The Beloved Disciple

[twinc]

according to scriptures who was he and according to you why was he more beloved than all the others - twinc

 

[mog144]

according to scriptures who was he and according to you why was he more beloved than all the others - twinc

Can you please provide the Scriptural references to this question? Thanks

 

[twinc]

Can you please provide the Scriptural references to this question? Thanks

it is mentioned more than once but just try Jn.19:26 and 20:2-4-8 and 21:7&20 - twinc

 

[Unix]

I think the beloved disciple who wrote the Gospel according to Jn, was Lazarus.
Jn 11:33-36: When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who came with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled; and he said, “Where have you laid him?” They said to him, “Lord, come and see.” Jesus wept. So the Jews said, “See how he loved him!”

try Jn.19:26 and 20:2-4-8 and 21:7&20 - twinc

 

[Forge3]

I think the beloved disciple who wrote the Gospel according to Jn, was Lazarus.
Jn 11:33-36: When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who came with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled; and he said, “Where have you laid him?” They said to him, “Lord, come and see.” Jesus wept. So the Jews said, “See how he loved him!”

Never thought of that before. I thought it was John actually. I like John as he seems to speak more of love and mercy than the others

 

[twinc]

Never thought of that before. I thought it was John actually. I like John as he seems to speak more of love and mercy than the others

be it John or Lazarus or whoever else why beloved more than others even Peter "lovest thou me more than these" etc - twinc

 

[ChristianT]

be it John or Lazarus or whoever else why beloved more than others even Peter "lovest thou me more than these" etc - twinc

It was probably an idiom used to make the author anonymous. Whether it was John, Lazarus, or Peter, you must remember that Christianity was considered a sect of Judaism and would have been really persecuted (evidenced in Acts when the first Christian martyr - post Jesus - Stephen, was made). This would have caused the gospel writer to want to remain anonymous if s/he wanted to remain alive to share the gospel. Of course this is just one theory.

 

[Radagast]

according to scriptures who was he and according to you why was he more beloved than all the others - twinc

Traditionally it's taken to be John. The main argument is that the other gospels tell us that John was one of the most important disciples (with Peter and James). If John was not the 'beloved disciple," then he doesn't appear at all, which is not reasonable.

 

[L0NEW0LF]

It's not Peter because: John Chapter 21, Verse 7: "Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved saith unto Peter..."

And it's John because: John Chapter 21, Verse 24: "This is the disciple that testifieth of these things, and wrote these things..." Speaking of the Gospel of John, of which John is the author.

Why try to twist things up and claim either Lazarus or Peter when it's clearly John??? If you have trouble understanding John Chapter 21, Verse 24, read Verse 23.

It's John. Always has been, always will be.

 

[GotScripture]

according to scriptures who was he

TheDiscipleWhomJesusLoved.com is a free eBook (new revised edition) that presents the facts in the plain text of scripture on the unnamed "other disciple, whom Jesus loved" and compares and contrast those facts with what scripture tells us about John.

WHOEVER this anonymous author of the fourth gospel was, scripture proves he could not have been John -- because that false tradition forces the Bible to contradict itself, which the truth cannot do.

Non-Bible sources and the traditions of men are used to sell the unbiblical John idea and it is sold AS IF IT WAS BIBLICAL, but the John idea cannot stand up to biblical scrutiny.

A Better Bible Study Method is an audio presentation that expands on this topic and goes on to show how the scriptures exposing of the John idea as a false teaching actually impeaches the methods of all of those who promoted this idea and added to God's word because they assumed their preferred non-Bible sources could not be wrong.

Once one takes off the blinders of tradition and weighs the Bible facts without that prejudice, a straightforward reading of the fourth gospel from the beginning to end will enable the author's own words to give us all the data we need to know in order to discern his identity.

 

[L0NEW0LF]

I think the beloved disciple who wrote the Gospel according to Jn, was Lazarus.
Jn 11:33-36: When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who came with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled; and he said, “Where have you laid him?” They said to him, “Lord, come and see.” Jesus wept. So the Jews said, “See how he loved him!”

It wasn't Lazarus. It was very clearly John.

John Chapter 21, Verse 20: Peter turned and saw the desciple whom Jesus loved following them, the one who also had leaned back against him during the supper and had said, "Lord, who is it that is going to betray you?"

While Lazarus did have a DINNER with Lazarus in John Chapter 20, this is speaking of the SUPPER in John Chapter 13, in which the disciple whom Jesus loved asked, "Lord, who is it?" in Verse 25. Notice the difference in the words DINNER and SUPPER. The meal with Lazarus clearly says DINNEr, while the meal with the beloved disciple later on clearly says SUPPER, which is referred to in John Chapter 21, Verse 20; The SUPPER in which "...he reclined at the table with the twelve (Mattew Chapter 26, Verse 20)," John being one of the twelve.

Would it be considered inappropriate to make a joke about Catholics apparently truly not being able to interpret scripture without the guidance of the Church?

