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The "NEED" 4 a God

I would like to ask, why do you need for God to exist?

Why do some people need to believe in a god?

Notice that it is interesting to note that in just about every part of the world from time immemorial people have invented various forms of gods, perhaps to comfort them in trying to settle the unknown.

But today with advanced knowledge about the physical world and answers to many mysteries and finally knowing that the sun does not revolve around the earth or that the earth is FLAT as the Bible, Koran and other scriptures claim, why do you feel you still need a god, or to believe in a god?

Max
 

shunammite

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I believe the desire to Understand is as universal, and as undeniable, as all the other human drives...food, sleep, sex...those are for the body, but the human being is more than a body, every body knows this, "atheists" try to say otherwise, but they don't believe it, lol.

In Frankenstein, the question that OBESSESD the scientist, is "what is life", REALLY? (That is a really GREAT BOOK, btw!) What is the difference, from the moment before death and the moment after? The physical substances are all the same, what is LIFE????

We have a "need" because we hear our clock ticking, and we know our time is limited, and we must KNOW, we MUST...

Not everyone takes the religious route, in their "search for meaning", there are other ways, but all of us are trying to find "the answer", or "satisfaction" as the Stones put it.."I can't get no satisfaction", no you can't, God planned it that way, that way you stay interested until HE says "game over".

"He hath made every thing beautiful in his time: also he hath set the world in their heart, so that no man can find out the work that God maketh from the beginning to the end." Eccl 3:11.

I looked up that word "world" in Strong's, it means something like "vanishing point"...the same purpose as a veil...but also like that white rabbit Alice was chasing...and the theme in the Matrix movies, that key maker is like the white rabbit...or like a mirage, from a distance you think it is "the answer" and when you get there, it's gone...but we can only endure by seeing He that is Invisible, he that endures to the end is always looking at Him.

I have come to see Understanding as another word for Christ..."Wisdom is the principle thing, therefore get Wisdom, and with all thy getting, get Understanding." Prov 4:7. The point of the book of Proverbs is to open the mind, lift that "veil", make the "simple" more "subtle" so we can Understand Parables and Dark Sayings... Prov 1:4...and the Virtuous Woman seems to be Christ Himself, price far above rubies just like Wisdom, Prov 3:15.

But what men do and say in the name of Christ...well they know not what they do, and there's no point hating them, for their blindness. It's rather like hating God Himself, "he that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God", I Thess 4:8. In His Time, everything is "beautiful", in our time, lots of things smell really BAD.
 
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shunammite

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PoliticsForum said:
You had to write all that to dodge simple questions?

Yep.

When I was a child I thought like a child...in malice be ye children, in understanding be men. I Cor 13, I Cor 14:20.

If you want to "win", you have to be as "subtle" as the one you are wrestling with...moreso, actually.

"To give subtilty to the simple, to the young man knowledge and discretion." Prov 1:4.
 
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ZaraDurden

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I feel that a belief in god arose originally from a number of reasons-- few examples-- almost positively things that early humans could not explain and seemed supernatural to them, they attributed to the supernatural (god, spiritual relm). Another potential reason-- dreams-- when people slept, they could see people who had passed on, so they figured those people must be still living some way some where (eternal life).

Similarly, i think people still believe in gods for a number of, although very different, reasons. The main reason i feel is because the human experience is full of pain... "Who would want to lie themselves out of reality? Those who suffer from it." (Nietzsche). No matter what you say, its a calming and good feeling to feel there is a higher power looking out for you and that you are going to live forever. Another very good reason is that people do not want to believe that people in the past, people they may admire, may have sacrificed their lives because of an error... if someone dies for their faith in jesus, who wants to believed they might have died for a lie? That would mean there is no eternal justice...

Which is why i believe there is no eternal justice, nor a god.
 
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whitestar

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Why do you feel the need to prove there is no God? Just wondering...

I don't know that people need to believe in a God...never asked them I guess. I don't think I ever felt I needed to believe in a God....I just did.

