Southern Baptist Membership Declines for 7th Year.

[JGL53]

Southern Baptist membership declines for 7th year

I think we all saw this coming.

 

[Lost Angel]

Time to pray for the churches and have some good old fire and brimstone revivals.

 

[Purge187]

I recall reading some blatantly anti-Semitic quotes from some prominent SBC leaders a few years back. They'd be wise to heed Paul's warning:

[bless and do not curse]"If some of the branches have been broken off,[bless and do not curse]and you, though a wild olive shoot, have been grafted in among the others[bless and do not curse]and now share in the nourishing sap from the olive root,[bless and do not curse]do not consider yourself to be superior to those other branches. If you do, consider this: You do not support the root, but the root supports you.[bless and do not curse]You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith.[bless and do not curse]Do not be arrogant,[bless and do not curse]but tremble.[bless and do not curse]For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either."

 

[ThisBrotherOfHis]

When the OP and poster #3 care to actually learn something about the SBC rather than buying into fourth-hand garbage, perhaps there will be some intelligent discussion here. Otherwise ...

And LA? "Good old fashioned fire-and-brimstone revivals" utterly fail in any valid effort to win souls to Christ. People don't respond to threats of hell and dying, even though those things are very real, and the eternal fate of the unredeemed sinner. But people do respond to Christ's love, and the love that we show them. When we know them somewhat better than "Hi, what's your name?" we can share the truth with them, and they will be willing to accept it.

 

[cow451]

Southern Baptist membership declines for 7th year

I think we all saw this coming.

Church is changing as the world changes. The younger adults are less impressed by the old Sunday School, Worship, Training Union (anybody still have this?), Worship Again Sundays and the midweek Worship model.

The SBC church I have been attending has a class for people seeking membership, rather than just the Altar Call Sign-up. There is more focus on service and making relationships on a personal level. Young adults are so bereft of social skills, it takes a different type outreach to connect (which includes social media).

That said, there is still the old anti-gay rhetoric, anti catholic, anti-Islam, etc. (toned down twelve notches). And a smattering of YEC.

What I've seen that is surprising is a total lack of political rhetoric from the pulpit. And I have no doubt there are few Obama supporters among the leadership.

I don't know how typical these changes are, but the younger pastors (that go to actual college/seminary) are being trained differently.

 

[SaphireOwl]

Southern Baptist membership declines for 7th year

I think we all saw this coming.

Who would be the, "we" you speak of?

I agree. A revival is what is needed here. Southern Baptists may be declining but that is only because those not called to the service are leaving. They would not benefit the church anyway. Wheat from the chafe.

 

[iluvatar5150]

When the OP and poster #3 care to actually learn something about the SBC rather than buying into fourth-hand garbage, perhaps there will be some intelligent discussion here. Otherwise ...

I've attended SBC churches my entire life and I grow increasingly appalled at the cluelessness, legalism, and occasional outright bigotry coming from the leaders of the denomination. Albert Mohler in particular (the President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary) has had some doozies.

I don't recall anything specifically anti-semitic, but then, I gave up listening to these guys a long time ago. I have, however, read many things that are anti-women and anti-gay that go far, far outside the bounds of lovingly defining Biblical gender roles and sexuality.

I'm relocating soon and I'm skeptical that my next church will be affiliated with the SBC, which is unfortunate, because I've generally found the people to be very nice and I appreciate their stated devotion to correct doctrine.

And LA? "Good old fashioned fire-and-brimstone revivals" utterly fail in any valid effort to win souls to Christ. People don't respond to threats of hell and dying, even though those things are very real, and the eternal fate of the unredeemed sinner. But people do respond to Christ's love, and the love that we show them. When we know them somewhat better than "Hi, what's your name?" we can share the truth with them, and they will be willing to accept it.

I agree. Unfortunately, "fire and brimstone" has been a mainstay of the southern baptist church for a long time. I'd argue that it's become a crutch and that they've lost their ability to relate to the culture in a way that is honest; instead choosing to wield their influence through legalism and fear.

I don't generally like bringing stereotypes into discussions, but the SBC is, by-and-large run by older, southern white guys who grew up in a time when and a place where straight, white men ran the show and blacks, women, gays, and other minorities were relegated to various sub-optimal tiers of society, and kept in line by their straight, white male leaders. The SBC has gotten better over the years, but they've definitely been dragged into the arena of loving equality rather than leading the way into it. As the "straight white male" has lost his dominance on the greater society, so has the SBC lost its appeal.

