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In other words you can't prove that there was not a ship there.Yes --- the cloaking device was invented by the Romulans --- in the 23[sup]rd[/sup] (?) century.
In other words you can't prove that there was not a ship there.
Yes --- it was revealed that there was no mother ship behind the Hale-Bopp comet --- nor had there been.
It was reported as a hoax.
So can you prove that there wasn't a cloaked mothership behind the Hale-Bopp comet that we could not detect with our primative instruments?
The Romulans are sci-fi. These people believed the mother-ship would really be there. Surely you don't imagine a civilization with the technology for interstellar travel would be unable to hide their ship from our equipment?Yes --- the cloaking device was invented by the Romulans --- in the 23[sup]rd[/sup] (?) century.
Easy to say.
Can you suggest how you, Inan3, lone message board scientist, would be more believable than the countless serious scientists who have actually done the work ?
I hear YEC or Creationists say the method of determining the age is wrong, but yet none of them can explain why the very same science that underlies this can work for things like nuclear medicine, atomic weapons, radiological studies of all sorts.
But it doesn't stop there. Radiometric dating relies on a type of rate modelling called "First Order Kinetics".
The same type of rate modelling can be used not just for radiological issues but also for standard chemical issues. It is a means of calculating how much of a chemical is left over after a certain length of time. It is applicable to figuring out how long some medicines stay active in the body. How long some dangerous pesticides stay active in the environment.
When someone talks about a "half life" it isn't just radioactive decay.
So, if you want to throw out this particular bathwater, how many babies are you throwing out with it?
Wow, you go out of town for a few days....
And of course medical imaging with radioisotopes uses the premise that the material used has the correct half-life such that it will still be there when the image is taken, and that it won't be there many years afterwards. If nuclear science didn't work properly, we'd either be killing everyone with the radiation, or we'd be unable to get images out of them.
The first order rate law is a very important rate law, radioactive decay and many chemical reactions follow this rate law and some of the language of kinetics comes from this law. The form of Equation 14d is called an "exponential decay." This form appears in many places in nature. One of its consequences is that it gives rise to a concept called "half-life."
(SOURCE)
Let us use the following chemical equation: A ---> products.
The decrease in the concentration of A over time can be written as: - d[A] / dt = k [A]
Rearrangement yields the following: d[A] / [A] = - k dt
Integrate the equation, which yields: ln [A] = - kt + C Evaluate the value of C (the constant of integration) by using boundry conditions. Specifically, when t = 0, [A] = [A]o. [A]o is the original starting concentration of A. (SOURCE)
Thank you for your prompt reply NavyGuy.Except that God left us to live our lives how we choose, i.e. free will. Even if it had been a commandment, we'd still be in this mess of pollution, etc. So you trying to blame God for that seems a little... well, lame. Sorry, not trying to flame, but that's my thought on it.
But you're using the Old Testament. Some things in the OT were kinda.... obsolete once the NT came in. Like not being able to eat certain things considered unclean. Until God ok'd it with Peter in the NT.
1 The LORD said to Moses,
2 "Speak to the entire assembly of Israel and say to them: 'Be holy because I, the LORD your God, am holy.
3 " 'Each of you must respect his mother and father, and you must observe my Sabbaths. I am the LORD your God.
4 " 'Do not turn to idols or make gods of cast metal for yourselves. I am the LORD your God.
5 " 'When you sacrifice a fellowship offering to the LORD, sacrifice it in such a way that it will be accepted on your behalf. 6 It shall be eaten on the day you sacrifice it or on the next day; anything left over until the third day must be burned up.
7 If any of it is eaten on the third day, it is impure and will not be accepted.
8 Whoever eats it will be held responsible because he has desecrated what is holy to the LORD; that person must be cut off from his people.
9 " 'When you reap the harvest of your land, do not reap to the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest.
10 Do not go over your vineyard a second time or pick up the grapes that have fallen. Leave them for the poor and the alien. I am the LORD your God.
11 " 'Do not steal.
" 'Do not lie.
" 'Do not deceive one another.
12 " 'Do not swear falsely by my name and so profane the name of your God. I am the LORD.
13 " 'Do not defraud your neighbor or rob him.
" 'Do not hold back the wages of a hired man overnight.
14 " 'Do not curse the deaf or put a stumbling block in front of the blind, but fear your God. I am the LORD.
15 " 'Do not pervert justice; do not show partiality to the poor or favoritism to the great, but judge your neighbor fairly.
16 " 'Do not go about spreading slander among your people.
" 'Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.
17 " 'Do not hate your brother in your heart. Rebuke your neighbor frankly so you will not share in his guilt.
18 " 'Do not seek revenge or bear a grudge against one of your people, but love your neighbor as yourself. I am the LORD.
19 " 'Keep my decrees.
" 'Do not mate different kinds of animals.
" 'Do not plant your field with two kinds of seed.
" 'Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material.
20 " 'If a man sleeps with a woman who is a slave girl promised to another man but who has not been ransomed or given her freedom, there must be due punishment. Yet they are not to be put to death, because she had not been freed.
21 The man, however, must bring a ram to the entrance to the Tent of Meeting for a guilt offering to the LORD.
22 With the ram of the guilt offering the priest is to make atonement for him before the LORD for the sin he has committed, and his sin will be forgiven.
23 " 'When you enter the land and plant any kind of fruit tree, regard its fruit as forbidden. For three years you are to consider it forbidden; it must not be eaten.
