I can see stars with my naked eyes. I understand the Sun to be a star. I understand the Sun to be a spheroid. I assume other stars are spheroids. I understand that the Sun shines in all directions. I assume other stars shine in all directions. Because I can see other stars (37,000?) with my eyes unaided and because the earth is in close proximity to the sun I will assume that because some stars shine on me (I can see them) that those same stars would shine on our Sun. If this is true, probability would say that our Sun shines on the stars that shine on it. I see a structure.
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Spheroids
- Thread starter Threads of Light
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Late_Cretaceous
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Hi Threads
I believe that you are correct about stars radiating light in all directions equally. Actually, there are only in the order 4 thousand stars - grand total - visible to the naked eye. At any given time of year, at a particular location, only about half of those would be visible at once. Most of the stars we see are quite close, or else are unusually bright. Our sun is not a particularly bright star, and to hypothecial observers on most other stars, we would appear much dimmer then they do to us (i.e. Antares, Sirius, Procyon, Aldeberan).
I believe that you are correct about stars radiating light in all directions equally. Actually, there are only in the order 4 thousand stars - grand total - visible to the naked eye. At any given time of year, at a particular location, only about half of those would be visible at once. Most of the stars we see are quite close, or else are unusually bright. Our sun is not a particularly bright star, and to hypothecial observers on most other stars, we would appear much dimmer then they do to us (i.e. Antares, Sirius, Procyon, Aldeberan).
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Then doesn't this Bible statement reveal Divine Inspiration and Authorship when we consider what it says about Abrahams decendants. Genesis 22:16-17 I shall surely bless you and I shall surely multiply your seed like the stars of the heavens and like the grains of sand that are on the seashore.
What a ridiculous comparison if as you say the writer of those words could only see a few thousand stars, for he could pick up in one hand more than all the stars he could see, let alone all the sand on the seashore. Yet the writer does make such a comparison, the Stars of the heavens are compared in number to the grains of sands on the seas.
Only if the statement was made under inspiration from God as the Bible claims would it make any sense, for only he would have know what we today have only recently discovered, that there are indeed as many if not more stars in his created heavens as there are grains of sand on the seashores.
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seebs
God Made Me A Skeptic
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Don't be silly; no one can count four thousand visible stars, or even one thousand, because they're small and often close together. Four thousand is "way more than you can possibly imagine" for descendants, anyway.
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Late_Cretaceous
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My son's calender has this comparison: If each star was represented by a grain of sand, then all the stars visible to the naked eye would fill a thimble. All the stars in the Galaxy would fill one frieght train car with sand. All the stars in the universe would fill enough freight train cars that if you were waiting at a train crossing for them all to go by at the rate of one per second, it would take three years (which is why i turn off my engine when waiting for a train).
So ,yeah, a handfull of sand has a lot more grains in it then visible stars in the sky.
These people were desert nomads. Certainly they were familiar with the night sky, for knowledge of the seasons and such, but they did not map the sky. I wonder is your average goat herder from then could even count beyond the number of goats and sheep he had. Their knowldege of numbers was different then ours. THey did not think in terms of thousands of years, thousands of people (since they would have known only a few), thousands of miles or thousands of anything. To the minds of the people that genesis was orginally intended, anything over a few hundren was probably as close to infinity as they could imagine. TOday people talk in terms of millions, billions and trillions. THese huge numbers are part of every day life - yet we cannot really comprehend them. Even though we are accustomed to numbers larger then were used in the past, we would see a couple of thousand stars in a desert sky and think they were infinite too.
Think of this. When you originally posted the number 37000 stars it was probably the result of a typo. The original number may have been 3700. Whether that was your mistake or someone elses is not the point. The point is you did not question the huge number 37000. Most people would not have. I bet if you told alot of people that there were 37000 stars visible in the sky, they would not pick up on the order of magnitude error either. Many people would just assume that was true. The only reason that I even noticed is that since I am into astronomy I have seen that figure (4000) before. Even so, I have never actually tried to count the stars. ANd if I had never read that somewhere, I would not have questioned the number either - even though I have spent quite a number of hours studying the sky (in real and in charts).
