ST. Jan Hus

thereselittleflower · Oct 23, 2007

IamAdopted said:
Well I would say that the Catholic Church was the enemy of Luther since it was they who sought after him..

Well since Luther called for the kiliing of the Catholic Church's leaders, and the burning of Her properties, he quite made himself Her enemy . . . .

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thereselittleflower · Oct 23, 2007

simonthezealot said:
You judging me young man?
1 Corinthians 12:12-14
One Body with Many Members
12 For just as the body is one and has many members, and all the members of the body, though many, are one body, so it is with Christ. 13For in the one Spirit we were all baptized into one bodyJews or Greeks, slaves or freeand we were all made to drink of one Spirit.
14 Indeed, the body does not consist of one member but of many.

Romans 12:4-6 (New International Version)
4Just as each of us has one body with many members, and these members do not all have the same function, 5so in Christ we who are many form one body, and each member belongs to all the others.
1 Corinthians 12:26-28 (New International Version)
26If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.
27Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it.

YES I AM!

YOU are the body of Christ?

No Simon, you are NOT the body of Chrsit. You may be a member of the Body of Christ, but that does not make YOU, SIMON, the body of Christ.

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thereselittleflower · Oct 23, 2007

simonthezealot said:
It's a reference to everyone who by salvation has been sanctified, that is set apart from sin in Christ Jesus...
We have scripture as our authority, not an ecclesial body to
"canonize" ! so based on the plain understanding of scripture we can see what a saint is! I can share some more scripture in this regard if you desire!

Well, since Hus sinned and did not obtain theosis, ie sanctification, in this life, he is not entitled to the TITLE saint by your own words.

You cannot prove his sanctification.

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thereselittleflower · Oct 23, 2007

ScarletCrusader said:
I'm judging your "churches".

That is about ethnicity. No race is above the other in the eyes of Christ.

The rest of your verses has nothing to do with false teachers and if they are a part of Christ's body. Christ's body cannot be divided. Now, if the RCC or the EOC is Christ's body, I dunnow, I'm so lost here.

Anyway on your false teachings:

Matthew 7:15-20 (NKJV)

15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheeps clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles? 17 Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them."

Okay, so what is the fruit of Jan Hus? Pre-communist, pre-nationalistic fanatics, called taborites that killed Germans and Catholics and started a war against the legitime king of Bohemia.

Let's continue here:

Matthew 7:21-23

21 Not everyone who says to Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name? 23 And then I will declare to them, I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!

This clearly shows us that you are not saved by confessing Jesus as your saviour. You have to do the will of his Father in heaven, ie follow the law of God. You Protestants often prophesies about Armageddon (notably SDA here), you imagine that you see "demons" just like some fools believe that they have seen Ghosts and you do "wonders" in his name like "healing" and such. I'm sure Jesus is talking about you here.

Okay, let's continue to read our bible:

Matthew 7:24-25 (NKJV)

Build on the Rock

24 Therefore whoever hears these sayings of Mine, and does them, I will liken him to a wise man who built his house on the rock: 25 and the rain descended, the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house; and it did not fall, for it was founded on the rock.

What is this rock? This is what made me thinking about Catholicism again. The Greek word for Rock is Petra does that sound familiar? SAINT PETER of course!
Look here:

Matthew 16:18 (NKJV)

18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.

So we have to build our house on Saint Peter the apostle, on the Pope and the Holy Roman-Catholic Church. Yesterday, I was reading the bible (in Swedish) and God made me see these verses; I thank him for revealing the truth for me. Now, I know the thruth.

Yes, and in the Aramaic, it is Kepha . . Thou are Kepha and upon this kepha I will build my Church . . . .

It was this that finally convinced me to convert to Catholicism rather than return to the Eastern Orthodox Church of my childhood.

Welcome on your journey home!

Have you told the members in OBOB about this yet?

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Imperiuz · Oct 23, 2007

It was this that finally convinced me to convert to Catholicism rather than return to the Eastern Orthodox Church of my childhood.

