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Stance on drugs
- Thread starter psychedelicist
- Start date
psychedelicist said:
Drugs are bad and I would strongly encourage anyone who is using them to stop. Get help if necessary.
That having been said, the War on Drugs has been a complete and utter failure on every front. It has turned the Constitution on it's head and turned otherwise law abiding citizens into criminals.
I do believe it's time to legalize some drugs and take away the market from those who would prey on the weaknesses of others.
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I guess I should give my opinion, if I'm asking for everyone else's. Being a shaman, I use certain drugs (strictly herbs, no chemicals like Meth or LSD) sometimes for shamanic purposes, talking to spirits, etc. I have seen things that are very hard to dismiss as mere hallucinations or 'just tripping', especially in the area of Ibogaine(see my topic under the Addictions section to learn more about it) and Mushrooms. I do believe in legalization, the WOD has done waaaay more harm than help. I think that if people understood better the full effects of the drugs they were taking, it could easily prevent problems such as addiction.
A good rule of thumb when pursuing psychoactives is "Know your body. Know your mind. Know your substance. Know your source."
A good rule of thumb when pursuing psychoactives is "Know your body. Know your mind. Know your substance. Know your source."
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well drugs do no good to the human body...just damage...so whats the point? just cuz it feels good doesnt mean it is good for you
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Well that also applies to caffiene, no? It can be just as damaging (it gives stomach ulcers) but it is widely accepted, even by most christians.
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Magisterium
Praying and Thinking
What's funny (but not really funny), is that we (at least in the US) are such hypocrites when it comes to the use of drugs. We preach and teach against "drugs" but continually pump ourselves full of anything western medicine can contrive in a laboratory. It's wrong to smoke marijuana, but it's ok to remain dependent upon on drugs like Paxil or Zoloft. It's rediculous! I believe many of the problems people face relating to depression and anxiety are traceable to some event in their lives or in their formation. Of course I'm no psycologist (yet) but many psychiatrists will be quick to admit that the majority of people who suffer from these "disorders", have no observable neurosis.
If we're going to successfully reduce the human dependence upon drugs, we have to address the problems which are causing people to use drugs in the first place. The fact is, people flee to drugs for reasons. Some times that reason is idleness, others (and more often) it provides a temporary escape from psycological and emotional problems and troubles that have gone unaddressed and untreated.
At any rate, to say "drugs are bad" and then say "but not these drugs" is hypocritical and counter-productive. Especially when people know that the effects are often similar but the natural drugs cannot be patented and sold for exorbitant prices so they are banned.
In closing, I'll say that drug abuse is a problem not merely an enemy. War is rarely the best solution against an enemy let alone problem. Trying to stamp out the suppliers only increases contention for the shortened supply and ultimately contributes to increases in violent crime over drugs. What's more, the suppliers just become more and more adept in response to our assaults. If we want to stop drug abuse, we have to eliminate the demand. In fact, we don't even have to eliminate the entire demand. Once the market has been sufficiently reduced through proper identification and treatment of the underlying problems in our society, the drug trade itself becomes unprofitable. Drug sales are like Wal-mart. They rely on volume for profits. If the demand is lessened, the cleanup is safer and the problems associated with trying to remove the supply are eliminated.
If we're going to successfully reduce the human dependence upon drugs, we have to address the problems which are causing people to use drugs in the first place. The fact is, people flee to drugs for reasons. Some times that reason is idleness, others (and more often) it provides a temporary escape from psycological and emotional problems and troubles that have gone unaddressed and untreated.
At any rate, to say "drugs are bad" and then say "but not these drugs" is hypocritical and counter-productive. Especially when people know that the effects are often similar but the natural drugs cannot be patented and sold for exorbitant prices so they are banned.