 

[L0NEW0LF]

Let's also take a look at John Chapter 21, Verse 20 in another light. At the end of Verse 19, Jesus tells Peter to "Follow me." Peter started to follow Jesus, and noticed that the beloved desciple was also following along. Peter asked about it, and Jesus didn't turn the beloved disciple away. Both followed Jesus. Now before this, Peter and John were joined at the hip, as were they afterwards, which we will get to. It was Peter and John that were sent to prepare the supper (Luke Chapter 22, Verse 8). It was Peter that motioned to the beloved disciple to ask Jesus, "Lord, who is it?" at the supper. It's logical that Peter would have been motioning to John. Now, going forward after Jesus commanded Peter to follow him at the end of the Gospel of John, and then soon afterwards the beloved disciple after Peter had questioned his "tagging along," it was Peter AND JOHN that healed the Lame Beggar in Acts, Peter AND JOHN before the Council in Acts. Peter and John were joined at the hip, which makes absolute sense.

With all of these facts and scriptural proofs, I hope that you can and will stop attaching a false author to the Gospel of John.

 

[seeingeyes]

I think the beloved disciple who wrote the Gospel according to Jn, was Lazarus.
Jn 11:33-36: When Jesus saw her weeping, and the Jews who came with her also weeping, he was deeply moved in spirit and troubled; and he said, “Where have you laid him?” They said to him, “Lord, come and see.” Jesus wept. So the Jews said, “See how he loved him!”

I have long loved the idea that it was Lazarus. It seems that of the men who followed Jesus, Lazarus would be the most likely to risk standing at the foot of the cross with Mary. I can hear him saying, "what are they gonna do? Kill me? Ha!"

 

[Unix]

Jn 21 was not originally in the Bible. I'm not a member of any Church. Currently I attend some evening classes in the Catholic Church - one of them is Latin. I've been studying Greek on my own for ½ a year and I've bought another textbook on September 20. 2012. Like I've written below my username I will first study Biblical Greek 2 semesters (starting autumn 2013) in a secular university nearby my home, then theology 2 semesters, then Anabaptism 1 semester.
See: http://www.christianforums.com/t7663680-post61076898/#post61076898
... where I say that I've done 2 tests which show that the RCC and the Anabaptists are the closest to what I believe.

It wasn't Lazarus. It was very clearly John.

John Chapter 21, Verse 20: Peter turned and saw the desciple whom Jesus loved following them, the one who also had leaned back against him during the supper and had said, "Lord, who is it that is going to betray you?"
[...]
Would it be considered inappropriate to make a joke about Catholics apparently truly not being able to interpret scripture without the guidance of the Church?

 

[ebedmelech]

Jn 21 was not originally in the Bible. I'm not a member of any Church. Currently I attend some evening classes in the Catholic Church - one of them is Latin. I've been studying Greek on my own for ½ a year and I've bought another textbook on September 20. 2012. Like I've written below my username I will first study Biblical Greek 2 semesters (starting autumn 2013) in a secular university nearby my home, then theology 2 semesters, then Anabaptism 2 semesters.
See: http://www.christianforums.com/t7663680-post61076898/#post61076898
... where I say that I've done 2 tests which show that the RCC and the Anabaptists are the closest to what I believe.

I don't think it's accurate to say that John 21 is not in the original. That is your conclusion. The earliest manuscripts of John contain chap 21. The evidence is quite heavy that John 21 is original.

You would be more accurate to say "I don't believe John 21 was in the original". The majority textual critics conclude John 21 to be original. This doesn't even come close to the debate on the long ending of Mark where the evidence is quite convincing that Mark 16:9-20 were not in the original.

I conclude the writer of John to be the apostle John himself.

 

[Radagast]

I don't think it's accurate to say that John 21 is not in the original.

I know some people think John 21 was added by somebody else -- i.e. not John himself (this chapter is the only one in John naming Zebedee, for example, and John 21:24 suggests someone else). These people suggest John 21 may have been added immediately after John died. However, even those people think the addition was done almost at the beginning -- within a few years at most.

John 21:24 certainly says that the beloved disciple is the man whose name is on top of the gospel -- John.

 

[Radagast]

... where I say that I've done 2 tests which show that the RCC and the Anabaptists are the closest to what I believe.

Really? Those are two very, very different viewpoints.

 

[Radagast]

I have long loved the idea that it was Lazarus.

I find the Lazarus idea extremely unconvincing. Lazarus wasn't one of the 12, for example. And the fans of the Lazarus idea have never explained why John would be completely left out of the gospel of John (which he must have been if the Lazarus idea is true).

 

[twinc]

btw - note carefully beloved of both Jesus and Mary it seems - twinc

 

[L0NEW0LF]

Jn 21 was not originally in the Bible. I'm not a member of any Church. Currently I attend some evening classes in the Catholic Church - one of them is Latin. I've been studying Greek on my own for ½ a year and I've bought another textbook on September 20. 2012. Like I've written below my username I will first study Biblical Greek 2 semesters (starting autumn 2013) in a secular university nearby my home, then theology 2 semesters, then Anabaptism 1 semester.
See: http://www.christianforums.com/t7663680-post61076898/#post61076898
... where I say that I've done 2 tests which show that the RCC and the Anabaptists are the closest to what I believe.

So do you take a black marker and scribble out John 21 in your Bibles, or do you only dismiss it when it benefits your argument(s)?