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ThanksYes, it is in line with the whole context that she saw them not heeding what was in Scripture, and she saw her writings as pointing things out to them.
But her writings are so voluminous that reading all of them proves difficult.
And if the purpose is to point people to the Bible, then they could just read it, and heed it.
The Lord desires you to study your Bibles. He has not given any additional light to take the place of His Word. This light is to bring confused minds to His Word which, if eaten and digested, is as the life-blood of the soul. Then good works will be seen as light shining in darkness. Letters and Manuscripts Volume 16 16LtMs, Lt 130, 1901
Thanks,
So you cannot find in Scriptures the teachings of "One God in three persons"?
Thanks
Just a couple of questions..
What are the things that she found that made people not pay attention to Scriptures?
So if people reads the bible on their own as she said, and it doesn't align with her writings or teachings then?
What are the things that she found that made people not pay attention to Scriptures?
Thanks,
1John 4 state we must test every "spirit" to see if they are from God, because many "false prophets have gone out into the world"...
So if people reads the bible on their own as she said, and it doesn't align with her writings or teachings then?
I was just noting that some other hypothetical Bible-based denomination that rejected that teaching (rejected the teaching about "One God" Deu 6:4 "in three persons" Matt 28:19) would be making the claim that an SDA prophet who claimed that a message from God happened to indicate that He approves of Christians believing in "One God in three persons" would be a "sign" to a member of said denomination - that the SDA prophet must not be a real prophet of God
Thank you Bob,She said everything should be tested by scripture.
for example
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"Present to the people such subjects as will strengthen their confidence in God and in His Word, and lead them to investigate its teachings for themselves. And as they go forward, step by step, in the study of the Bible, they will be better prepared to appreciate the beauty and harmony of its precious truths.—The Review and Herald, June 13, 1912. {Ev 485.1}
“(by some) The Word of God is made to appear mysterious and obscure in order to excuse transgression of His law. Christ rebuked these practices in His day. He taught that the Word of God was to be understood by all. He pointed to the Scriptures as of unquestionable authority, and we should do the same. The Bible is to be presented as the word of the infinite God, as the end of all controversy and the foundation of all faith. {ST, May 9, 1906 par. 8}
“The subject of Christ's teaching was the Word of God. He met questioners with a plain, "It is written;" "What saith the Scriptures?" "How readest thou?" At every opportunity, when an interest was awakened by either friend or foe, He sowed the seed of the Word. He who is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, Himself the living Word, points to the Scriptures, saying, "They are they which testify of Me." {ST, May 9, 1906 par. 9}
"When God’s Word is studied, comprehended, and obeyed, a bright light will be reflected to the world; new truths, received and acted upon, will bind us in strong bonds to Jesus. The Bible, and the Bible alone, is to be our creed, the sole bond of union; all who bow to this Holy Word will be in harmony. Our own views and ideas must not control our efforts. Man is fallible, but God’s Word is infallible. Instead of wrangling with one another, let men exalt the Lord. Let us meet all opposition as did our Master, saying, “It is written.” Let us lift up the banner on which is inscribed, The Bible our rule of faith and discipline.—The Review and Herald, December 15, 1885. {1SM 416.2}
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As to why the natural tendency of the human heart - the sinful nature - is toward neglect of God's Word - that is a subject we see God speaking to in both OT and NT - not just in the messages that He gave to Ellen White.
Thank you,I point to an example of that in this post
Another example would be where someone tests the Bible to see if the doctrine affirming prayers to the dead is in alignment with the Bible.
Some people will claim the Bible does support it.
Others will say that the Bible condemns it.
Adventists find that the Bible does not support it.
Thank you Bob,
She said everything must be tested by Scripture so is it fair to say that everything means including her teachings or interpretation as well?
