Stop looking for a temple to be built

FreeinChrist · Nov 19, 2004

In Christ Forever said:
Hi FIC. Thanks. Even if it is built, it has nothing to do with Daniel's prophecy or the Olivet discourse. Revelation is about both of these, which was fulfilled in the first century. That is all I was getting at.

And I beleive your view is incorrect and incomplete. Yes, it does have to do with Daniel and Revelation...but I have learned not to waste my time with you.

FreeinChrist · Nov 19, 2004

StevenL said:
Yes, thanks Free.... I just think that if there were really imminent public plans to rebuild a great temple in Jerusalem and reinstate the Levitical priesthood and sacrificial system, someone OTHER THAN christian endtimers and Jewish sects would have brought this out by now. Dan Rather, Peter Jennings, CNN, Fox.....somebody... would have already had a special on the subject. No, not Perry Stone, either.

Anyway, my point remains that even if a "temple" is built, it will not fulfill the prophecy of Paul about the "man of sin" sitting in "The Temple of God." Because it won't be a "temple of God." It's not possible for a Jewish temple to fulfill that Word.

I disagree that it would not fulfill what Paul wrote and knew that is you were trying to get at when I posted my last comment. Point is...the Jews will have raised the temple for God and in that sense, it is the temple of God. But I do not think it will be the temple of the Millennial kingdom.
You will never convince me that Paul's statement was fulfillled in 70 AD, Steven.

And as you are waiting for an announcement by Peter Jennings...I don't have the time to look up the news articles I have seen.

In Christ Forever · Nov 19, 2004

Anyway, my point remains that even if a "temple" is built, it will not fulfill the prophecy of Paul about the "man of sin" sitting in "The Temple of God." Because it won't be a "temple of God." It's not possible for a Jewish temple to fulfill that Word.

Click to expand...

Guess Paul and Jesus must have "fibbed" to their own followers about their coming redemtion and the jews destruction.

Romans 13:11-14 And do this, understanding the present time. The hour has come for you to wake up from your slumber, because our salvation is nearer now than when we first believed. The night is nearly over; the day is almost here.

1 corin 7:29 But this I say, brethren, the time [is] short, so that from now on even those who have wives should be as though they had none, 30 those who weep as though they did not weep, those who rejoice as though they did not rejoice, those who buy as though they did not possess, 31 and those who use this world as not misusing [it.] For the form of this world is passing away.

35 "that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 "Assuredly, I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. 37 " O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her!

StevenL · Nov 20, 2004

I don't believe it was all fulfilled in 70 AD free so I won't try to convince you of that. But even if it were, I doubt most would be convinced of anything other than what they want to believe anyway.

Paul didn't say that he would sit in a temple that "in some sense" is the temple of God. He said he would sit "IN THE TEMPLE OF GOD." And he has defined for us the "temple of God." This is something that has happened and is happening in the spirit. Paul told the Corinthians that they may well put up with someone preaching "another different "spirit", another "jesus", another "gospel." So, could this take place spiritually without the "church" even knowing it? Within the church, the temple of God? YES. About this "man of sin" who sits there....does this Scripturally have to be one literal man? And does the passage say that this is "the beast?" NO. Does it say this is "the antichrist?" NO. Is the "man" in Ephesians 2:15 one literal man? NO. To whom will this "man of sin" be revealed? To the carnal church? NO. Isaiah 28:9. People who cannot think or see in the spirit, who just believe what they're told by their "leaders", who interpret the Word with their flesh and mind, will never see anything as it is revealed by the Holy Spirit.

A future Jewish temple will not be "the temple of God" and will not fulfill the prophecy. The prophecy has been being fulfilled for thousands of years now and can be verified by church history IF you can look into the spirit. Church folks are doing today just what the Jews in the time of Yeshua's manifestion in the flesh were doing..... Looking for some fleshly-minded manifestation of prophecies while the actual fulfillment was taking place right in front of their eyes.

StevenL · Nov 20, 2004

And yes, I'm waiting for an announcement from a credible source. I have found deceived religious people the most INcredible of sources.

FreeinChrist · Nov 20, 2004

I disagree.

Well, I am headed out of town and will not be looking for a source - and I have to wonder at those that 'wait' for a source and don't look for themselves.....reminds me of another poster who insisted people provide her with what she wanted and did not research herself.

StevenL · Nov 20, 2004

Oh, I've done plenty of homework, my friend. But you've resorted to what most people fall back on. Disagreement without basis and excuses for not providing evidence for what you believe. Why? Because there is NO evidence. It wouldn't do you any good to look for a source of real evidence of what we're talking about here, because this is none. That's one reason I know the rumor isn't true. You all do exactly the same thing, i.e., you pass the burden of proof for false doctrine on to the one who questions it and then imply that the one who asks is lazy and less spiritual than yourselves. And so, the believer who really is just looking for something to believe without going to God just falls into step with the majority and remains in the dark.