So ,yeah, a handfull of sand has a lot more grains in it then visible stars in the sky.
These people were desert nomads. Certainly they were familiar with the night sky, for knowledge of the seasons and such, but they did not map the sky. I wonder is your average goat herder from then could even count beyond the number of goats and sheep he had. Their knowldege of numbers was different then ours. THey did not think in terms of thousands of years, thousands of people (since they would have known only a few), thousands of miles or thousands of anything. To the minds of the people that genesis was orginally intended, anything over a few hundren was probably as close to infinity as they could imagine. TOday people talk in terms of millions, billions and trillions. THese huge numbers are part of every day life - yet we cannot really comprehend them. Even though we are accustomed to numbers larger then were used in the past, we would see a couple of thousand stars in a desert sky and think they were infinite too.
Think of this. When you originally posted the number 37000 stars it was probably the result of a typo. The original number may have been 3700. Whether that was your mistake or someone elses is not the point. The point is you did not question the huge number 37000. Most people would not have. I bet if you told alot of people that there were 37000 stars visible in the sky, they would not pick up on the order of magnitude error either. Many people would just assume that was true. The only reason that I even noticed is that since I am into astronomy I have seen that figure (4000) before. Even so, I have never actually tried to count the stars. ANd if I had never read that somewhere, I would not have questioned the number either - even though I have spent quite a number of hours studying the sky (in real and in charts).
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Sorry, I meant 3,700.
The structure is what I wanted to talk about. What say you?
Blessings
The structure is what I wanted to talk about. What say you?
Blessings
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Three stars exist in a perfectly straight line in space. For the sake of argument, suppose that the middle star is larger than the end stars. Do the end stars shine upon one another?
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One star would shine on the center star and the center star would shine on the other.
action at a distance
That one event could have direct causal influence on another spatially separated from it without causation being propagated continuously from point to point has often been met with scepticism. In the nineteenth century field theories 'filled in' the causation between particles with spatially continuous fields. But field theories have their own problems, especially with the interaction of the source particle of the field with its own generated field. These have led to contemporary action at a distance theories of interaction. In order to conform to the observed facts and to relativity, these must posit a time delay between cause and spatially distant effect. In order to account for the behaviour of the source, both retarded and advanced effects must be posited. While the denial of action at a distance is built into quantum field theory and into many accounts of causation (Hume, Reichenbach, Salmon), the famous space - like correlations of quantum mechanics are a difficulty for those who deny action at a distance.
_L.S.
_See also Causality.
Bibliography _P. Davies, The Physics of Time Asymmetry (Berkeley, Calif., 1974), sect. 5.8.
_J. Earman, A Primer of Determinism (Dordrecht, 1986), ch. 4, sects. 7, 8.
The Oxford Companion to Philosophy, © Oxford University Press 1995
When I see the solar wind on the earth I wonder. Jesus taught me that giving is good. Giving light is a wonderful concept -- how does that happen?
Show me a straight line in the cosmological system and I will answer your question.
action at a distance
That one event could have direct causal influence on another spatially separated from it without causation being propagated continuously from point to point has often been met with scepticism. In the nineteenth century field theories 'filled in' the causation between particles with spatially continuous fields. But field theories have their own problems, especially with the interaction of the source particle of the field with its own generated field. These have led to contemporary action at a distance theories of interaction. In order to conform to the observed facts and to relativity, these must posit a time delay between cause and spatially distant effect. In order to account for the behaviour of the source, both retarded and advanced effects must be posited. While the denial of action at a distance is built into quantum field theory and into many accounts of causation (Hume, Reichenbach, Salmon), the famous space - like correlations of quantum mechanics are a difficulty for those who deny action at a distance.
_L.S.
_See also Causality.
Bibliography _P. Davies, The Physics of Time Asymmetry (Berkeley, Calif., 1974), sect. 5.8.
_J. Earman, A Primer of Determinism (Dordrecht, 1986), ch. 4, sects. 7, 8.