It seems to me that the idea of paying attention to Scriptures or bible is to first read her (EG White) writings
Note that quote - "some other hypothetical Bible-based denomination that rejected that teaching (rejected the teaching about "One God" Deu 6:4 "in three persons" Matt 28:19) would be making the claim that an SDA prophet who claimed that a message from God happened to indicate that He approves of Christians believing in "One God in three persons" would be a "sign" to a member of said denomination - that the SDA prophet must not be a real prophet of God"
======
Another example would be where someone tests the Bible to see if the doctrine affirming prayers to the dead is in alignment with the Bible.
Some people will claim the Bible does support it.
Others will say that the Bible condemns it.
Adventists find that the Bible does not support it.
I point to an example of that in this post
Note that quote - "some other hypothetical Bible-based denomination that rejected that teaching (rejected the teaching about "One God" Deu 6:4 "in three persons" Matt 28:19) would be making the claim that an SDA prophet who claimed that a message from God happened to indicate that He approves of Christians believing in "One God in three persons" would be a "sign" to a member of said denomination - that the SDA prophet must not be a real prophet of God"
Another example would be where someone tests the Bible to see if the doctrine affirming prayers to the dead is in alignment with the Bible.
Some people will claim the Bible does support it.
Others will say that the Bible condemns it.
Adventists find that the Bible does not support it.
Thank you,
So the bottom line is the correct message or teachings or interpretation of Scriptures is from the Adventist church not the individual who seems to have the different view...
"Have you ever put her teachings or prophetic interpretation to the test (if it's align with Scriptures)? Just to see if she really is a prophet or someone send from God...the Berean in Acts 17:10-12 really test Paul's teachings to see if it align with Scriptures..
Thank you Bob,Yes that is exactly right. And that is why I keep saying that. So two things for Sola scriptura testing.
1. Sola Scriptura test for doctrine that was said to be endorsed by God in a vision or dream? testing that tells you if the doctrine is in line with the Bible and if the person is really getting a message from God.
2. Sola Scriptura test for doctrine or interpretation that is being promoted by any person or a denomination. If the doctrine is not in harmony with the Bible then the person or denomination promoting it - is not correct on that point.
On the contrary
1. - first read the Bible- see what it teaches.
2. Then take a look at SDA doctrinal statements and compare them to the Bible. See if they are correct according to the Bible.
3. Then if that is all found to be ok - take a look at the Bible teaching that Ellen White claimed God was not opposed to or was outright promoting. Her visions touched on several of the 28 Fundamental Beliefs - so if they are not found to be in line with scripture - then this process would end there.
This is why I keep giving that example scenario above as we saw here -
You already answer it on post#109...I don't see "the correct teaching or interpretation of scripture is from the Adventist church" in my post.
Where did you find that?
But if you mean that the Doctrine we see in the Adventist 28 Fundamental Beliefs is the doctrine studied and accepted by "the church" and not merely "discovered by any one person" in it - then you are right. It is not "the product of one person" - even though as in the case of accepting the Gospel - each individual must study for themselves and find how it compares to scripture.
Using that method - Christianity Today in its Feb 2015 article finds the SDA Christian denomination to be one of the fastest growing and 5th largest Christian body in the world.
I point to an example of that in this post
Note that quote - "some other hypothetical Bible-based denomination that rejected that teaching (rejected the teaching about "One God" Deu 6:4 "in three persons" Matt 28:19) would be making the claim that an SDA prophet who claimed that a message from God happened to indicate that He approves of Christians believing in "One God in three persons" would be a "sign" to a member of said denomination - that the SDA prophet must not be a real prophet of God"
Another example would be where someone tests the Bible to see if the doctrine affirming prayers to the dead is in alignment with the Bible.
Some people will claim the Bible does support it.
Others will say that the Bible condemns it.
Adventists find that the Bible does not support it.
Thank you,
So the bottom line is the correct message or teachings or interpretation of Scriptures is from the Adventist church not the individual who seems to have the different view...
I don't see "the correct teaching or interpretation of scripture is from the Adventist church" in my post.
Where did you find that?