Have a good trip! God bless.

StevenL · Nov 20, 2004

I know of one "prophecy expert" in another BBS who claims that the Jews will begin construction on the "temple of God" this coming March. I'm waiting with bated breath.

StevenL · Nov 20, 2004

There will always be a certain small group of Jews who want to restore the "temple of God" in Jerusalem just like there will always be a small group of Confederates who want to secede from the Union to form their own country and have imminent plans to do so. (American stuff for you non-Americans.) There will always be hippies who want to get back to the good old days....communists who have plans for their communist state.....neo-nazis who have plans to implement the Fourth Reich....a Beatles fan somewhere who claims the John and George have been resurrected and are planning a Beates reunion in Lithuania.

NumberOneSon · Nov 20, 2004

StevenL said:
I know of one "prophecy expert" in another BBS who claims that the Jews will begin construction on the "temple of God" this coming March. I'm waiting with bated breath.

Can you send me a link to that info? I'd appreciate it.

In Christ,

Acts6:5

analogman · Nov 20, 2004

StevenL said:
I don't believe it was all fulfilled in 70 AD free so I won't try to convince you of that. But even if it were, I doubt most would be convinced of anything other than what they want to believe anyway.

Paul didn't say that he would sit in a temple that "in some sense" is the temple of God. He said he would sit "IN THE TEMPLE OF GOD." And he has defined for us the "temple of God." This is something that has happened and is happening in the spirit. Paul told the Corinthians that they may well put up with someone preaching "another different "spirit", another "jesus", another "gospel." So, could this take place spiritually without the "church" even knowing it? Within the church, the temple of God? YES. About this "man of sin" who sits there....does this Scripturally have to be one literal man? And does the passage say that this is "the beast?" NO. Does it say this is "the antichrist?" NO. Is the "man" in Ephesians 2:15 one literal man? NO. To whom will this "man of sin" be revealed? To the carnal church? NO. Isaiah 28:9. People who cannot think or see in the spirit, who just believe what they're told by their "leaders", who interpret the Word with their flesh and mind, will never see anything as it is revealed by the Holy Spirit.

A future Jewish temple will not be "the temple of God" and will not fulfill the prophecy. The prophecy has been being fulfilled for thousands of years now and can be verified by church history IF you can look into the spirit. Church folks are doing today just what the Jews in the time of Yeshua's manifestion in the flesh were doing..... Looking for some fleshly-minded manifestation of prophecies while the actual fulfillment was taking place right in front of their eyes.

GREAT POST STEPHEN!!!!

Barraco · Nov 22, 2004

StevenL said:
"It can't happen while that muslim dome sits there , that dome needs to come down first ."
It can't happen period. There will never again be another physical "temple of God." Many christians are waiting on something that will never be and basing their theology on this thing. If the Jews or the Baptists or the Pentecostals or the Catholics decide to build a "temple" on top of or under the Dome...it will still NOT be "The Temple of God." There is only One Temple of God and it isn't and will not be in the physical Jerusalem.

I agree.

Remember the Davidic Covenant that the LORD promised to David His servant? He said there will not fail a king to rule over Israel from the House of David. Also the king would rule in Jerusalem. Now Jesus Christ, our King from the bloodline of David, died and rose again three days later and then went to heaven after forty days. The fact is that before Jesus went up to heaven, he said(in Matthew 28), "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me,". This means that Jesus Christ is King in heaven sitting at the right hand of the Father. He is also High Priest, which means he comes before the Father day and night and petitions forgiveness for our sins.

Know also that all things that are seen were made from what is unseen and everything on earth is a representation of what is actually in heaven. Therefore when Jesus went up to heaven, so did Jerusalem along with its temple. That is why John saw a New Jerusalem coming down from heaven! There is no getting around it, as long as Jesus Christ is in heaven, Jerusalem remains a spiritual city. The place the Jews live in right now is called Sodom and Egypt. They are still in bondage to sin and will be until they say, "Blessed is He who comes i the name of the LORD." There is no peace there. There is barely enough love there to keep it together.

I think we should let the Jews know what they are doing.

And as far as another temple being built, I agree that it won't be the real temple. Reason being that whoever rejects the Son rejects the Father, so they reject the LORD in their hearts though their words are close by. God Bless.

Barraco · Nov 22, 2004

FreeinChrist said:
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I don't believe the third temple will in truth be a temple to God where God resided like in the OT, but an effort by Israel to build the temple of God.

And, of course, from a Jewish source, which you asked for a source other than us endtime nuts , they do not recognize Jesus as Messiah. Of course, they are in darkness. However, during the tribulation, I believe that many will turn to Christ. Please be aware that I don't go along with the fellow in the source I posted...I simply was giving you the requested source that others were looking to rebuild the temple other than futurist Christians. Didn't you aks for that?

