Speak lovingly of Mary

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

Then she died but she had her memory's just the same as you and me. Chosen by God his Father to give birth to his Son Praise God, but then your church follows Babylonian tradition the doctrines of men, making her the Queen of Heaven,

Actually it isn't a Babylonian tradition it's a Jewish tradition. The Queen is not the wife of the King but the mother of the King.

Peace

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

bbbbbbb said:
Let's just face reality for a change, folks and let everyone agree that Jesus and none of the Apostles ever taught such a thing. Just because someone makes a dogmatic statement that is utterly unsubstantiated should not mean that he cannot gracefully admit his error. That is exactly what has happened here. It is time to move on now that we all know the lack of sbustantiation and evidence for the assertion.

We could also agree that none of them taught the about the Trinity either.

Peace

Rick Otto · Aug 27, 2008

lionroar0 said:
Actually it isn't a Babylonian tradition it's a Jewish tradition.
Peace

Would it date from about oh, say, the Babylonian captivity?

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

Rick Otto said:
Six of one, half-dozen of the other.
Dime-a-dozen is retail. I can get ya wholesale (I know a guy who knows a guy).
So is Mary bein' Mediatrix an agenda-driven decontextualisation?

It's an agenda that's being forwarded by some Catholics as an official title and they are pushing it to be a 5th dogma of the Church.

I would be one that votes no.

Yes I think that Mary being Madiatrix is decontextualisation of the person of Mary.

IMO. It's taking something that all Catholics already belive under the Dogma of Mary being the Mother of God and raising it to something just causes confusion.

Yes Mary does intercesdes for us. All of the Saints in heaven intercese for us.
She has a special place of honor amongst the Saints, because she's the Mother of God. They are taking this one thing and running with it to only God knows where.

There's a bunch of things that are not defined with that title.

Like what does Mediatrix of all graces mean?

Does it mean that she does mediates all grace, then what about the Holy Spirit? What is her role as Mediatrix of grace?

How does she mediate all graces?

I could go on and on, on what's not defined and causing confusion with in the CC as well as with out.

It also reminds me of modalism.

I personally do not embrace that title and I don't have to.

Peace

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

Rick Otto said:
Would it date from about oh, say, the Babylonian captivity?

Don't know. Good question though.

I do know that there is an example in the OT with Solomon getting a throne for his mother.

19 When Bathsheba went to King Solomon to speak to him for Adonijah, the king stood up to meet her, bowed down to her and sat down on his throne. He had a throne brought for the king's mother, and she sat down at his right hand.

I think this is before the Babylonian exile.

Peace

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

NoDoubt said:
ANYONE who thinks they are seeing visions of a woman who died 2000 years ago are delving into occult practices. The mulsims are slowly warming up to it because they like that.

Do NOT trust ANY VISIONS. I cannot understand how someone who call themselves christians can fall on their faces and get into a trance in front of an apparition!!! OCCULT!!!!! BABYLON!!!! RUN AWAY!

This is not from God! The deception is getting strong.

2 Thessalonians 11-14
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

2 Corinthians 11:14
for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.

I've heard her say "pray to me" ...Pray to me???? What kind of deception is that??? Mary is not speaking to you!!! You are being deceived! You are going into occult practices. Pray to God and Jesus ONLY!!!!

And the Scriptures also state otherwise.

Acts 2
17" 'In the last days, God says,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your young men will see visions,
your old men will dream dreams.
18Even on my servants, both men and women,
I will pour out my Spirit in those days,
and they will prophesy.
19I will show wonders in the heaven above
and signs on the earth below,
blood and fire and billows of smoke.
20The sun will be turned to darkness
and the moon to blood
before the coming of the great and glorious day of the Lord.
21And everyone who calls
on the name of the Lord will be saved.'

Peace

Rick Otto · Aug 27, 2008

lionroar0 said:
I do know that there is an example in the OT with Solomon getting a throne for his mother.

The only throne I own is porcelain.

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

bbbbbbb said:
I am frankly nonplussed at all the effort this relatively simple question has required. You should have simply and frankly answered the question as "No" when it was first asked. If you wished to explicate on your answer as you have now done, that might help matters - or not. However, a simple answer in the negative with a possible explanation would have been sufficient, allowing us to move along with this thread,

It seems that people don't get it and still don't.

Maybe there was a reason for my explication

Peace

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

Rick Otto said:
The only throne I own is porcelain.

lol

Peace

hogndog · Aug 27, 2008

sunlover1 said:
Other than tennis?
No contest.
Love ALWAYS wins baby!!!
8 Love never fails

Interesting.
Hogndog!
(Saw your name so stopped by to say hey)

Hey Son Lover enjoying the activities

lionroar0 · Aug 27, 2008

I found this informative tid bit about pentecostalism.

http://www.falsedoctrineexposed.com/?p=8

Why do pentecostals belive their experiences are above the Word of God??