But if you mean that the Doctrine we see in the Adventist 28 Fundamental Beliefs is the doctrine studied and accepted by "the church" and not merely "discovered by any one person" in it - then you are right. It is not "the product of one person" - even though as in the case of accepting the Gospel - each individual must study for themselves and find how it compares to scripture.
Using that method - Christianity Today in its Feb 2015 article finds the SDA Christian denomination to be one of the fastest growing and 5th largest Christian body in the world.
You already answer it on post#109...
"..If not in agreement with EGW teachings the process ends there"...
Yes that is exactly right. And that is why I keep saying that. So two things for Sola scriptura testing.
1. Sola Scriptura test for doctrine that was said to be endorsed by God in a vision or dream? testing that tells you if the doctrine is in line with the Bible and if the person is really getting a message from God.
2. Sola Scriptura test for doctrine or interpretation that is being promoted by any person or a denomination. If the doctrine is not in harmony with the Bible then the person or denomination promoting it - is not correct on that point.
On the contrary
1. - first read the Bible- see what it teaches.
2. Then take a look at SDA doctrinal statements and compare them to the Bible. See if they are correct according to the Bible.
3. Then if that is all found to be ok - take a look at the Bible teaching that Ellen White claimed God was not opposed to or was outright promoting. Her visions touched on several of the 28 Fundamental Beliefs - so if they are not found to be in line with scripture - then this process would end there.
This is why I keep giving that example scenario above as we saw here -
Oh yes you're right! Thank you Bob..That is not what post 109 says. (Though it might be what some folks might have "wished" it said)
that post says --
1. - first read the Bible- see what it teaches.
2. Then take a look at SDA doctrinal statements and compare them to the Bible. See if they are correct according to the Bible.
3. Then if that is all found to be ok - take a look at the Bible teaching that Ellen White claimed God was not opposed to or was outright promoting. Her visions touched on several of the 28 Fundamental Beliefs - so if they are not found to be in line with scripture - then this process would end there.
The post says that only after reading your Bible and finding Bible doctrine, and after looking at the official doctrines of the SDA denomination - testing them sola scripture, and then after finding that all that checks out - you then get the test for Ellen White that you are focused on where the test is done as with step 2.... "sola scriptura".
Thank you Bob,
Yes, but sola Scriptura test on her teachings, visions etc always pass the test within your own denomination
but others who have the same Scripture (bible) rejected some of her teachings...or fail her on the sola scriptura test.
According to your steps of how somebody can accept or reject your denomination belief and teachings is solely on the basis of accepting or rejecting EGW teachings....
..you state;
So if I agree on the first two points and disagree with her writings then I'm out!
- "first, read bible (teachings)
- Look at sda doctrinal statements (28 points) and compare to bible...If ok
- then look at EGW teachings if it found to be in harmony with Scriptures etc (if Not the process ends there)
OkayBecause our understanding of Bible doctrine is SDA.. Just like the case of SDA Bible doctrine affirming "one God (Deut 6:4) in three persons (Matt 28:19)" would be consistent with any statement in Ellen White's visions affirming that same point.
as already noted - another denomination which understood the Bible to reject the teaching of "one God in three persons" would then conclude that they should reject her visions based on their sola scriptura testing as they understand what the Bible says.
No because we do not make acceptance of her 1 Cor 12 gift of prophecy a barrier to joining for those that accept those first two points.
Okay
Thank you Bob,
yes I haven't even read any of her writings or visions or the sda 28 doctrinal statements etc
Thank you for your patience
Thank you Bob,She has a world-class commentary on the life of Christ that a lot of non-SDAs have read and have said they really like. But they don't become SDAs just because they read a good commentary with a lot of insight in it. Still it can be a blessing to read.
I explained more than that and would have explained still more, but you said it was off topic.You said the law that is done away with includes the Ten on the other very long discussion thread we were on. So I specifically asked you on that thread - about "do not take God's name in vain"
And if we were to compare that practice to scripture we would look at the scriptures that deal with those topics and try to get the full Bible teaching on those two practices.
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