I don't think that the Jews will accept Jesus until the very end of the tribulation. Why?

Well because many agree that there are 3 and 1/2 years of Daniels 70th week that still hasn't been fulfilled. In fact if you read Daniel 9:27 with a Spirit filled mind, you will find that there wasn't much of anything described for this last 3 and 1/2 years. The last half of Daniel's 70th week is in Revelation 11, starting with the two witnesses.

Think about it. Why did it start off with measuring the temple? The angel told John that the outer court had been given to the Gentiles and the will trample over it for 42 months(as we understand the times of the gentiles) This 42 months is the first 3 and 1/2 years of Daniel's 70th week. Then it says that He will give power unto two witnesses and they will prophecy for 1260 days(the same as 42 months or 3 and 1/2 years.)

Daniel 9:27 starts off with the covenant confirmed with many for one week by the Messiah. That means for this one week, the Gentiles as well will recieve a part in the covenant while the Jewish body in Jerusalem will be blotted out for disobediece and sedition. In between the week, the sacrifice and oblation was ceased, when Jerusalem was sacked by Rome in 70 A.D. Then it goes on describing why: 'for the overspreading of abominations(the seditious and idolatrous acts of the Jews in Jerusalem), He(the Messiah) will make it desolate(spiritually and as far as the covenant is concerned), even until the consummation(or the end of the 70th week), and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate(verse 24's..finish transgression, put an end to sin, ect......basically the Jews in Jerusalem as a majority will be spiritually desolate until the end of the 70th week, in which the two witnesses will be overcome by the beast and killed and three and a half days later rise again and are caught up to heaven.

After that, a great earthquake will cause a 10th part of the city of Sodom and Egypt to fall and 7,000 people will die. After that, those remaining will give God glory, meaning they will accept and glorify Jesus Christ as God's Only Begotten Son. We also know that this is the period that Jesus comes back because the beast is only allowed to have power over the saints for 3 and 1/2 years, ending with the two witnesses. It is the ignorance of the non-believing Jews that will draw all nations against them, but the LORD will have mercy on them and prophecy will be fulfilled.

Jesus Bless you.

Barraco · Nov 22, 2004

StevenL said:
2 Thessalonians 2
1BUT RELATIVE to the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ (the Messiah) and our gathering together to [meet] Him, we beg you, brethren,
2Not to allow your minds to be quickly unsettled or disturbed or kept excited or alarmed, whether it be by some [pretended] revelation of [the] Spirit or by word or by letter [alleged to be] from us, to the effect that the day of the Lord has [already] arrived and is here.
3Let no one deceive or beguile you in any way, for that day will not come except the [1] apostasy comes first [unless the predicted great [2] falling away of those who have professed to be Christians has come], and the man of lawlessness (sin) is revealed, who is the son of doom (of perdition),(1)
4Who opposes and exalts himself so proudly and insolently against and over all that is called God or that is worshiped, [even to his actually] taking his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming that he himself is God.(2)

What is the time frame for this "falling away?" Is it still to come? Or has it already come, long ago. I know it is the latter.

What is the "temple of God" spoken of here? A Jewish temple in Jerusalem? Why would Paul call the temple of God here a Jewish temple in the latter days but define the temple of God in 1 Corinthians 3:16-17 as something else?

I think the best way to look at it is that Paul was talking to Gentiles, those who did not participate in Jewish customs. Therefore, the temple that Paul was referring to was probably a spiritual temple; a congragation of the body of Christ which is a temple for the Holy Spirit. An apostate man(or men) have and will try to call themselves God. That is why Jesus warned the Jews that they should not be decieved when people proclaim to be Christ. Jesus knew that many would do that and thats why he told them after he described the destruction of Jerusalem, because He was talking about the times of the Gentiles. Notice in Mark 13:21, after Jesus described the destruction of Jerusalem and war in Judea, he says: And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here [is] Christ; or, lo, [he is] there; believe [him] not:
notice that He said, 'and then,' meaning that after the destruction of Jerusalem, many false christs would come and decieve man. The times of the Gentiles has been going since the war in Jerusalem started and all the believe Jews fled to the Gentile nations. Therefore, Paul was most likely speaking of the body of Christ, not a Jewish temple. Thanks and God Bless.

Barraco · Nov 22, 2004

StevenL said:
There will always be a certain small group of Jews who want to restore the "temple of God" in Jerusalem just like there will always be a small group of Confederates who want to secede from the Union to form their own country and have imminent plans to do so. (American stuff for you non-Americans.) There will always be hippies who want to get back to the good old days....communists who have plans for their communist state.....neo-nazis who have plans to implement the Fourth Reich....a Beatles fan somewhere who claims the John and George have been resurrected and are planning a Beates reunion in Lithuania.

LOL Too true

Stop looking for a temple to be built

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