Terrorist and Constitutional Rights.

[lawtonfogle]

Two threads in News are discussing this, so we need at least one here. So should constitutional right apply to PoW and/or terrorist?

There is a simple yes/no/unsure to vote with.

Sides(simplified):
No:
This side claims it is for our safety to hold them and not give them the basic rights standard citizens have concerning trail (innocent till prove guilty, ect.)

Yes:
This side claims that we should give them those rights, and even though it could endanger Americans, it is worth protecting our stance on thing such as innocent till prove guility, ect.

Please send me any suggestions as to statements that would better represent either side, but try to keep them unbiased.

 

[keith99]

OK, I'm the first unsure and I'm not unsure at all. It is just that either yes or no is wrong. Simple case a POW. They do NOT have a right to trial. There is nothing to try. They are a soldier of an opposing force who has been captured and they may be held until the end of that war and afterwards to allow an orderly return to their country.

The terrorists that most fit the name should have full legal rights. That is those seeking to create terror in our country. In those cases the point of proof is vital. As others have rightly pointed out if one can be called a terrorist and thus lose all rights then no one is safe.

Then there is the terrorist/unaffiliated combatant. They are also entitled to their rights under international law. As I see it these are limited to those in a war zone. I'd also point out the rights of such under international law are pretty limited.

 

[CCGirl]

Many of these people are CIVILIANS. Enemy combatant is a phrase madeup by GWB to cover these people. Of course they deserve their day in court, with all evidence on the table.

 

[mpok1519]

I think they should get trials; it just difficult to say who arbitrates such a thing when the said 'terrorist pow' doesn't even have borders to which call home; many of these pows were conscripted(as in yanked from their homes and forced to fight) from rebel forces, other united fronts of allied fighters, and a thousand other politico factions and juntas.

It should be treated on a case by case based on the individual; but you can't just throw them into a jail for the rest of their lives.

 

[StarCannon]

Terrorists are still human even though they choose to express discontent through terrible ways.
As human, they are still entitled to the dignity of Geneva.

It may be convient to throw them in prison and throw away the key, but convience does not take away the obligation to get to the bottom of the matter.

Problems create terrorists. If there was nothing wrong with the world, there would be no terrorists. It's that simple

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

Terrorists and POWs and fundamentally different, for a start. Despite what the Bush administration tells us, the 'war on terror' is not technically a war so no POWs can be taken. Anyone they hold, they hold illegally and I hope Bush dies (painfully) in prison for his crimes.

Terrorist suspects have the right to a full trial like anyone else. I for one would rather die than give up my freedoms...what exactly are we defending if we give up our freedoms anyway?

 

[stan1980]

It may be convient to throw them in prison and throw away the key, but convience does not take away the obligation to get to the bottom of the matter.

Problems create terrorists. If there was nothing wrong with the world, there would be no terrorists. It's that simple

Spot on.

A few years back, I thought we (United Kingdom) had made a lot of mistakes with how we dealt with terrorism with regards to the provisional IRA, but I thought fair enough, we might have learnt something from it all. I'm not so sure we have. Thatcher stood firm against the IRA, it didn't work, and almost got her killed. A lot of shady stuff went on, from both sides I might add, but in the end we compromised, and after various cease fires, and negotiating, we seem to heading into more peaceful times, something I never thought I'd see in my lifetime.

As a military organisation, I don't think Al-Qaeda are a patch on what the IRA were, at least not yet, but we seem to be doing are damn best to give them more sympathisers and we're practically doing their recruiting for them. If we want it stop, it's quite simple, get out of the middle east, and stop supporting Israel. It wont happen though while the oil is still there unfortunately.

 

[Allister]

If we want it stop, it's quite simple, get out of the middle east, and stop supporting Israel. It wont happen though while the oil is still there unfortunately.

I don't think running away from this and burying our heads in the sand will stop modern Terrorism. It might stop the UK being a target but the problems would continue to exist. I do think our present situation is detrimental but I think we should be doing something.

 

[InigoMontoja]

Terrorists are still human even though they choose to express discontent through terrible ways.
As human, they are still entitled to the dignity of Geneva.

It may be convient to throw them in prison and throw away the key, but convience does not take away the obligation to get to the bottom of the matter.

Problems create terrorists. If there was nothing wrong with the world, there would be no terrorists. It's that simple

This makes me physically sick.

