So do you really beleive there are "unfallen beings" on other worlds?

[Lebesgue]

The Bible is actually SILENT on this the only mention of other beings is of Angels.

I actually believe that G-d made us SO SPECIAL we are it as far as life and there is no unfallen extraterrestrial life out there.

The Word says, "The WHOLE of creation groans because of Adam's sin". That to me means WE are the WHOLE of creation.

Plus science has found there are over 200 design characteristics for life to be possible on a planet and the chances of any other planet than earth having life appear to be slim to nil.

I am just throwing this out to generate some thought.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[JonMiller]

Yes, I think that aliens exist. Yes, I could imagine them being unfallen (and would prefer them to be, the unverise would be much more complicated if they weren't.. athough it wouldn't shake my beleif if they werern't).

JM

 

[reddogs]

The Bible is actually SILENT on this the only mention of other beings is of Angels.

I actually believe that G-d made us SO SPECIAL we are it as far as life and there is no unfallen extraterrestrial life out there.

The Word says, "The WHOLE of creation groans because of Adam's sin". That to me means WE are the WHOLE of creation.

Plus science has found there are over 200 design characteristics for life to be possible on a planet and the chances of any other planet than earth having life appear to be slim to nil.

I am just throwing this out to generate some thought.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

I dont know why anyone would think there was a restriction on God from being able to populate the universe the same as He told man to do on earth.......

Red

(and your questions are thought provoking and enjoyable break from the usual....)

 

[Jimlarmore]

The Bible is actually SILENT on this the only mention of other beings is of Angels.

I actually believe that G-d made us SO SPECIAL we are it as far as life and there is no unfallen extraterrestrial life out there.

The Word says, "The WHOLE of creation groans because of Adam's sin". That to me means WE are the WHOLE of creation.

Plus science has found there are over 200 design characteristics for life to be possible on a planet and the chances of any other planet than earth having life appear to be slim to nil.

I am just throwing this out to generate some thought.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

If you read the book favored planet you will find that there is actually more than 200 characteristics that make life possible. To me this is evidence that an intelligent creator made this planet inhabitable for us. The Bible mentions the sons of God coming together in heaven to meet God in Job 1. These could be intelligent beings other than angels. I do sincerely believe that there are possible trillions of other intelligent and sinless beings out there in this vast universe.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[Cribstyl]

If you read the book favored planet you will find that there is actually more than 200 characteristics that make life possible. To me this is evidence that an intelligent creator made this planet inhabitable for us. The Bible mentions the sons of God coming together in heaven to meet God in Job 1. These could be intelligent beings other than angels. I do sincerely believe that there are possible trillions of other intelligent and sinless beings out there in this vast universe.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

"SONS OF GOD" in the book of Job is most likely talking about angels.
Job 1:6Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them.

Satan is a fallen angel and the accuser of humanity. He came along with the OTHER angels Hbr 1:14

Job 2:1¶Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the LORD.

Job 2:2And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.

Notice that Satan's place in on the earth haven been cast down. Why would he not try to corrupt other worlds if there was life there?
To assume that Satan was the angel that represented the earth, and the other Sons of God (angels) or (aliens) repesented other planets is a stretch of the imagination. The other angels were God's angels concerning humanity or else satan has power over the earth and represents the earth.Mat 18:10¶Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven.

That meeting place is heaven where the angels continually minister on behalf of men
Hbr 1:13But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
Hbr 1:14Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Angels are for those creature who need to be saved...MEN


It's my opinion that there are some text that does not establish clear doctrine, so unless scripture intepret scriptures we should be careful what we adopt as truth. Satan does not represent God's people in the earth.


CRIB

 

[Adventist Dissident]

The Bible is actually SILENT on this the only mention of other beings is of Angels.

I actually believe that G-d made us SO SPECIAL we are it as far as life and there is no unfallen extraterrestrial life out there.

The Word says, "The WHOLE of creation groans because of Adam's sin". That to me means WE are the WHOLE of creation.

Plus science has found there are over 200 design characteristics for life to be possible on a planet and the chances of any other planet than earth having life appear to be slim to nil.