In closing, I'll say that drug abuse is a problem not merely an enemy. War is rarely the best solution against an enemy let alone problem. Trying to stamp out the suppliers only increases contention for the shortened supply and ultimately contributes to increases in violent crime over drugs. What's more, the suppliers just become more and more adept in response to our assaults. If we want to stop drug abuse, we have to eliminate the demand. In fact, we don't even have to eliminate the entire demand. Once the market has been sufficiently reduced through proper identification and treatment of the underlying problems in our society, the drug trade itself becomes unprofitable. Drug sales are like Wal-mart. They rely on volume for profits. If the demand is lessened, the cleanup is safer and the problems associated with trying to remove the supply are eliminated.
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Magisterium
Praying and Thinking
In fact, Caffeine is actually a stimulant. If I'm not mistaken, it's the only stimulant which is not regulated at all by the FDA. This is an example of the hypocrisy I am writing about. By volume, it's similarly addictive and dangerous as many regulated and/or banned substances.psychedelicist said:
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The WOD is a complete failure but I do think there should be controls over the use of drugs. Lets say that marijuana is legalized, how many more people would likely die from the resulting auto accidents. Far to many die from alcohol related accidents already, do we now want to add another drug that can be obtained legally to add to the carnage already rampant in American society? Americans have already shown that they are not responsible when it comes to mind altering substances so why would we want to give people access to more?
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Magisterium said:
You make many good points.
By the way, in the spirit of full disclosure, I guess I should point out that I manage a pharmacy.
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Eudaimonist
I believe in life before death!
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Drugs are bad, but fighting a war on drugs is worse.
I take the libertarian position of relegalizing drugs.
I take the libertarian position of relegalizing drugs.
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I think that drugs should be avoided at almost all costs. Every drug as caffine, morphine, crack, viagra, and even advil. They alter the natural means of progression in someone. I always believed that getting through something only makes you stronger but when drugs help you I do not think it can apply. The only time drugs should be used are in a fatal illness.
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I'm with USDA, drugs are mainly used by people to make pain and loss disappear, but until something is actually done to heal, then the loss will always be present. They give people false happiness, rather than genuine help.
That said, simply declaring drugs illegal is the wrong way to go about fixing this. Drugs should be legal and open for anyone to buy, it'll save lives by creating purity standards, lower costs by creating capitalist competition, and ease the strain on our prison system by getting rid of all the marijuana junkies. As an added bonus, it might also manage to kickstart Hollywood into making more interesting plotlines by removing one of their done to death villain archetypes.
I'm not terrificly worried about the pain some people hide with drugs, it'll always be dragged into light sooner or later and, if they're surrounded by friends and family rather than crackwhores and uncaring dealers, it will more often be for the better.
That said, simply declaring drugs illegal is the wrong way to go about fixing this. Drugs should be legal and open for anyone to buy, it'll save lives by creating purity standards, lower costs by creating capitalist competition, and ease the strain on our prison system by getting rid of all the marijuana junkies. As an added bonus, it might also manage to kickstart Hollywood into making more interesting plotlines by removing one of their done to death villain archetypes.
I'm not terrificly worried about the pain some people hide with drugs, it'll always be dragged into light sooner or later and, if they're surrounded by friends and family rather than crackwhores and uncaring dealers, it will more often be for the better.
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Drugs aren't bad. Drug abuse is bad.
The War on drugs has been a complete failure. Good people sit in jail while the real criminals like drug lords, go relativly untouched. Legalization would take money away from the criminals and put it into our economy, it would also allow the government to make more money through taxation. Instead we spend millions of dollars on a failed project that doesn't keep money out of the bad guys hands.
The amazing thing is that prohibition should have taught us many lessons, yet they go unnoticed.
The War on drugs has been a complete failure. Good people sit in jail while the real criminals like drug lords, go relativly untouched. Legalization would take money away from the criminals and put it into our economy, it would also allow the government to make more money through taxation. Instead we spend millions of dollars on a failed project that doesn't keep money out of the bad guys hands.
The amazing thing is that prohibition should have taught us many lessons, yet they go unnoticed.
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Nexus`
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So ppl doing 20 years in prison is better than them getting high?
