St Paul could have done more work?

[GoldenKingGaze]

Could St Paul have possibly done more work by avoiding or overcoming the challenge of Nero? And then there may have been another church such as in Spain, and another letter?

Here is part of what Paul had to say:
Php 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Php 1:22 If I am to live in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. Yet which I shall choose I cannot tell.
Php 1:23 I am hard pressed between the two. My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better.
Php 1:24 But to remain in the flesh is more necessary on your account.
Php 1:25 Convinced of this, I know that I will remain and continue with you all, for your progress and joy in the faith,
Php 1:26 so that in me you may have ample cause to glory in Christ Jesus, because of my coming to you again. ESV

 

[Tolworth John]

He was following God's plan not his. God sent him to Rome, put him in the hands of the empire.
It was not a mistake or a mishap, but part of God's plan for Paul.

 

[solid_core]

Could St Paul have possibly done more work by avoiding or overcoming the challenge of Nero? And then there may have been another church such as in Spain, and another letter?

Here is part of what Paul had to say:
Php 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Php 1:22 If I am to live in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. Yet which I shall choose I cannot tell.
Php 1:23 I am hard pressed between the two. My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better.
Php 1:24 But to remain in the flesh is more necessary on your account.
Php 1:25 Convinced of this, I know that I will remain and continue with you all, for your progress and joy in the faith,
Php 1:26 so that in me you may have ample cause to glory in Christ Jesus, because of my coming to you again. ESV

Yes:

Agrippa said to Festus, "This man could have been set free if he had not appealed to Caesar."
Acts 26:32

Paul made a legal step that cost him his life. If he would not do it, he could be free and continue his mission for some more time.

On the other hand, everything is under God's control. If He needed Paul for some other work, He would arrange it to happen. Paul accomplished everything God wanted him to accomplish. But possibility? Yes.

 

[dqhall]

Could St Paul have possibly done more work by avoiding or overcoming the challenge of Nero? And then there may have been another church such as in Spain, and another letter?

Here is part of what Paul had to say:
Php 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Php 1:22 If I am to live in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. Yet which I shall choose I cannot tell.
Php 1:23 I am hard pressed between the two. My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better.
Php 1:24 But to remain in the flesh is more necessary on your account.
Php 1:25 Convinced of this, I know that I will remain and continue with you all, for your progress and joy in the faith,
Php 1:26 so that in me you may have ample cause to glory in Christ Jesus, because of my coming to you again. ESV

Some people advised Paul not to go to Jerusalem. He was carrying donations for poor saints in Jerusalem. Paul ignored the warnings, went to Jerusalem, was arrested in the Temple and was taken as a prisoner to Rome. Eventually Nero was killing Christians for no other reason than they confessed Christianity.

Someone else went to Spain.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I disagree with this sense of fate or predestiny. I do not believe God appointed Nero to rule and be one of those who was predetermined to be a lost soul, and to end the lives of Peter and Paul and exile John. This served no righteous purpose. If only Peter and Paul also could not be killed, like John. All of them by 66 AD could say they had run their courses and finished their races. But John strengthened his disciples and wrote another book God gave him.

No, it is not like Obi Wan Kenobi being struck down by Vader.

Practically speaking, Nero choked the church. Many of the best people died as martyrs. Nero's emperor worship trend persisted after he died. The missions and the empowerment of the Spirit were weakened. There was a long dark period in Europe, sometimes conversion by the sword.

Only revivalists started to revive the empowerment of the Spirit and revive going on missions, like John Wesley. And John G Lake. The twentieth century has seen a boom in missions and missions power. In China, India, Africa, Russia, Hungary, South America, Korea... but the westerners have been moving towards materialism and the love of pleasure. That after originally sending out the missions. So western churches are smaller.

Nero was a psychopath and an example of ones to come like Hitler and Stalin, Idi Amin and Un...

I think it would have been success if Nero was healed or if he was sent away blind. As it was with Paul's previous enemy.

Paul was warned not to go on the trip to Jerusalem. But he insisted. He may have had the dream of converting the emperor.

 

[Aussie Pete]

Could St Paul have possibly done more work by avoiding or overcoming the challenge of Nero? And then there may have been another church such as in Spain, and another letter?

