The Grand Design

[Jazer]

According to Hawking: "every possible history of the universe exists simultaneously." So does that mean there is a universe that exists where Hawkings is a Christian? Or maybe 30,000 Universes where Hawkings belongs to ever church that ever was and believes what they believe?

Does Christianity really offer 30,000 menues to choose from? Hawkings says he believes in multi universes, but he seems to be stuck in one. He only has one menu to choose from and only one special of the day.

If what Hawkings says is true, then there must be a universe somewhere that Hawkings is a born again believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. Is there a way to visit that universe long enough to see what sort of books he would write there?

 

[Wiccan_Child]

According to Hawking: "every possible history of the universe exists simultaneously." So does that mean there is a universe that exists where Hawkings is a Christian? Or maybe 30,000 Universes where Hawkings belongs to ever church that ever was and believes what they believe?

Yes to both. According to the multiverse theory, there is a universe for every possible outcome. However, perhaps it is simply impossible for there to be a universe where Hawking is a Christian, in which case there would be no universe where that happened.

Does Christianity really offer 30,000 menues to choose from?

Almost 40,000, by some estimates.

Hawkings says he believes in multi universes, but he seems to be stuck in one. He only has one menu to choose from and only one special of the day.

Nonetheless, it is reasonable to assume that this Hawking is much like the majority of Hawkings: driven by logic and evidence, rather than a peculiar quirk of upbringing. Most Hawkings, then, would be atheists. Only a few in some very bizarre worlds indeed, would actually be Christians.

If what Hawkings says is true, then there must be a universe somewhere that Hawkings is a born again believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. Is there a way to visit that universe long enough to see what sort of books he would write there?

No, there is not.

 

[FrenchyBearpaw]

IMO, there is no possible multiverse in which Hawking would believe in superstition and magic. He would still think for himself.

 

[GrowingSmaller]

If the classical realm is deterministic then the multiverse only differs at quantum level, right?

I have heard of quantum phenomena influencing the classical sacle (for instance in nuclear energy or cosmic radiation) but wouldn't that make the classical scale indeterminate also, and therefore the original premise wrong?

 

[GrowingSmaller]

Isn't the sum total of all universes called "the wave function of the universe"?

 

[GrowingSmaller]

I just read that New Scientists "Existential Edition" and it says that the infinite energy at the Big Bang means that there are infinite universes, some of them identical to ours even up to the degree where our doubles are reading this post.

 

[British Bulldog]

I don't buy the multiverse theory, it sounds all wrong. I know I'm using an argument from incredulity - actually, I'm not even doing that as I don't have an argument, just incredulity - but it sounds absurd to me that any possible variation of the universe you can think of is existing simultaneously.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

I don't buy the multiverse theory, it sounds all wrong. I know I'm using an argument from incredulity - actually, I'm not even doing that as I don't have an argument, just incredulity - but it sounds absurd to me that any possible variation of the universe you can think of is existing simultaneously.

Any more absurd than the notion of a photon travelling along every path at once, or cats being both dead and alive?

 

[British Bulldog]

Any more absurd than the notion of a photon travelling along every path at once, or cats being both dead and alive?

To me it is. I'm happy that as soon as we interact with a photon it's position is resolved. And I seem to remember reading that the cat example was originally used to show the absurdity of the quantum world when applied to the larger universe. (I may be wrong about that and I'm too lazy to try and track it down.)

Anyway, I remain stubbornly incredulous.

 

[Jazer]

Yes to both. According to the multiverse theory, there is a universe for every possible outcome. However, perhaps it is simply impossible for there to be a universe where Hawking is a Christian, in which case there would be no universe where that happened.

What about Darwin's dilemma? Where the impossible becomes possible. Most Christians believe that if your still alive and it is still "day" then it is possible for this universe to exist.

Almost 40,000, by some estimates.

There are 40,000 variations and you reject all 40,000 of them? Out of all that to choose from you do not find any that your happy with?

Nonetheless, it is reasonable to assume that this Hawking is much like the majority of Hawkings: driven by logic and evidence, rather than a peculiar quirk of upbringing. Most Hawkings, then, would be atheists. Only a few in some very bizarre worlds indeed, would actually be Christians.

Are Hawkings something like Gaga's Monsters? According to Einstein: "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." So perhaps to be driven by the "logic and evidence" that Hawkings is driven by is the cause of his lameness. Or as I use to say his outward appearance is a reflection of his thinking and what he believes. For some this can be a very difficult concept for them to deal with. So I will qualify that this sort of allegory comes from Hurnard Smith. Her conclusion is that everyone will eventually come out of their "lameness" in order to get saved. Sort of a universalism.

 

[Simply_Amazing]

If what Hawkings says is true, then there must be a universe somewhere that Hawkings is a born again believer in the Lord Jesus Christ. Is there a way to visit that universe long enough to see what sort of books he would write there?

Yes and No, respectively.

 

[Jazer]

IMO, there is no possible multiverse in which Hawking would believe in superstition and magic. He would still think for himself.

So there is no excape from his dilemma?

 

[Simply_Amazing]

I don't buy the multiverse theory, it sounds all wrong. I know I'm using an argument from incredulity - actually, I'm not even doing that as I don't have an argument, just incredulity - but it sounds absurd to me that any possible variation of the universe you can think of is existing simultaneously.

The problem with most physics now a days is that they run counter intuitive. (although for thinks like Quantum Mechanics there is experimental evidence)

 

[Jazer]

Yes and No, respectively.

But there are people on this very board that were Christian and now claim to be Atheist. So we should be able to use them to draw a comparison as to what remains consistant and what has changed. Even if we can not find a window into these multi universes. Their zeal seems to remain consistant. As zealous as Paul was to persecute the church, he was just as zealous to defend the church when he got saved.

 

[dustcakes]

It's too bad we will most likely be long dead before we get any type of hard proof for anything like the multiverse, because this is damn interesting.

Quantum immortality is another mind-blowing concept that we don't have any real support for yet, but it's incredibly interesting. It basically says you could play Russian Roulette an infinite amount of times and never die, you would simply be transported to parallel universes in which you live.

 

[Jazer]

IMO, there is no possible multiverse in which Hawking would believe in superstition and magic. He would still think for himself.

So how does that work? For 40 years you believed in "superstition and magic" and then what? Did you just like turn off the light switch?

 

[Jazer]

It's too bad we will most likely be long dead before we get any type of hard proof for anything like the multiverse, because this is damn interesting.

Like so many things in life the only thing we can do is to examine all the variations on a theme. There are some subjects I want to know what everyone everywhere has to say about it pro and con.

 

[Simply_Amazing]

So there is no excape from his dilemma?

Maybe. If you did have enough universes, in one he would be born in another part of the world. Perhaps he would be changed culturally and by his experiences. As long as you have a large enough number anything is possible. (I think)

 

[Simply_Amazing]

But there are people on this very board that were Christian and now claim to be Atheist. So we should be able to use them to draw a comparison as to what remains consistant and what has changed. Even if we can not find a window into these multi universes. Their zeal seems to remain consistant. As zealous as Paul was to persecute the church, he was just as zealous to defend the church when he got saved.

What?

 

[Jazer]

What?

If everyone became a Pirate you would have no producers and there would be nothing for them to plunder.
So most everything in life requires balance. Not to much religion and not to much science.