The Deception of Evolution and the Fossil Sequence

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
There's a therapeutic reason for all those posts.

And for his "likes"? It really doesn't bother me that he does this. It is when he tries to use his number of posts as some sort of validation when he encounters new people here that is wrong. I know that he did it to me when I first showed up, I have seen him do it to others.

And AV would have quite a few posts if he did not participate in such activity. I am sure that his real number of posts, those not found in that counting list, would be over 100,000 by now. It is sad that he feels a need to do this and then tries to use those numbers to give his regular posts some credentials.

lifepsyop · May 31, 2015

Colter said:
Atheist may have created a religion out of their doctrines of doubt, using scientific theory as "fact" in order to buttress their contentions, but that doesn't mean that their observations about a very old earth with layers of history in the archeological record are all wrong, just that the evidence conflicts with Bronze Age creation stories. Babylon was an entirely different age.

Interesting how the Babylonian cultures were all obsessed with the idea of a pantheon of sun and moon and other nature gods.

Yet the Biblical creation story stands uniquely apart from them, stating clearly that there is one creator God and objects in the heavens and the earth are but created things, not to be worshiped.

Doesn't seem to fit your theory that the Genesis writers were just going with the popular fads of their time.

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

lifepsyop said:
Interesting how the Babylonian cultures were all obsessed with the idea of a pantheon of sun and moon and other nature gods.

Yet the Biblical creation story stands uniquely apart from them, stating clearly that there is one creator God and objects in the heavens and the earth are but created things, not to be worshiped.

Doesn't seem to fit your theory that the Genesis writers were just going with the popular fads of their time.

Historians disagree. The early Hebrews "evolved" from a multi-god belief to a montheistic view. They did not start out that way:

http://jewsforjesus.org/publications/issues/v05-n05/monotheism

MoreCoffee · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
And for his "likes"? It really doesn't bother me that he does this. It is when he tries to use his number of posts as some sort of validation when he encounters new people here that is wrong. I know that he did it to me when I first showed up, I have seen him do it to others.

And AV would have quite a few posts if he did not participate in such activity. I am sure that his real number of posts, those not found in that counting list, would be over 100,000 by now. It is sad that he feels a need to do this and then tries to use those numbers to give his regular posts some credentials.

I've not seen him do any such thing.

lifepsyop · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
That type of sorting occurs only at deltas.

That type of sorting occurs when sediments are transported and deposited in water currents. Just as you've seen with your own eyes. Hand-wave all you want.

Subduction Zone said:
I tell you what, when they get a peer reviewed article published with their claims then you will have something. Sadly you have been fooled by crackpots.

Oh look, more insults and baseless accusations from SZ.

Those sedimentology experiments have been published in secular peer-reviewed journals for decades. Here are your "crackpots". Guy Berthault is the scientist conducting the flume experiments. Here is some of the literature he and others have published on the subject.

Berthault, G. : Orogenesis: Cause of sedimentary formations – Kazan Golovkinsy Stratigraphic Meeting, 2014, pp.19-20
Lalomov, A., Berthault G., Tugarova, M., Isotov V., Sitdikova L.: Reconstruction of sedimentary conditions of Middle Permian Kama-Ural basin studied by N.A.Golovkinsky – Kazan Golovkinsy Stratigraphic Meeting, 2014, pp.53-54
Berthault, G. : Orogenesis: cause of sedimentary formations – “Open Journal of Geology“ ISSN 2161-7570.Vol 3, Number 28, April 2013.
Berthault G. : Towards a Refoundation of Historical Geology – “Georesources” 1(12) 2012, p.38, 39
Berthault, G., Lalomov, A. V. and Tugarova, M. A. : Reconstruction of paleolithodynamic formation conditions of Cambrian-Ordovician sandstones in the Northwestern Russian platform – “Lithology and Mineral Resources, 2011, Volume 46, Number 1, 60-70″ (Springer Publishing site)
Berthault, G., Veksler A.B., Donenberg V.M. , Lalomov A. : RESEARCH on EROSION OF CONSOLIDATED and semi-consolidated SOILS BY HIGH SPEED WATER FLOW Izvestia.VNIIG., 2010, Vol. 257, pp.10-22. – (Russian original.)
Berthault, G : Sedimentological Interpretation of the Tonto Group Stratigraphy (Grand Canyon Colorado River) (pdf document), Lithology and Mineral Resources 2004, Vol. 39, No 5. October 2004.
Berthault G., Analysis of Main Principles of Stratigraphy on the Basis of Experimental Data, Litol.Polezn.Iskop.2002, vol 37, no.5,pp 509-515 (Lithology and Mineral resources 2002 (fac-similé) (Engl.Transl.), vol.37, no.5, pp442-446), Journal of the Academy of Sciences of Russia.
Julien, P.Y., Lan, Y., and Berthault, G., Experiments on Stratification of Heterogeneous Sand Mixtures, Bulletin Société Géologique de France, 1993, vol. 164, no. 5, pp. 649–660.
Berthault, G., Sedimentation of a Heterogranular Mixture. Experimental Lamination in Still and Running Water, Compte rendu de l’Académie des Sciences 1988, vol. 306, Serie II, pp. 717–724.
Berthault, G., Sedimentologie: Expériences sur la lamination des sédiments par granoclassement périodique postérieur au dépôt. Contribution a l’explication de la lamination dans nombre de sédiments et de roches sédimentaires., Compte rendu de l’Académie des Sciences de Paris 1986 , vol. 303, Ser., 2, no. 17, pp. 1569-1574.