The Oxford Companion to Philosophy, © Oxford University Press 1995
When I see the solar wind on the earth I wonder. Jesus taught me that giving is good. Giving light is a wonderful concept -- how does that happen?
Show me a straight line in the cosmological system and I will answer your question.
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I have the bulk of this comment in another thread. Hope it is ok to have it here as well.
Every star shines on every star. Each star shines in every direction. Unless something is in the way each star shines on every other star. We can see thirty-seven(?) hundred stars shining on our sun with our naked eye. We can see the stars and because of our earthly placement with the sun we can probably agree that the stars we see are shining on the sun and the sun is shining on the other stars because the sun is a star. There is a structure there -- a universal structure -- a structure of light. That structure gives life because light is required for life. The Bible says that God formed the light. The Bible also says that God is Spirit and Light. I understand that it requires spiritual light to form the physical light. I think that is cool.
There are people who have life in them. That life is (according to the Bible) light. Also, the Bible says that God is light and life. That life and light is love according to the Bible. The people who believe have love in them and that love shines from them to each other as does the stars in the heaven shine on each other.
Something created that light and love and life. Could have been chance. Whatever -- I call it God. God is spirit according to the Bible. From God came the physical universe. First the physical light was formed and then the stars and the earth and mankind. You may call that process evolution if you like -- I call it creation. If God is chance, so be it. I cannot understand how chance can create life. I can understand a giving loving entity creating life. I am alive. I have love in me. I am learning how to give. I am begining to understand that if humankind will walk toward love we will have life forever. The Bible taught me that. The man who helped me believe it is Jesus. I studied physics and optics for 25 years and none of the men and women in that community taught me that if we walk toward love we will see a kingdom that all men who believe can live in forever. Jesus is my Saviour. He brought me out of the darkness of the "big bang" and into the light of life. It doesn't matter if Jesus was a real man, it only matters that I can see the Kingdom coming because it is the only way for man to survive and I believe we will make that choice. However, because I have been given the knowledge of the excellency of Jesus Christ I can and do believe He is alive. That is more cool than thinking about all the things I used to think. I now have some Joy.
Blessings
Every star shines on every star. Each star shines in every direction. Unless something is in the way each star shines on every other star. We can see thirty-seven(?) hundred stars shining on our sun with our naked eye. We can see the stars and because of our earthly placement with the sun we can probably agree that the stars we see are shining on the sun and the sun is shining on the other stars because the sun is a star. There is a structure there -- a universal structure -- a structure of light. That structure gives life because light is required for life. The Bible says that God formed the light. The Bible also says that God is Spirit and Light. I understand that it requires spiritual light to form the physical light. I think that is cool.
There are people who have life in them. That life is (according to the Bible) light. Also, the Bible says that God is light and life. That life and light is love according to the Bible. The people who believe have love in them and that love shines from them to each other as does the stars in the heaven shine on each other.
Something created that light and love and life. Could have been chance. Whatever -- I call it God. God is spirit according to the Bible. From God came the physical universe. First the physical light was formed and then the stars and the earth and mankind. You may call that process evolution if you like -- I call it creation. If God is chance, so be it. I cannot understand how chance can create life. I can understand a giving loving entity creating life. I am alive. I have love in me. I am learning how to give. I am begining to understand that if humankind will walk toward love we will have life forever. The Bible taught me that. The man who helped me believe it is Jesus. I studied physics and optics for 25 years and none of the men and women in that community taught me that if we walk toward love we will see a kingdom that all men who believe can live in forever. Jesus is my Saviour. He brought me out of the darkness of the "big bang" and into the light of life. It doesn't matter if Jesus was a real man, it only matters that I can see the Kingdom coming because it is the only way for man to survive and I believe we will make that choice. However, because I have been given the knowledge of the excellency of Jesus Christ I can and do believe He is alive. That is more cool than thinking about all the things I used to think. I now have some Joy.
Blessings
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If every star shone on another, then the sum of light from all stars would illuminate the earth at night as the Sun does during the day. This is known as Olber's paradox. Of course, there is a reason why they do not illuminate the night sky as if it were daytime.
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