Same thing here, exept that my childhood was rather secular. I was decieved by the Orthodox father Andrew "they come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves!". I have vistied both Catholic and Eastern Orthodox churches, and I was thinking about the easterners. Untill yesterday, when I found these verses. Lukily, my steppmother's mother is a Roman-Catholic.

Welcome on your journey home!

Thank you!

Have you told the members in OBOB about this yet?

No, why have I not? I have to do this now!
God bless the one true Church!

IamAdopted · Oct 23, 2007

thereselittleflower said:
Well since Luther called for the kiliing of the Catholic Church's leaders, and the burning of Her properties, he quite made himself Her enemy . . . .

.

Haven't found evidence that this is truth.. Now I do see those whom were against the RCC did go and pilfredge and burn but it was not Luther.. Kind of like the story the Jews still believe to this day.. That the disciples stole the body of Christ and claimed He rose from the dead.. You can read about that in scripture also..

IamAdopted · Oct 23, 2007

thereselittleflower said:
Well, since Hus sinned and did not obtain theosis, ie sanctification, in this life, he is not entitled to the TITLE saint by your own words.

You cannot prove his sanctification.

.

And you cannot disprove it. For it is the blood of Christ and the word of his testimony that will seal where He is and if He was a saint or not.. Not any man declaring it matters..

IamAdopted · Oct 23, 2007

thereselittleflower said:
Yes, and in the Aramaic, it is Kepha . . Thou are Kepha and upon this kepha I will build my Church . . . .

It was this that finally convinced me to convert to Catholicism rather than return to the Eastern Orthodox Church of my childhood.

Welcome on your journey home!

Have you told the members in OBOB about this yet?

.

Probably why the NT was written in Greek for a good reason don't you think? That is why it is called Petro and Petra. Just because it does not line up with the CC teaching doesn't mean to go to a different language to try and make it line up..

synger · Oct 23, 2007

Please keep in mind that while Anglicans, Lutherans, and Protestants may not officially "canonize" people, we do observe (more or less, depending on denomination ) commemorations of outstanding individuals who have served the Church, whether the Orthodox or Roman churches have recognized them or not.

So while I would not go so far as to call him "Saint" John Hus, my church offers a commemoration for him on July 6 each year.

There are, in my understanding, three ways one can use the term "saint."

In the broadest sense, "saint" is one who follows Christ (a member of the Church Universal). The saints at Corinth. My sainted mother. The saints of the Church. That includes all whom God has called to Him, whether still in this life or now in glory.

The second use of the term is the one we're talking about here, which includes those who have been noteworthy in the life of the Church. In the case of the Lutheran Calendar of Saints, this also includes those who were influential in Lutheran life and practice.

The third use of the term is probably the most commonly understood, which is someone who has been officially canonized by the Roman or Orthodox denominations.

In this last sense, no, Jan Hus is not a saint. But in the first two, he is.

simonthezealot · Oct 23, 2007

thereselittleflower said:
YOU are the body of Christ?

No Simon, you are NOT the body of Chrsit. You may be a member of the Body of Christ, but that does not make YOU, SIMON, the body of Christ.

.

Did ya miss verse 27?

simonthezealot · Oct 23, 2007

thereselittleflower said:
Well, since Hus sinned and did not obtain theosis, ie sanctification, in this life, he is not entitled to the TITLE saint by your own words.

You cannot prove his sanctification.

.

All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God! including your St.Dymphna who was disobedient repeatedly to her father. Prove her sanctification, or as you call it (theosis)

Imperiuz · Oct 23, 2007

Nice work on ignoring my post, oh Zealot!

simonthezealot · Oct 23, 2007

ScarletCrusader said:
Nice work on ignoring my post, oh Zealot!

You wish to start a thread on who is part of the body of Christ be my guest!

thereselittleflower · Oct 23, 2007

IamAdopted said:
Haven't found evidence that this is truth..

Come now IaA. we have talked about this many times in the past, and the evidences have been presented, more than once.