I've done a wide range of drugs. Shooms, acid, weed, X, alcohol, ect, ect. The only thing I haven't done, and don't plan to do is meth, cocain and heroin.
I am a testament to the arguement that, when taken in moderation, drugs are not very harmful. It's the addiction that kills you.
I support the complete legalization of all drugs. I support distribution by the government in controlled enviroment, with controlled amounts with trained medics and armed guards watching everything.
The government can get these drugs for almost nothing. Though the process of Capitalism, we can completely wipe out the competitors. The gangs, the cartels, the dealers, ect.
So basically, the only way to win the WOD, is to drop the WOD.
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N
Nexus`
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Well, I don't think the Bible says much about cannabis, but it does have a few things to say about drunkards. Mainly bad things.
But whether or not the Bible's talking about someone who's a drunk or an alcoholic, or someone who drinks moderately, or rarely is uncertain.
But whether or not the Bible's talking about someone who's a drunk or an alcoholic, or someone who drinks moderately, or rarely is uncertain.
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In the bible it does say "your body is a temple, keep it pure." This can be taken to mean no drugs, peircings, tattoos, etc.
If you believe this to be true, that logically means avoiding all psychoactives; pharmecutical, narcotic, or otherwise. A few of the lesser known psychoactives are: caffiene, chocolate, garlic, nutmeg, mistletoe, peppermint/spearmint, and ginkgo biloba.
I personally think that plants can be a tremendous ally, figuratively. 90% of all sicknesses that really need treating can be treated with various plants. Asthma, for instance, can be treated with Common Sage. Anise root is a good expectorant (good for stuffy/runny noses), Arrowroot root helps with poison ivy/oak, as well as snakebite venom. Damiana leaf is a good nervous/hormonal system strengthener, and an anti-nausea agent. Cannabis and Eyebright are good remedies for all sorts of eye problems, such as glaucoma and general inflammatory, weeping, oversensitivity, etc. We even have natural toothpaste and tooth whitener(also Common Sage).
Some drugs can be used for mental problems as well. Shrooms, for example, I use to bring out my problems so I can face them, even unconcious problems that I never even knew about. I cannot see people using psychedelics like shrooms and peyote recreationally, as they are essentially the opposite of escapist.
If you believe this to be true, that logically means avoiding all psychoactives; pharmecutical, narcotic, or otherwise. A few of the lesser known psychoactives are: caffiene, chocolate, garlic, nutmeg, mistletoe, peppermint/spearmint, and ginkgo biloba.
I personally think that plants can be a tremendous ally, figuratively. 90% of all sicknesses that really need treating can be treated with various plants. Asthma, for instance, can be treated with Common Sage. Anise root is a good expectorant (good for stuffy/runny noses), Arrowroot root helps with poison ivy/oak, as well as snakebite venom. Damiana leaf is a good nervous/hormonal system strengthener, and an anti-nausea agent. Cannabis and Eyebright are good remedies for all sorts of eye problems, such as glaucoma and general inflammatory, weeping, oversensitivity, etc. We even have natural toothpaste and tooth whitener(also Common Sage).
Some drugs can be used for mental problems as well. Shrooms, for example, I use to bring out my problems so I can face them, even unconcious problems that I never even knew about. I cannot see people using psychedelics like shrooms and peyote recreationally, as they are essentially the opposite of escapist.
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The war on drugs is in direct opposition with what I would consider "American".
What should be treated as an issue of public health is instead criminalizing families, and otherwise law abiding citizens. Too many people have lost their freedom and livelihoods over this non-violent crime.
It's immoral in every sense of the word.
What should be treated as an issue of public health is instead criminalizing families, and otherwise law abiding citizens. Too many people have lost their freedom and livelihoods over this non-violent crime.
It's immoral in every sense of the word.
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Why? said:
And therein lies the problem for us free market conservative types.
The war on drugs is unfair and unconstitutional so we make drugs legal and tax and regulate them to the point that it is unfair and unconstitutional.
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