I am just throwing this out to generate some thought.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

do you really think we are the only one's in the universe?

 

[Lebesgue]

do you really think we are the only one's in the universe?

I think it is quite likely. Watch the DVD "The Priviledged Planet" which is by a Christian astronomer Dr. Gullermo Gonzalez. Dr. Hugh Ross is also of a similar opinion.

I believe G-d made is SO SPECIAL we are it and He made everything in the Universe just so we could live on this earth.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[Jimlarmore]

There is a few holes in Crib's arguement. One is that the fact that satan being a fallen angel does not mean the other "sons of God" that came to meet in heaven were all angels as well. It's actually a logical conclusion to think that they were representatives of other worlds. The second hole in Crib's arguement is that Christ Himself said when He was about to offered on the cross that "now is the time that the prince of this world will be cast out/down." When Adam and Eve fell they turned over the dominion they had over the earth to satan.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[sentipente]

Sometimes I wonder if we are not so busy thinking of otther things that we don't take time to think about the Creator. Is God so stupid that He does not know who has a right to come before Him? How would a foreign agent gain entrance? Instead of just accepting the words on the page why not take a closer look at the message.

 

[Lebesgue]

Sometimes I wonder if we are not so busy thinking of otther things that we don't take time to think about the Creator. Is God so stupid that He does not know who has a right to come before Him? How would a foreign agent gain entrance? Instead of just accepting the words on the page why not take a closer look at the message.

You make an excellent point, sentipente.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[djconklin]

Satan does not represent God's people in the earth.

No one said that he did. He positions himself as if to represent the earth. There's more than just God's people on this earth.

 

[tall73]

Lol, Reb, you been reading your proclamation magazine again?

 

[StormyOne]

Horton would say, "Most definitely!"

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

First let us be clear just because there is the story of Adam and Eve's fall that does not mean they gave dominion of God's world to Satan. Jim asserts that idea but it has no Biblical support. The Old testament is pretty clear that the world and all that is in it is God's. As the Psalmist says:

(Psa 50:9 NIV) I have no need of a bull from your stall or of goats from your pens, (Psa 50:10 NIV) for every animal of the forest is mine, and the cattle on a thousand hills. (Psa 50:11 NIV) I know every bird in the mountains, and the creatures of the field are mine.

Why we even have a song "This is my Father's World" based upon this idea.

Satan is called the "prince of this world" because of those who follow him not by some type of right that Satan was given. Even though in Church history this idea was once held. It developed into the Ransom theory whereby Christ death was a ransom paid to Satan to free man. Which is a sad bit of Biblical misinterpretation that unfortunately lives on in some SDA's. Here is what I wrote about this a while ago.

[FONT=Verdana,Arial,Helvetica]The latest piece of Drivel from the Adventist Review:
Calvary It should embarrass and disgust us. Instead it gives us joy. Why?

Except:
Satan had challenged Jesus' resurrection of Moses on Mount Nebo (see Jude 9); and legally Satan had a point. Moses had been a sinner, and as such he belonged to Satan. Jesus had no legal right to take him to heaven. And Enoch and Elijah, who are also in heaven, had no legal right to be there either, for they too had been sinners. All three were there on credit, as it were, for the
redemption price had not yet been paid.

What nonsense no wonder people cling to the Substitutionary theory of the Atonement. God takes people to heaven and we say He has no legal right to save people. No wonder they can't accept forgiveness that is not legal...Satan says so. Of course it is a lie, not only that God can't freely forgive but that Satan even says God can't forgive. But to prop up absurdity often more absurdity is necessary. Obviously this has ticked me off so here is my letter to the Editor of the Review. Probably too contemptuous of them to get printed either on paper or online but it needs to be said.

What has become of the Christian church? Has it lost it’s ability to reason, since when have we allowed gratuitous assertions to be used as the basis for doctrines. Consider Arnold V. Wallenkampf’s article recently where he says:
“Satan had challenged Jesus' resurrection of Moses on Mount Nebo (see Jude 9); and legally Satan had a point. Moses had been a sinner, and as such he belonged to Satan.” Nowhere does the Bible say anything of the kind. Satan is given no more credibility then mosquito, a pest, an annoyance certainly but clearly a liar and murder from the beginning. Sure he could constantly accuse the brethren but that does not give him any legal standing. No court on heaven or earth accepts the words of known liars.