http://www.sedimentology.fr/

lifepsyop · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
Historians disagree. The early Hebrews "evolved" from a multi-god belief to a montheistic view. They did not start out that way:

http://jewsforjesus.org/publications/issues/v05-n05/monotheism

Nice red herring attempt, but we were talking about what the Bible actually says.

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
I've not seen him do any such thing.

I have. As I said, he tried that tactic on me when I was a Noob here and I have seem him do the same to others. He typically asks people if they have noticed his post count, the implication being that he has some sort of authority due to that high number.

florida2 · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
I've not seen him do any such thing.

He did it to me just a few months ago. I asked a certain poster with an obsession on EU theory not to derail another thread and AV basically said my opinion wasn't valid because he had many more posts than me.

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

lifepsyop said:
Nice red herring attempt, but we were talking about what the Bible actually says.

That was not a red herring. It is strange that most creationists do not know how to use terms properly. You were trying to equate the Bible with what the Hebrews believed. by comparing the Bible to Babylonian beliefs. The Bible is a much more recent book than you seem to think it is. The writings still have traces of polythism in it.

MoreCoffee · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
I have. As I said, he tried that tactic on me when I was a Noob here and I have seem him do the same to others. He typically asks people if they have noticed his post count, the implication being that he has some sort of authority due to that high number.

florida2 said:
He did it to me just a few months ago. I asked a certain poster with an obsession on EU theory not to derail another thread and AV basically said my opinion wasn't valid because he had many more posts than me.

I've not seen him do any such thing. He's always been good humoured in my experience, well mannered, interesting and decent.

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

lifepsyop said:
That type of sorting occurs when sediments are transported and deposited in water currents. Just as you've seen with your own eyes. Hand-wave all you want.

Again, there was no hand waving. You are once again projecting your behavior upon others.

Oh look, more insults and baseless accusations from SZ.

Those sedimentology experiments have been published in secular peer-reviewed journals for decades. Here are your "crackpots". Guy Berthault is the scientist conducting the flume experiments. Here is some of the literature he and others have published on the subject.

Berthault, G. : Orogenesis: Cause of sedimentary formations – Kazan Golovkinsy Stratigraphic Meeting, 2014, pp.19-20
Lalomov, A., Berthault G., Tugarova, M., Isotov V., Sitdikova L.: Reconstruction of sedimentary conditions of Middle Permian Kama-Ural basin studied by N.A.Golovkinsky – Kazan Golovkinsy Stratigraphic Meeting, 2014, pp.53-54
Berthault, G. : Orogenesis: cause of sedimentary formations – “Open Journal of Geology“ ISSN 2161-7570.Vol 3, Number 28, April 2013.
Berthault G. : Towards a Refoundation of Historical Geology – “Georesources” 1(12) 2012, p.38, 39
Berthault, G., Lalomov, A. V. and Tugarova, M. A. : Reconstruction of paleolithodynamic formation conditions of Cambrian-Ordovician sandstones in the Northwestern Russian platform – “Lithology and Mineral Resources, 2011, Volume 46, Number 1, 60-70″ (Springer Publishing site)
Berthault, G., Veksler A.B., Donenberg V.M. , Lalomov A. : RESEARCH on EROSION OF CONSOLIDATED and semi-consolidated SOILS BY HIGH SPEED WATER FLOW Izvestia.VNIIG., 2010, Vol. 257, pp.10-22. – (Russian original.)
Berthault, G : Sedimentological Interpretation of the Tonto Group Stratigraphy (Grand Canyon Colorado River) (pdf document), Lithology and Mineral Resources 2004, Vol. 39, No 5. October 2004.
Berthault G., Analysis of Main Principles of Stratigraphy on the Basis of Experimental Data, Litol.Polezn.Iskop.2002, vol 37, no.5,pp 509-515 (Lithology and Mineral resources 2002 (fac-similé) (Engl.Transl.), vol.37, no.5, pp442-446), Journal of the Academy of Sciences of Russia.
Julien, P.Y., Lan, Y., and Berthault, G., Experiments on Stratification of Heterogeneous Sand Mixtures, Bulletin Société Géologique de France, 1993, vol. 164, no. 5, pp. 649–660.
Berthault, G., Sedimentation of a Heterogranular Mixture. Experimental Lamination in Still and Running Water, Compte rendu de l’Académie des Sciences 1988, vol. 306, Serie II, pp. 717–724.
Berthault, G., Sedimentologie: Expériences sur la lamination des sédiments par granoclassement périodique postérieur au dépôt. Contribution a l’explication de la lamination dans nombre de sédiments et de roches sédimentaires., Compte rendu de l’Académie des Sciences de Paris 1986 , vol. 303, Ser., 2, no. 17, pp. 1569-1574.