 

[iluvatar5150]

What I've seen that is surprising is a total lack of political rhetoric from the pulpit. And I have no doubt there are few Obama supporters among the leadership.

I don't know how typical these changes are, but the younger pastors (that go to actual college/seminary) are being trained differently.

IME, this is very site-specific. I go to a smaller SBC church in Boston, which is about the least "SBC" church you could imagine - aside from some doctrinal beliefs and the names on some paperwork, you'd never guess that we were affiliated with the SBC. (for example, we have many craft beer enthusiasts and a couple avid home-brewers, despite the SBC's rigid stance on alcohol and their prohibition of us bringing alcohol into the church building). The sermons are never political (abortion might come up once a year, and I think I've heard homosexuality mentioned once) and any time politics are mentioned, the parties and specific legislation are handled a very evenly and almost dismissed as being somewhat irrelevant in the eternal sense. The congregation is full of highly-educated academics (I often joke about wanting to get my master's just to fit in) and I think they'd leave en masse if the church took a really hard stance on something extra-biblical.

My parents' SBC church, OTOH, is very political. Basically, if it comes from Dobson or whomever the current conservative radio darlings are these days, it'll come from the pulpit.

I'd be surprised if anybody studying under Albert Mohler came out of seminary being non-politcal.

 

[Optimus Fortis]

No-one has mentioned demographics as a reason of this decline.

Normally when denominations report a decline in membership it is due to 'anything goes liberalism' - something that I doubt the SBC or any Baptist union is guilty of.

 

[South Bound]

Southern Baptist membership declines for 7th year

I think we all saw this coming.

Honestly? I'm OK with this because it's pretty well known that SBC numbers are highly inflated to begin with.

I think the question to be asked isn't how many are leaving, but who is leaving. Are the ones leaving the ones who are active, who are preparing for and engaging in ministry? Or are they the ones who got caught in the wide "just repeat this prayer after me" net and then, a little while later, because it was just a social gathering to them, got bored and left?

We've seen for a long time, and many Baptist leaders have pointed out, that our attendance numbers weren't anywhere near our membership numbers.

In our church, we just removed forty people for non-attendance. When our church first started, there was an explosive growth (24 members to 350 in about five years) because there was a need for a Protestant, Reformed, Bible preaching and teaching church in our community. So we always understood that some people would have joined just because we were the only ones there.

But the people we removed, and I know this will sound harsh, but as much as we will miss them personally, their absence really won't affect the life of the church because they weren't active, anyway.

I suspect this is what's going on elsewhere in the SBC, particularly since so much of the SBC is Arminian and don't have much in the way of requirements to join.

The trend, not just in the SBC, but in the Church, in general, these days, is "Big door in front, small door in back" (that is, easy to become a member, virtually impossible to lose membership) when, in fact, it should be just the opposite: "Small door in front, big door in back".

 

[ThisBrotherOfHis]

I've attended SBC churches my entire life and I grow increasingly appalled at the cluelessness, legalism, and occasional outright bigotry coming from the leaders of the denomination.

I'd have to say you're clueless as to what actually comes out of the SBC leadership, if this is how you view what they are saying.

I don't recall anything specifically anti-semitic, but then, I gave up listening to these guys a long time ago.

You don't listen to what they say, but you "know it" to be bigoted??

Like I said, when people actually want to learn something about the SBC instead of going off fourth-hand garbage, there might be some intelligent discussion here. Except for a couple comments, I haven't seen any yet.

 

[JGL53]

Who would be the, "we" you speak of?

I agree. A revival is what is needed here. Southern Baptists may be declining but that is only because those not called to the service are leaving. They would not benefit the church anyway. Wheat from the chafe.

By "we" I meant all who have eyes to see and ears to hear.

Those who like the way the S.B. have been going in the last 25 years or so will certainly stay. Those among them who are put off by this will leave.

It seems more are catching on to what's going on with the S.B church than not. Why wouldn't this eventually happen - that is the question.

I myself missed all the "fun" because I left the S.B. church way back before that was cool - in 1977.

Do I have to go through the litany of reasons why they are headed to the dustbin of religious history? No. Some posters about have already listed the major ways this particular group of sheep have strayed.