Moses the servant of God (Exodus 14:31) belongs to Satan? Where in the Bible does such a idea come. What makes a Christian Theologian produce such material? I am not blaming the late professor Wallenkampf, he is repeating what someone taught him no doubt. In fact during the early church period the Ransom Theory of the Atonement held to the idea that Satan somehow owned the world and all the people therein. That theory did not last long since it had no Biblical support. To hear it’s basic idea put forward in the 21st century in the official SDA publication is a bit of a shock though.

Even in the reference in Jude Satan is not given any credence it just says that Michael did not bring a slanderous accusation against Satan, just a simple “the Lord Rebuke you”. I want more from my church then this, I want well developed logical teaching is that too much to ask?[/FONT]

Now back to the question at had. Job says the sons of God got together. What does that mean? Ellen White says that is the angels (of course we are really only talking about this because of Ellen White) what other sons of God does God have. Well we can't answer that question from silence so any answer other then angels would be speculation as angels are something we know exist aside from human beings. So in any case the Job verse does nothing to support the idea of other unfallen beings it is just a speculation inserted into a story. Most likely a fictional story anyway. Also in the story satan is not used in the sense of a proper name it is merely a label placed to indicate an adversary.

As for the vast expanse of space and the billions of potential spots for life we can only speculate again. But in this vastness there is still a question we don't know. That is on the time frame of creation of God where are we. Are we in the beginning the middle or at the end. We simply don't know. If you say that God created many other populated unfallen worlds then you place us toward the middle or end of God's creation of sentient beings. But you could just as easily place us in the beginning as the first of the creation of populated worlds.

The Bible is however of necessity about humans and God not about supposed alien beings. Of which we know nothing and can know nothing. In fact the Bible says that it is man that God is trying to reach not angels.

(Heb 2:16 NIV) For surely it is not angels he helps, but Abraham's descendants.

So by the same reasoning it is not aliens that he helps but humans. By the way the context there is man, not merely Hebrews or their ancestry.

 

[Lebesgue]

Lol, Reb, you been reading your proclamation magazine again?

Yes, guilty as charged.

Shalom,

Lebesgue

 

[djconklin]

It is estimated that there are up to some 500 billion galaxies in this universe (assuming this is the only one); each average sized galaxy has some 100 billion suns. We now know of some 280 planets outside of this solar system. The odds are quite good that there are planets that have intelligent life on them.

 

[mva1985]

I most definitely believe in populated unfallen worlds.

 

[sentipente]

Then you also understand that the light from many of these suns has taken longer than 6,000 years.

It is estimated that there are up to some 500 billion galaxies in this universe (assuming this is the only one); each average sized galaxy has some 100 billion suns. We now know of some 280 planets outside of this solar system. The odds are quite good that there are planets that have intelligent life on them.

 

[honorthesabbath]

Of course I believe that there are other beings out there. I reason that if God is an eternal being of infinite love, then why wait possibly BILLIONS of years to create a race of flesh beings that you know at some point is going to rebel against you?

No--I see God as a being who loves to create and hates to be alone (since love is useless all by itself). I don't doubt that He is STILL making new worlds and galaxies.

 

[Lebesgue]

Of course I believe that there are other beings out there. I reason that if God is an eternal being of infinite love, then why wait possibly BILLIONS of years to create a race of flesh beings that you know at some point is going to rebel against you?

No--I see God as a being who loves to create and hates to be alone (since love is useless all by itself). I don't doubt that He is STILL making new worlds and galaxies.

Well, it's been neither proven nor disproven.

Still the amount of design characteristics(over 200) that must be met for there to be life, make it unlikely IHMO that there would be life on other planets in the Universe, but the jury isn't completely out on that yet.

I believe G-d made us so special, He made just US to fellowship and commune with Him.

Shalom,

Lebesgue