Saying life sucks then you die and rot in the ground just doesn't sound too exciting to me for some reason.

I was actually very upset when I found out I was going to have to live forever in Heaven. I thought oh we would live there for awhile then die, die...for good...I still am not sure I want to just go on and on and on...forever. I mean THAT is a really long time! But considering their won't be anymore death, (no losing loved ones) no sickness, no pain, no grief, I figure it won't be so bad. Espeically if I get to dance around the stars....(wish this thing would go back to letting me use the smilies...grrrrrr)

Besides I can't not believe there is a God...not when the proof is in my face all the time. We KNOW there is evil in the world...I think everyone agrees on that..otherwise 911 would have never happened...alot of things would have never have happened...and there is always and opposite to something....what is the opposite to terrible, cruel, merciless evil?

God bless
whitestar
(sorry if I need to be edited)
 
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Techbot

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PoliticsForum said:
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LOL! I don't know who you are talking to. If you are talking to me, rest assured I am not stupid enough to try and prove that that which does not exist does not actully exist.
Yet you say "that which does not exist does not exist"...how can you say this unless you've seen some proof that He does not exist?
 
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The Bible god is a logical imposibility. Read my article "The Omnipotent God?"

"...how can you say this unless you've seen some proof that He does not exist?

Quite the contrary, I have not seen evidence that she exists ;)

and besides, you claim your god exists and I demmand clear evidence not some mombo jumbo circular logic and arguments from mystery. It is up to you to prove your god exists.

Max
 
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Techbot

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PoliticsForum said:
The Bible god is a logical imposibility. Read my article "The Omnipotent God?"

and besides, you claim your god exists and I demmand clear evidence not some mombo jumbo circular logic and arguments from mystery. It is up to you to prove your god exists.

Max
Wow...I've never really met someone so arrogant to flatly say "there is no God"!! Hi!
wave.gif


I've heard atheists say "I don't BELIEVE there is a God" which is a little better suited. There are other logically impossible things in our world. Physics would tell us that the disproportionate bumblebee can't fly. Yet it does.

And I beg to differ. It's up to you my friend to prove He doesn't exist since you're the one making the absolute claim. I have said "I believe" He exists.
 
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Icystwolf

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PoliticsForum said:
I would like to ask, why do you need for God to exist?

Why do some people need to believe in a god?

Notice that it is interesting to note that in just about every part of the world from time immemorial people have invented various forms of gods, perhaps to comfort them in trying to settle the unknown.

But today with advanced knowledge about the physical world and answers to many mysteries and finally knowing that the sun does not revolve around the earth or that the earth is FLAT as the Bible, Koran and other scriptures claim, why do you feel you still need a god, or to believe in a god?

Max
I really doubt that is the correct question your asking, why do you believe that I would want to believe there exists God?
You don't suggest it's genetic do you...lol......

Besides the fact that a lot of people come from different societies, that could have easily been brainwashed to bomb holiday locations just to get into their paradise....I think what your asking is, why is Christianity still increasing in numbers among a society that has a choice on whether to believe or not, and that all have been educated.

I can't answer that fully, because I'm not a representative of all people, but just my view. I believe in God because I can't trust humans. I would much rather trust a church who is a real church, not a wacko churchs that screws children, but a real church. Human honesty in the public domain is not enforced by the law, but a Christian is expected to work through example to people, and hence their honest and godliness is a requirement to be Christian.

But getting on to the "I can't trust humans", I would much rather believe in a greater power, than to let myself go free. Humans can restrict themselves as much as possible, but never the less each and every person will eventually break at least one of the laws or commandments. Athesism is about not believing in God, yet upholding the values...am I right?
But my feelings with upholding those laws are impossible, which is why theres Jesus to makes sense of all things. Jesus wanted all to believe in him because he removed our sins, whilst making a clear statement that godliness is very important.

Jesus makes sense of the whole Bible. It's a solid construct, and most arguments I've seen against Jesus, either leads the argument in the wrong direction, just so that one may win the argument.