No one has mentioned it so I will add another example of utter tone-deafness of the S.B. leadership - the public pronouncements along the lines of "the man is head of the family - and women are to OBEY their husbands."

As I am not a woman I can only imagine the reaction to this of MANY women. If a woman I imagine I would walk out the door at this point and wander down the street to see what the Episcopalians or Methodists or whatever were up to these days. lol.

Some minority of religious people will always get their jollies from the "Sinners in the hands of an angry god" rhetoric. Those people will remain southern baptists or in similar denominations. The majority has moved on, is moving on, or will be moving on shortly.

All the threats in the world will not change this.

I'm just saying.

 

[South Bound]

No one has mentioned it so I will add another example of utter tone-deafness of the S.B. leadership - the public pronouncements along the lines of "the man is head of the family - and women are to OBEY their husbands."

A Christian church quoting the Bible??? Oy gevalt!

As I am not a woman I can only imagine the reaction to this of MANY women. If a woman I imagine I would walk out the door at this point and wander down the street to see what the Episcopalians or Methodists or whatever were up to these days. lol.

What if the Episcopalians or Methodists were preaching the Bible, as well? (Stop laughing, everybody. It could happen.)

Some minority of religious people will always get their jollies from the "Sinners in the hands of an angry god" rhetoric. Those people will remain southern baptists or in similar denominations. The majority has moved on, is moving on, or will be moving on shortly.

I see. So then, you disagree with the Bible when it says that God's wrath abides on the wicked?

 

[ThisBrotherOfHis]

No one has mentioned it so I will add another example of utter tone-deafness of the S.B. leadership - the public pronouncements along the lines of "the man is head of the family - and women are to OBEY their husbands."

From the way you've quoted this, it is obvious you haven't a clue what it means in a biblical context, and don't understand that it is far more honoring to the wife than anything the feminists have every suggested. You have no clue that this headship is not about having the upper hand, nor is it to mean that a woman has no rights or is a second-class citizen. On the contrary, God tells the husband some very serious commands:

Ephesians 5, NASB
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her,
26 so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word,
27 that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless.
​

The headship issue is an issue of order -- not of who is better or more important. The husband is the head of the wife in the family, and he has the responsibility of guiding his family to a closer relationship with the Lord. God will require it of him on the day when all our deeds are judged by God. If he fails, forcing his wife to take that leadership role with herself and her children, the man will suffer great chastisement -- loss of heavenly reward, perhaps being cast into the "outer darkness" of heaven. Again, I don't expect anyone here to understand this, but maybe it will spark some interest in finding out what the SBC and the Bible actually say.

But for the most part this is again, fourth-hand garbage being attested to as "fact."

 

[Joykins]

No-one has mentioned demographics as a reason of this decline.

Normally when denominations report a decline in membership it is due to 'anything goes liberalism' - something that I doubt the SBC or any Baptist union is guilty of.

Maybe the SBC and similar denominations have completed the process of sucking the conservatives out of the mainline denominations and are now stuck with creating converts from scratch? No?

 

[cow451]

No-one has mentioned demographics as a reason of this decline.

My comments about the "changing of the guard" in the SBC reflect that young adults, even conservative ones are less about using "2 X 4" evangelism and are turned opff by the political activities of their parents' churches and related institutions. They have grown up with friends that have been "out" and have friends that have been deployed in war zones, some of whom did not return whole or at all.

 

[Savior2006]

No-one has mentioned demographics as a reason of this decline.

Normally when denominations report a decline in membership it is due to 'anything goes liberalism' - something that I doubt the SBC or any Baptist union is guilty of.

What exactly is "anything goes liberalism?"
That's a new one.

 

[cow451]

SBC President Russell Moore (age 42):

"When I hear people who are simply screaming in outrage right now, let me tell you what I hear," he says, "I hear losers."
Moore says instead of waging war on homosexuality, Baptists should accept that their view of marriage puts them in the minority of Americans.
"We're living in a different time, where we have to learn how to understand what's going on in the world around us," he says.

 

[Supreme]

They still have a huge membership, and I expect that they're very popular throughout the South and will continue to be so for some time. My church currently is Baptist (not Southern Baptist, as I'm English), but I'm the sort who'd go to any church service, so long as it was amiable and was preaching a good Word.

 

[ThisBrotherOfHis]

Maybe the SBC and similar denominations have completed the process of sucking the conservatives out of the mainline denominations and are now stuck with creating converts from scratch? No?

No.