"It were better that every bishop were murdered, every [monastery or convent] rooted out, that one soul should be destroyed ... But if they will not hear God's Word, but rage and rave with bannings and burnings, killings and every evil, what do they better deserve than a strong uprising which will sweep them from the earth? And we would smile did it happen. ... All who contribute body, goods and honor that the rule of the bishops may be destroyed are God's dear children and true Christians."

Against the Falsely Called Spiritual Order of the Pope and the Bishops

also:

It is Christian and a work of love not to go slowly in a war. One must cut the throats of one's enemies, pillage them, burn them, do everything that may do them harm until one has beaten them (Luther's Works, Weimar edition v11, p277). Only a simpleton argues that it is not Christian to strangle and to rob and that it is no work of love. But in truth it is a work of love (Luther's Works, Weimar edition v19, p625).

Now I do see those whom were against the RCC did go and pilfredge and burn but it was not Luther.. Kind of like the story the Jews still believe to this day.. That the disciples stole the body of Christ and claimed He rose from the dead.. You can read about that in scripture also..

I didn't say Luther personally did these acts. I said he called for them, he incited them.

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thereselittleflower · Oct 23, 2007

simonthezealot said:
All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God! including your St.Dymphna who was disobedient repeatedly to her father. Prove her sanctification, or as you call it (theosis)

There is absolutely no comparison between St Dymphna and Luther or Hus or any you wish to raise to such a level.

You say she disobeyed her father.

Yes she did.

You act as though that was a sin.

You act as though by obeying her father, she could have avoided sin.

What was it that compelled her to disobey her father and flee from him?

Her FATHER WANTED TO MARRY HER!

Now, if you want to make her action of refusing such a relationship with her own father into some kind of sin, then that simnply shows what is within your own heart.

She did not sin in refusing her father and disobeying him and fleeing for her own safety.

I do not need to prove the sanctity of her life. It was determined long ago. She was martyred for her faith by her own father. Those who hold to purity of faith and accept martyrdom, such as this Saint did at the hand of her own father at the age of 15, instead of defiling themselves are proven worthy of the TITLE Saint.

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simonthezealot · Oct 23, 2007

thereselittleflower said:
It were better that every bishop were murdered, every [monastery or convent] rooted out, that one soul should be destroyed ... But if they will not hear God's Word, but rage and rave with bannings and burnings, killings and every evil, what do they better deserve than a strong uprising which will sweep them from the earth? And we would smile did it happen. ... All who contribute body, goods and honor that the rule of the bishops may be destroyed are God's dear children and true Christians."

I am DOUBTING everything YOU post! FOR GOOD REASON!

This is hilarious...
Here is the actual context!
You should quit cut n pasteing armstrong!
Nice checking the facts TLF! SHEESH.
"It were better that every bishop were murdered, every foundation or cloister rooted out, than that one soul should be destroyed, let alone that all souls should be lost for the sake of their worthless trumpery and idolatry. Of what use are they who thus live in lust, nourished by the sweat and labour of others, and are a stumbling block to the word of God? They fear bodily uproar and despise spiritual destruction. Are they wise and honest people ? If they accepted Gods word and sought the life of the soul, God would be with them, for He is a God of peace, and they need fear no uprising; but if they will not hear Gods word, but rage and rave with bannings, burnings, killings, and every evil, what do they better deserve than a strong uprising which shall sweep them from the earth? And we would smile did it happen. As the heavenly wisdom with: "Ye have hated my chastisement and despised my doctrine; behold, I will also laugh at ye in your distress, and will mock ye when misfortune shall fall upon your heads." In the same document he denounces the bishops as an accursed race, as "thieves, robbers, and usurers". Swine, horses, stones, and wood were not so destitute of understanding as the German people under the sway of them and their Pope. The religious houses are similarly described as "brothels, low taverns, and murder dens".
He winds up this document, which he calls his bull, by proclaiming that "all who contribute body, goods, and honour that the rule of the bishops may be destroyed are Gods dear children and true Christians, obeying Gods command and fighting against the devils order;" and on the other hand, that "all who give the bishops a willing obedience are the devils own servants, and fight against Gods order and law".[2]

ST. Jan Hus

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