The Bible god is a logical imposibility. Read my article "The Omnipotent God?"
Unfortunately, being in the engineering field, I found that time after time after time, logic is disproved by discovery. Engineering uses logic to fix, maintain or improve a system. ....hmmm what does that mean...did I contradict myself there?

Oh no....Logic is not universal, human logic is growing. For every new boundary we conquer, the old logic is broken, and a new one is replaced.For what was impossible before, is now proven to work.

Take forexample, refraction....logic shows that refraction is always positive, based on the conclusion that unless there is something reflecting it, it would never be negative....and with a reflecting piece, it would be called reflection. However only this year, they created some sort of silicon chip, that created "Negative Refraction". But theres nothing reflecting the light, yet it has a negative refraction.......why?....no one knows....

Logically, nothing cannot not reflect light....but it did.......

Logic doesn't prove anything is correct or not.......until all boundaries have been broken, and all surroundings of discoveries have been reached.

Steven Hawkings, he makes assumption after assumption...logically,....until he comes up with some theory. And now he's proving to people that his initial theory is wrong.....
 
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Diatrive

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Techbot said:
And I beg to differ. It's up to you my friend to prove He doesn't exist since you're the one making the absolute claim. I have said "I believe" He exists.
Actually, the BOP is still on you, because you are stating that something exists, he is claiming that it does not.
 
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Wow...I've never really met someone so arrogant to flatly say "there is no God"!! Hi!

I met many people so arogant as to claim to know the unknown :D

It's up to you my friend to prove He doesn't exist since you're the one making the absolute claim.
Please don't presume we are friends. I do not use words like that lightly and you are far from being my friend. I have already proved that the Bible god does not exist in my article, but then again since you are not as strong in logic as you are in "faith" I cannot expect you to understand it either ;)
 
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Techbot

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Diatrive said:
Actually, the BOP is still on you, because you are stating that something exists, he is claiming that it does not.
No, look over my posts here. I said I "believe" God exists. There is no die hard proof I can show you. It is a belief in faith that He exists. Now, PoliticalForum has stated "There IS NO God" leading us to believe that he has absolute proof. From that I say that he needs to defend his position. Other atheists on this board haven't been so blatantly arrogant to make that claim simply because they cannot prove He doesn't exist. Yet for some reason PF states he can. Therefore..through all the talking in circles here...the BOP lies on him.
 
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Techbot

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PoliticsForum said:
[/size][/font]
I met many people so arogant as to claim to know the unknown :D


Please don't presume we are friends. I do not use words like that lightly and you are far from being my friend. I have already proved that the Bible god does not exist in my article, but then again since you are not as strong in logic as you are in "faith" I cannot expect you to understand it either ;)
I don't use the term "friend" literally. Don't take it to mean I'm inviting you for tea. I used it to avoid using other terms that would seem to indicate that you are ridiculous in your views.

I can see by your post here and elsewhere that you are above us all in logic. So seeing that you're Einstein reincarnated, I don't think I stand a chance against your awesome intellect.

I read your article by the way. The one that got shut down and ridiculed for being so presumtuous. Nice article.
 
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Icystwolf said:
I really doubt that is the correct question your asking, why do you believe that I would want to believe there exists God?
You don't suggest it's genetic do you...lol......
No, I sugest that people who believe in god need a crutch for their insecurities and lack of knowledge. People are reluctant to admit that there is actually something they do no know, so they invent crutches.

Besides the fact that a lot of people come from different societies, that could have easily been brainwashed to bomb holiday locations just to get into their paradise....I think what your asking is, why is Christianity still increasing in numbers among a society that has a choice on whether to believe or not, and that all have been educated.
LOL! Christianity is on decline and big time. And there are many closet atheists who do not want to come out because of the stigma and loss in social progress they would suffer at the hands of the godly. But rest assured, christianity is not on the increase by any means.