Disgusting.

 

[stan1980]

I don't think running away from this and burying our heads in the sand will stop modern Terrorism. It might stop the UK being a target but the problems would continue to exist. I do think our present situation is detrimental but I think we should be doing something.

I don't even think terrorism is that big an issue. It seems to me it has been blown out of proportion by the media and the government. Compare it to the provisional IRA days where I think 14,000 people got injured and around 2,000 killed over a constant campaign of bombing stretching decades. I think part of it is a fear of the unknown now, but I don't remember our civil liberties being eroded back then, in fact apart from the removal of bins in underground stations not much changed in mainland Britain. NI is obviously a different story.

I think we need to look at it from their perspective though. I mean, would you be happy with the likes of Iran, Saudi Arabia, Iraq etc camping in our neighbouring countries or taking the north sea oil? It is a delicate situation though, because the bottom line is, when the oil runs out, our military machines will be a heap of junk. Whoever has the last bit of oil will have incredible power.

 

[stan1980]

This makes me physically sick.

Disgusting.

why?

 

[Paulos23]

This makes me physically sick.

Disgusting.

Sorry, but how does giving them a fair trial make you sick? Do you just want to kill them because they are accused of being terrorists?

 

[InigoMontoja]

Sorry, but how does giving them a fair trial make you sick? Do you just want to kill them because they are accused of being terrorists?

Why do you want that?

 

[quatona]

Two threads in News are discussing this, so we need at least one here. So should constitutional right apply to PoW and/or terrorist?

There is a simple yes/no/unsure to vote with.

Sides(simplified):
No:
This side claims it is for our safety to hold them and not give them the basic rights standard citizens have concerning trail (innocent till prove guilty, ect.)

Yes:
This side claims that we should give them those rights, and even though it could endanger Americans, it is worth protecting our stance on thing such as innocent till prove guility, ect.

Please send me any suggestions as to statements that would better represent either side, but try to keep them unbiased.

Well, where I live (and I think this isn´t different in America - correct me if I am wrong) you have to go through a legal process in order to determine that a suspect is a perpetrator. Simply claiming someone to be a terrorist does not make it so. Unlike your poll suggests, this is the actual issue with Guantanamo.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

I think part of it is a fear of the unknown now, but I don't remember our civil liberties being eroded back then, in fact apart from the removal of bins in underground stations not much changed in mainland Britain. NI is obviously a different story.

Well, Gerry Adams' voice was banned from the BBC for a while. But that's obviously not as big a deal as the erosion of liberties we're seeing now.

This makes me physically sick.

Disgusting.

What makes me physically sick is the idea that we can even question the fundamental rights of citizens suspected of terrorism.

 

[Blue Olive]

One of the thirty UN human rights is The Right to Trial:

http://www.youthforhumanrights.org/watchads/view/psa10_h.html

 

[David Brider]

On the basis of "innocent until proven guilty", yes, anyone suspected or accused of terrorism is, or at least should be, entitled to a fair trial.

Kind of surprised that this is an issue for debate, really.

David.

 

[David Brider]

It may be convient to throw them in prison and throw away the key, but convience does not take away the obligation to get to the bottom of the matter.

Problems create terrorists. If there was nothing wrong with the world, there would be no terrorists. It's that simple

I'm convinced that a lot of problems could be avoided if as much time and effort was put into addressing the causes of terrorism as was put into addressing the symptoms.

Sadly, this doesn't seem to be a terribly popular point of view, but I'm hoping it will catch on.

David.

 

[David Brider]

This makes me physically sick.

Disgusting.

Why so?

David.

 

[Yusuf Evans]

I chose unsure, because there are many mitigating circumstances behind what gives someone a right to trial in these guys' cases. If a civilian picks up a weapon in a combat zone, he just relinqueshed his status as a civlian to an enemy combatant. Sorry CC, but that's just how it is.

If they are just arrested for being an accused terrorist, then we send them back to their home country to face trial; simple as that. If they are in POW status, they are not entitled to a trial because they chose to fight against the US period. Like I typed before, mitigating circumstances. What needs to happen, that instead of trials to be conducted, they need a full fledged investigation into each person's case. Congress, the same Democratic Congress that said they're going to change things, needs to do their job and step up in this matter. I'm tired of people criticising me for wearing a uniform, for stuff beyond my control.