision (ie: the Nation Israel) and didnt even KNOW about the Body of Christ, it is safe to assume that the "US" who are made kings and priests refers to the audience to whom he was speaking.

John is writing to churches in Asia, not to Israel:
John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace, from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood-- and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests" Rev 1:4-7
Jesus has made us priests. An excellent citation, wab.

Also, John knew about the church as being one with Christ, and thus being in Christ:
I come to You Holy Father, keep them in Your name, the name which You have given Me, that they may be one even as We are. Jn 17:11

I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. Jn 17:20-21
eph3Nine said:
Israels "church" and gospel of the KINGDOM was the ONLY game in town...NO MYSTERY Gospel til Paul. NO Christianity til Paul. ALL JEWISH.

So many unstudied folks who continue to drag the church the Body of Christ BACK into the KINGDOM church age....we are NOT an extension of Judaism. NO NO NO.
Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed He does not say, "And to seeds," as referring to many, but rather to one, "And to your seed," that is, Christ.What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise. Gal 3:16-17
Paul's very well-studied in this area. The promise given to Abraham comes through Christ. That promise is that Gentiles should be fellow-heirs to this one gospel (the message hidden but now revealed (Gk. "the mysterion")).
 
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FreeinChrist

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WAB said:
This too is an interesting scripture, as many dispensationalists deny that water baptism is valid for those who believe and become members of the Body-of-Christ/Church. Paul thought it was.


The majority of dispensationists DO believe we should be baptised. It is the Pauline Dispensationists who have a problem with that.

So… why go through all this? To show that contrary to what many “mid-Acts” to “hyper” dispensationalists teach, Paul preached the same gospel message that Peter preached, and they were in 100% agreement on the issues of baptism (in water by immersion), the kingdom of God, and the priesthood of all genuine believers. (note: I happen to be an Acts 2 dispy).

:thumbsup:

Great post!

 
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eph3Nine

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heymikey80 said:


John is writing to churches in Asia, not to Israel:
John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace, from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn of the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth To Him who loves us and released us from our sins by His blood-- and He has made us to be a kingdom, priests" Rev 1:4-7​


...you take a verse that, to any student of the Bible, is KNOWN to refer to Israel...KINGDOM/Priests refers to the nation of Israel here and in the other Prophetic books having to do with Israel.

Revelation is written for those who are in AGES to COME...specifically, when God is again dealing with the NATiON ISRAEL. WE, the Church which is His Body are LONG GONE, raptured to be with Her LORD in the air.


Jesus has made us priests.


Also, John knew about the church as being one with Christ, and thus being in Christ:
I come to You Holy Father, keep them in Your name, the name which You have given Me, that they may be one even as We are. Jn 17:11

I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; that they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. Jn 17:20-21​


John only knew the oneness afforded to the JEWISH NATION as he himself was not a member of the Body of Christ either! The Body of Christ was a MYSTERY truth ("HID IN GOD and kept SECRET since the world began"), NOT a PROPHETIC truth ("spoken since the world began").

The ONLY plan that John knew about and preached was the KINGDOM gospel/ totally JEWISH in nature and having to do with the LAW OF MOSES...NOT Christianity,but full fledged JUDAISM, all the way!

Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed He does not say, "And to seeds," as referring to many, but rather to one, "And to your seed," that is, Christ.What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise. Gal 3:16-17

The PROMISE had to do with Abraham believing God (what was told HIM to beleive...NOT the gospel of our salvation today of the death, burial and resurrection, but that thru him all the nations of the earth would be blessed)] This is CLEARLY NOT the gospel for today, but the good news given to ABRAHAM, that HE BELIEVED.

The issue has always been taking God at His Word. His Words to US today, are found in the revelation of the MYSTERY givenONLY to Paul.

Take Pauls letters OUT of the Bible and you have a TOTALLY JEWISH book having NOTHING to do with we gentiles at all!

See Eph 2:12 for our status under Israels program if you dont believe me!


Paul's very well-studied in this area. The promise given to Abraham comes through Christ. That promise is that Gentiles should be fellow-heirs to this one gospel (the message hidden but now revealed (Gk. "the mysterion")).

The promise is NOT that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs to the gospel of the CIRCUMCISION...but that they should be made of TWAIN, ONE NEW MAN...the forming of the Body of Christ which before was SECRET, and is now made KNOWN! It is a BRAND NEW ENTITY that didnt EXIST for the nation Israel before PAUL!

THOSE are the biblical FACTS...
 