I can't answer that fully, because I'm not a representative of all people, but just my view. I believe in God because I can't trust humans.
I see. I don't believe in god because some humans like me are superior in morals and integrity to your god and morality and what intelligent humans have been able to prove cannot be denied. A=A not-A=not-A

Your god is a not-A

I would much rather trust a church who is a real church, not a wacko churchs that screws children, but a real church.
I would rather trust logic and reason. they have never failed anyone.

Human honesty in the public domain is not enforced by the law, but a Christian is expected to work through example to people, and hence their honest and godliness is a requirement to be Christian.
An honest christian is an oxymoron, IMHO. To reach any logical conclusion one has to utilize reason. Since godly people denounce reason they are not trustworthy.

But getting on to the "I can't trust humans", I would much rather believe in a greater power, than to let myself go free.
Understood. You need a crutch. I don't.

Humans can restrict themselves as much as possible, but never the less each and every person will eventually break at least one of the laws or commandments.
No clue what this is supposed to mean.

Athesism is about not believing in God, yet upholding the values...am I right?
No, read my signature. and no, the christian or bible values are worthless to an atheist. My morality is superior to the bible's by far. No comparison. I could never justify the atrocities your god can and in this alone I am superior to you, your god and your morality.

But my feelings with upholding those laws are impossible, which is why theres Jesus to makes sense of all things. Jesus wanted all to believe in him because he removed our sins, whilst making a clear statement that godliness is very important.
I think Jesus would be appalled at such nonesense.


Jesus makes sense of the whole Bible.
Sure he does. Obviously ;)

It's a solid construct, and most arguments I've seen against Jesus, either leads the argument in the wrong direction, just so that one may win the argument.
One of the commandments in the Torah says that one will come to do away with the law. Do not listen to him. This is perhaps the only biblical prophecy which did come true, and with all the mumbo jumbo in the bible it may be by accident. But if the OT were the real word of god as you so claim you would be practicing Judaism not christianity since god said not to listen to jesus 1000s of years in advance.


Unfortunately, being in the engineering field, I found that time after time after time, logic is disproved by discovery.
I seriously doubt you knoe anything about logic and reason. And engineering does not deal with "logic" it deal with construct of existing knowledge.

Engineering uses logic to fix, maintain or improve a system. ....hmmm what does that mean...did I contradict myself there?
You are ranting at best.

Oh no....Logic is not universal, human logic is growing. For every new boundary we conquer, the old logic is broken, and a new one is replaced.For what was impossible before, is now proven to work.
How old are you? Do you ever study actual facts or just fabricate nonesense out of divine inspiration?

Take forexample, refraction....logic shows that refraction is always positive, based on the conclusion that unless there is something reflecting it, it would never be negative....and with a reflecting piece, it would be called reflection. However only this year, they created some sort of silicon chip, that created "Negative Refraction". But theres nothing reflecting the light, yet it has a negative refraction.......why?....no one knows....
It must be a miracle. I read the Jurnal Nature and many other scince journals regularly and every week. Trust me, you are ranting!

Logically, nothing cannot not reflect light....but it did.......
Stop smoking that stuff, whatever it is you are smoking.

Logic doesn't prove anything is correct or not.......until all boundaries have been broken, and all surroundings of discoveries have been reached.
No idea what you are talking about. Ever study physics and do you know what The Scientific Method is?

Steven Hawkings, he makes assumption after assumption...logically,....until he comes up with some theory. And now he's proving to people that his initial theory is wrong.....
You are ranting again.
 
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Techbot

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PoliticsForum said:
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No you do not.
and Christians can shoot anything down. They have an answer for everything;)
You're obviously too set in your assumption that you've got all the answers. I congratulate you. Men have been looking for answers for thousands of years, and now you've finally found them. I suggest you contact the local paper. Your next best bet would be USA Today, TIME, and LIFE magazines. They'll surely want to know how you defeated God. Just think. This all happened in my lifetime! Wow..I'll be able to sit down with my grandkids and tell them that I actually got to chat with the man who proved there was no God! I feel humbled.
sleep.gif


Christians don't have answers for everything. That's where faith comes in. Unlike your outright claims of having the answers.
 
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