Here is part of what Paul had to say:
Php 1:21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
Php 1:22 If I am to live in the flesh, that means fruitful labor for me. Yet which I shall choose I cannot tell.
Php 1:23 I am hard pressed between the two. My desire is to depart and be with Christ, for that is far better.
Php 1:24 But to remain in the flesh is more necessary on your account.
Php 1:25 Convinced of this, I know that I will remain and continue with you all, for your progress and joy in the faith,
Php 1:26 so that in me you may have ample cause to glory in Christ Jesus, because of my coming to you again. ESV

What we read in Paul's letters is but a very small fraction of what he did practically. Read Acts in conjunction with the letters and you get a picture of a man who stopped only when forced to. Paul could say that he'd run the race set before him. I wonder how many others could honestly say the same thing?

 

[Dave G.]

Back in Acts Jesus said that Paul was assigned to carry out His will and in so doing would find out the suffering required in following that out. Period. I'm not supposing anything or wondering if Paul could have done anything or fell short of anything, he fully submitted to Christ. End of story and so the scriptures are as they are.

 

[Aussie Pete]

I disagree with this sense of fate or predestiny. I do not believe God appointed Nero to rule and be one of those who was predetermined to be a lost soul, and to end the lives of Peter and Paul and exile John. This served no righteous purpose. If only Peter and Paul also could not be killed, like John. All of them by 66 AD could say they had run their courses and finished their races. But John strengthened his disciples and wrote another book God gave him.

No, it is not like Obi Wan Kenobi being struck down by Vader.

Practically speaking, Nero choked the church. Many of the best people died as martyrs. Nero's emperor worship trend persisted after he died. The missions and the empowerment of the Spirit were weakened. There was a long dark period in Europe, sometimes conversion by the sword.

Only revivalists started to revive the empowerment of the Spirit and revive going on missions, like John Wesley. And John G Lake. The twentieth century has seen a boom in missions and missions power. In China, India, Africa, Russia, Hungary, South America, Korea... but the westerners have been moving towards materialism and the love of pleasure. That after originally sending out the missions. So western churches are smaller.

Nero was a psychopath and an example of ones to come like Hitler and Stalin, Idi Amin and Un...

I think it would have been success if Nero was healed or if he was sent away blind. As it was with Paul's previous enemy.

Paul was warned not to go on the trip to Jerusalem. But he insisted. He may have had the dream of converting the emperor.

Paul was led by the Spirit who warned him of the dangers to come. I'd not be in any way critical of a man who made such a huge impact. Paul was not infallible, neither were the other apostles. Paul was going to die anyway, like everyone else! Lord Jesus told Peter that he would be martyred. The church was not stifled by Nero. It was ruined by Constantine, when he made it the state religion. I won't go into the history, but it makes interesting reading.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

I am critical of Nero. Paul did not have good success with Nero, since Nero was a man with something of a blind conscience. I think either meeting Nero was a mistake or something good should have come from it. I don't think the blood of the martyrs, being shed was as good as if they grew to be intercessors, pastors and missionaries.

 

[paul1149]

Paul had rotted in a cell for two years under Felix. Felix then offered to take him back to Jerusalem for judgment, but Paul knew that Felix's justice was up for sale to the highest bidder, and that would have been the Jewish leaders. At that point he had no option but to appeal to Caesar.

My sense from reading Acts is that toward the end, just before going to Jerusalem, the Jews were increasingly devoted to capturing and killing Paul. They followed him wherever he went and were slowly closing in. On the way up to Jerusalem, he even walked one leg of the journey while others took a boat - apparently to keep his foes in confusion. Paul's capture, one way or the other, seems inevitable, and I think this was a major reason he ignored all the warnings and went up to Jerusalem, into what was clearly going to be a trap.

To this day I find his actions in Jerusalem before being arrested baffling. But that's another story. But as far as his imprisonment and all that, I don't think he had much choice by then. The walls were closing in, and so he decided to go for the most impact by going into the belly of the beast, Rome itself.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Paul was led by the Spirit who warned him of the dangers to come. I'd not be in any way critical of a man who made such a huge impact. Paul was not infallible, neither were the other apostles. Paul was going to die anyway, like everyone else! Lord Jesus told Peter that he would be martyred. The church was not stifled by Nero. It was ruined by Constantine, when he made it the state religion. I won't go into the history, but it makes interesting reading.

I think the events following events of Nero and the successors martyrings and then Constantine laying the great burden of the whole of Italy on what was left of the church, this overwhelmed the church.