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heymikey80

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eph3Nine said:
This is what comes of NOT studying to show oneself approved unto God...you take a verse that, to any student of the Bible, is KNOWN to refer to Israel...KINGDOM/Priests refers to the nation of Israel here and in the other Prophetic books having to do with Israel.
It is not the truth, and you have again stated the thing that is not so.

"Any student of the Bible" disagrees with this, if only they read what John wrote. The verses John wrote are all the same sentence, eph3nine. John is addressing churches in Asia:
John to the seven churches that are in Asia:
... He [Jesus] has made us to be a kingdom, priests to His God and Father--to Him be the glory and the dominion forever and ever. Amen.
Rev 1:4,6
Since when did Asia become the 13th Tribe? Is that another conclusion of your impossible scheme of Marcionite Dispensationalism? Of course this is not so. It's simply not true what you've stated. Your knowledge is demonstrated not to be from Scripture, and so not from God.

On directly denying the clear statement of God, Jesus had something to say:
"If you were blind, you would have no sin; but since you say, 'We see,' your sin remains." Jn 9:41
eph3Nine said:
Revelation is written for those who are in AGES to COME...specifically, when God is again dealing with the NATiON ISRAEL.
John denies your statement, and so I consider it another error, trusting Scripture instead of you.
Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is near. Rev 22:10

John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Rev 1:4

I, John, your brother and fellow partaker in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance which are in Jesus ... Rev 1:9
John declares us Gentiles to be in the kingdom.
eph3nine said:
WE, the Church which is His Body are LONG GONE, raptured to be with Her LORD in the air. This, if you had studied and acknowledged the "preaching of Jesus Christ ACCORDING TO THE MYSTERY" instead of according to PROPHECY, you would both SEE and understand.
Hm ... your "long gone" versus John's "The time is near." I see. What you're saying is not what Scripture is saying. Yes. I see.
eph3nine said:
Misrepresenting Gods plan and purpose as so stated in His Word is very serious. Here you are assigning a position ONLY given to the Nation Israel over onto the church which is His Body. NOT only misrepresenting the very God you profess to serve, but not accepting biblical correction for it. This is called willful ignorance and the promoting of a gospel of a different kind.
Indeed, and you are at fault for doing so.
eph3nine said:
John only knew the oneness afforded to the JEWISH NATION as he himself was not a member of the Body of Christ either!
Clearly John the Apostle was an Apostle given to the church.
He gave some as apostles, and some as prophets, and some as evangelists, and some as pastors and teachers, for the equipping of the saints for the work of service, to the building up of the body of Christ Ep 4:11-12
It's is like watching a blind man run around an obstacle course.
More tirades full of sound and fury signifying nothing. You do not pontificate Scripture. Look, you will believe what you want to, I don't care, but don't go putting it in God's mouth. Scripture is God-breathed, and you've made a mockery of Pauline's Dispensationalism (whoever she is) to attempt these arguments, flying in the face of clear Scripture against your posturing again and again and again and again and again ....

Take a step back. Take a deep breath. And take a look at what God is saying before you accuse others of what you're guilty of. Scripture doesn't say you could possibly be "rightly dividing the word of truth" without "Study". It's clear that it's not Scripture you're studying, but some human version of doctrine.
These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me, They worship me to no use, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. Mark 7:6-7
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Revelation is written for those who are in AGES to COME...specifically, when God is again dealing with the NATiON ISRAEL.
John denies your statement, and so I consider it another error, trusting Scripture instead of you.

Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, for the time is near. Rev 22:10

John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Rev 1:4

I, John, your brother and fellow partaker in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance which are in Jesus ... Rev 1:9
Actually, according to Daniel 12, Eph3nine is correct.

The muslims and atheists do bring up the "Time Statements" alot, but since Daniel 12/Olivet Discourse/revelation are on Daniel's people, the jews, anyway, what do we need to fear?

The 7 churches themselves are an interesting study though concerning OC Israel.

Romans 16:20 And the God of peace will break in pieces/bruise [#4937] the Adversary under your feet in swiftness. [#5034] The grace of our Lord Jesus Christ [be] with you. Amen.

Revelation 3:9 "Indeed I will make [those] of the Synagogue of The Adversary, who say they are Jews and are not, but lie -- indeed I will make them come and worship before Your Feet, and to know that I have loved you.

Revelation 1:1
A revelation of Jesus Christ, that God gave to him, to shew to his servants what things it behoveth to come to pass in swiftness; [#5034]

Btw, is anyone here familiar with Preston Eby?

http://hisremnant.org/eby/articles/k...iestindex.html
The Royal Priesthood
 
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