24 In the fourth year all its fruit will be holy, an offering of praise to the LORD.
25 But in the fifth year you may eat its fruit. In this way your harvest will be increased. I am the LORD your God.
26 " 'Do not eat any meat with the blood still in it.
'Do not practice divination or sorcery.
27 " 'Do not cut the hair at the sides of your head or clip off the edges of your beard.
28 " 'Do not cut your bodies for the dead or put tattoo marks on yourselves. I am the LORD.
29 " 'Do not degrade your daughter by making her a prostitute, or the land will turn to prostitution and be filled with wickedness.
30 " 'Observe my Sabbaths and have reverence for my sanctuary. I am the LORD.
31 " 'Do not turn to mediums or seek out spiritists, for you will be defiled by them. I am the LORD your God.
32 " 'Rise in the presence of the aged, show respect for the elderly and revere your God. I am the LORD.
33 " 'When an alien lives with you in your land, do not mistreat him.
34 The alien living with you must be treated as one of your native-born. Love him as yourself, for you were aliens in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.
35 " 'Do not use dishonest standards when measuring length, weight or quantity.
36 Use honest scales and honest weights, an honest ephah and an honest hin. I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt.
37 " 'Keep all my decrees and all my laws and follow them. I am the LORD.'
Hey Dukes, where did you go?
Guess we're not discussing "The Flood" anymore.
My inclusion of this site ="http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/04/03/collins.commentary/index.html" was not to challenge you or atheism but to merely answer your question (above) "why doesn't God speak to scientists", of which I answered "I think He does."So if God can "speak" to you in a way you understand, and you don't care about science, why doesn't he "speak" to scientists like me in a way I understand?
Originally Posted by article
But reason alone cannot prove the existence of God. Faith is reason plus revelation, and the revelation part requires one to think with the spirit as well as with the mind. You have to hear the music, not just read the notes on the page. Ultimately, a leap of faith is required.Revelation is exceedingly weak. I've known someone who had extremely strong revelations that he "programmed their dental work into a television set" and would sit for hours with the remote trying to "unprogram" the false teeth from the TV set (yes, it's a true story, my dad did this very thing when he started having small strokes which ultimately robbed him of his mind.)
Revelation? No, what Collins seems to be thinking about here is "feelings". I love music. My brain is wired for it. I'm not a good musician but I can listen to music for hours. Most humans can do this. It "feels good" to us. It is how our brains are wired. Nothing supernatural. The well-placed scalpel in the quick hands of a doctor and I bet I'd wind up completely incapable of understanding music. But I bet I'd love to talk to ice cream.
And here I applaud Dr. Collins. I give him a standing ovation.
Fair enough on the quote from Matthew.
But Daniel 5:2 doesn't call Belshazzar "the son of Nebuchadnezzar", it refers to Nebuchadnezzar as the "father" of Belshazzar.
Can you point to conditions in the Bible where "father" is used as anything but the direct male predecessor?
Of course "father" is used in reference to God quite a bit. But I don't think Danile 5:2 is supposed to indicate that Nebuchadnezzar was Belshazzar's god.
But again, without external information to the contrary, one would assume Belshazzar was born from the union of Nebuchadnezzar and his wife Mrs. Nebuchadnezzar.
It requires additional information to discern the real truth and to let us know that the words of the Bible do not give an accurate enough picture to draw a correct conclusion from.
And that is the main point I was making.
Thank you for your prompt reply NavyGuy.
However, I believe you completely skated around the question. Unlike AV, who tried to dismiss it as out of context.
So I shall put it into context:
Leviticus 19 (New International Version)
So please, show me where it is out of context.
And then explain why you do not follow these laws as god dictated them.
And remember, the OT is was not overturned by Jesus, he was there to fulfill it. He said so himself.
Gen 4:20 & 21
Gen 17:5
Gen 19:38
Gen 28:10 -13
Gen 32:9Gen 32:9 And Jacob said, O God of my father Abraham, and God of my father Isaac, the LORD which saidst unto me, Return unto thy country, and to thy kindred, and I will deal well with thee:
There are more but I am too tired to keep looking.
What your father was experiencing was not revelation. It was a confusion in his brain brought on by his stroke. A biblical revelation is defined in the Greek as:
1) laying bare, making naked
2) a disclosure of truth, instruction
a) concerning things before unknown
b) used of events by which things or states or persons hitherto withdrawn from view are made visible to all
3) manifestation, appearance
It is something not known or understood before coming to light.
Total misunderstanding of the meaning which I will have to explain at another time.
Easy to say.
Can you suggest how you, Inan3, lone message board scientist, would be more believable than the countless serious scientists who have actually done the work ?
I hear YEC or Creationists say the method of determining the age is wrong, but yet none of them can explain why the very same science that underlies this can work for things like nuclear medicine, atomic weapons, radiological studies of all sorts.
But it doesn't stop there. Radiometric dating relies on a type of rate modelling called "First Order Kinetics".
The same type of rate modelling can be used not just for radiological issues but also for standard chemical issues. It is a means of calculating how much of a chemical is left over after a certain length of time. It is applicable to figuring out how long some medicines stay active in the body. How long some dangerous pesticides stay active in the environment.
When someone talks about a "half life" it isn't just radioactive decay.
So, if you want to throw out this particular bathwater, how many babies are you throwing out with it?
Well maybe after the first thousand years it goes askew!
I don't really know about any of this and just because you have cited a few things does not mean that I know any more. I would have to know all the perameters involved. Then I could only make a guess but I do know that something is amuck in scienceland because there is no way that the earth is 4.5 billion years old, maybe 3.78 but certainly not 4.5.
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