http://www.sedimentology.fr/

Wrong again, none of the articles that I went to were from a well respected peer reviewed journal. In fact many of them were not from the source sited. They were stand alone articles that were put on the internet by some fan of this kook. And pointing out that a nut is a nut is not a baseless accusation. He has no articles of merit. He cannot find any support of his ideas in the world of science. Instead of running a Gish on me why not link his "best" article. If you Gish I will simply point out that is your sin and leave it at that.

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
I've not seen him do any such thing. He's always been good humoured in my experience, well mannered, interesting and decent.

That is only because he agrees with you and you have ignored when he has done this. If you ask member after member that supports science I am betting that many newer member will say that same.

MoreCoffee · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
That is only because he agrees with you and you have ignored when he has done this. If you ask member after member that supports science I am betting that many newer member will say that same.

Bad reports about people need to be substantiated. If you want to speak ill of AV1611VET without substantiating your claims it reflects poorly on your claims.

Subduction Zone · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
Bad reports about people need to be substantiated. If you want to speak ill of AV1611VET without substantiating your claims it reflects poorly on your claims.

You have seen two posters already say that this behavior happened to them, mine and one other. And that is from just he few people that have seen this thread in the last few minutes. Think of how many would testify to this if you had a thread on this. Also, how do you explain his almost instant 2,000 likes. I know that having a sock puppet is against the rules here from personal experience, yep I broke that rule once. To me a sock is the only explanation for such growth.

But I will let the subject go for now. I responded because you tried to say that my claim was unsubstantiated. I did not appreciate that.

AV1611VET · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
I have. As I said, he tried that tactic on me when I was a Noob here and I have seem him do the same to others. He typically asks people if they have noticed his post count, the implication being that he has some sort of authority due to that high number.

Why don't you tell the whole story?

Colter · May 31, 2015

lifepsyop said:
Interesting how the Babylonian cultures were all obsessed with the idea of a pantheon of sun and moon and other nature gods.

Yet the Biblical creation story stands uniquely apart from them, stating clearly that there is one creator God and objects in the heavens and the earth are but created things, not to be worshiped.

Doesn't seem to fit your theory that the Genesis writers were just going with the popular fads of their time.

I didn't say or even allude to the idea that the Hebrew redactors were appeasing fads in there time, they were writing to the Israelite audience who were again in captivity, without a homeland. The OT books would be in reaction to circumstances which seemed contrary to their faith in the God of Moses.

AV1611VET · May 31, 2015

florida2 said:
He did it to me just a few months ago. I asked a certain poster with an obsession on EU theory not to derail another thread and AV basically said my opinion wasn't valid because he had many more posts than me.

Link please?

AV1611VET · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
I've not seen him do any such thing. He's always been good humoured in my experience, well mannered, interesting and decent.

I'll bring up my post count if someone comes here telling me I've never apologized for this or that, or I've never admitted I was wrong, or I never [whatever].

Those kinds of false accusations will usually get a response of that nature from me.

I would expect the same if I went to another site and told someone I had never met before that he has never said or done this or that -- even if, by coincidence, I was right.

Even if he only has 50 posts, I wouldn't think of telling him he never apologized or admitted he was wrong about something.

That's presumptuous.

AV1611VET · May 31, 2015

MoreCoffee said:
Bad reports about people need to be substantiated. If you want to speak ill of AV1611VET without substantiating your claims it reflects poorly on your claims.

He won't.

I guarantee it.

He can't.

AV1611VET · May 31, 2015

Subduction Zone said:
But I will let the subject go for now. I responded because you tried to say that my claim was unsubstantiated. I did not appreciate that.

Then I'll say it.

Your claim is unsubstantiated.

Yes, I've mentioned my post count before, but only to counter a false accusation.

Again, let's see a link to the whole story please.

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