Peace

Rick Otto · Aug 27, 2008

lionroar0 said:
Why do pentecostals belive their experiences are above the Word of God??

Tradition?

sunlover1 · Aug 27, 2008

lionroar0 said:
I found this informative tid bit about pentecostalism.

http://www.falsedoctrineexposed.com/?p=8

Why do pentecostals belive their experiences are above the Word of God??

Peace

Hey now. I think I might be half pentecostal on my
great granny's side.
Howdy Lion!
Anyone who believes their experiences are above the Word
of God are deluded. And we all know that many of us
are deluded in some area.
That's why it's loving for all of us to help each other.
IMO, prayer yields the best results, but I love to
discuss anyhow. Keeps me off the streets.

hogndog · Aug 28, 2008

lionroar0 said:
I found this informative tid bit about pentecostalism.

http://www.falsedoctrineexposed.com/?p=8

Why do pentecostals belive their experiences are above the Word of God??

Peace

Either something is wrong with my pooter or you said you knew some Pentecostals that thought they were above Gods word :o

Thanks,
hogndog

Hi Son lover!

katholikos · Aug 30, 2008

WarriorAngel said:
Speak lovingly of Mary

God Who made the sun also made the moon. The moon does not take away from the brilliance of the sun. The moon would be only a burned-out cinder floating in the immensity of space, were it not for the sun. All its light is reflected from that glowing furnace. In like manner, Mary reflects her Divine Son, without whom she is nothing. On dark nights we are thankful for the moon; when we see it shining, we know there must be a sun. So, in this dark night of the world, when men turned their backs on Him who is the Light of the World, we look to Mary to guide our feet while we await the sunrise.

Fulton Sheen, Treasure in Clay - The Autobiography of Fulton J. Sheen, Image Books 1982

MamaZ · Aug 30, 2008

katholikos said:
God Who made the sun also made the moon. The moon does not take away from the brilliance of the sun. The moon would be only a burned-out cinder floating in the immensity of space, were it not for the sun. All its light is reflected from that glowing furnace. In like manner, Mary reflects her Divine Son, without whom she is nothing. On dark nights we are thankful for the moon; when we see it shining, we know there must be a sun. So, in this dark night of the world, when men turned their backs on Him who is the Light of the World, we look to Mary to guide our feet while we await the sunrise.

Fulton Sheen, Treasure in Clay - The Autobiography of Fulton J. Sheen, Image Books 1982

All Christians are to reflect Christ for we are born of His nature when we are born again.

katholikos · Aug 30, 2008

MamaZ said:
All Christians are to reflect Christ for we are born of His nature when we are born again.

Okay, no argument there.
But who reflects a child more than his own mother? Do you have any children? Can you imagine anyone loving your children more than you do? Do you not see yourself in your own child's eyes?

This quote is a bit of poetry. It wasn't written with theological accuracy in mind. It was written in the language of "Love".

God Who made the sun also made the moon. The moon does not take away from the brilliance of the sun. The moon would be only a burned-out cinder floating in the immensity of space, were it not for the sun. All its light is reflected from that glowing furnace. In like manner, Mary reflects her Divine Son, without whom she is nothing. On dark nights we are thankful for the moon; when we see it shining, we know there must be a sun. So, in this dark night of the world, when men turned their backs on Him who is the Light of the World, we look to Mary to guide our feet while we await the sunrise

Amylisa · Aug 30, 2008

I love your signature quote from CS Lewis, MamaZ. That's awesome.

CaliforniaJosiah · Aug 30, 2008

katholikos said:
But who reflects a child more than his own mother?

1. While I'd be that LAST to question a female parent's love for her child, I disagree with your premise that no one loves a child as much or more.

2. I'm just at a loss to understand how the reality of your love for your child(ren) THEREFORE means that it's loving toward you for all to dogmatically spread unsubstantiated reports (rumors) about you, and thus it's loving to do so about Mary.

3. It is my humble personal opinion that love involves respect and that respect involves truth. While my mum does love me, if she told everyone as dogmatic truth that I'm sinless, have 8 Olympic Gold Metals in swimming, and was voted "Best Looking Man of the Year" then while her intentions may be good, she'd, in fact, be lying on all 3 counts. This would not honor or please me, it would embarrass and disturb me. Lies aren't loving. No matter how well intended, IMHO.

Thank you.

Pax

- Josiah

.

MamaZ · Aug 30, 2008

Amylisa said:
I love your signature quote from CS Lewis, MamaZ. That's awesome.

Thank you

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