Serious Question (speaking in tongues)

[New_Believer]

I've been to The Church of God before which practiced speaking in tongues. But it wasn't really my thing, it just scared me honestly. But I've heard some Pentecostals (and similar denominations) say that speaking in tongues is being truly baptized in the Spirit. Now I believe that accepting Christ is the way to salvation, but others have said that if you have never spoke in tongues you are going to Hell because you are not saved. Is this what all Pentecostals believe? If so, please explain why. I'm a born again Christian but have never spoken in tongues.

 

[DamianWarS]

speaking in tongues is a manifestation of the infilling of the Holy Spirit, it is also a gift of the Holy Spirit. They are separate because when we read about tongues in say 1 Corinthians 12 it seems to describe tongues as a unique spiritual gift that only some people have and when we read about it in Acts it is connected with the baptism of the Holy Spirit and it seems all speak in tongues not just some.

Spiritual gifts are about us as members of one body acting in one accord, some have the gifts of tongues and others do not but all have their own spiritual gifts and all are there for edification of the church as one body. The greek word for these spiritual gifts as mentioned in 1 Corinthians is "charisma" which is rooted in the word "charis" which means grace and so these gifts have a close connected to grace. They are more like "grace given gifts" and we receive them and develop them at the time of salvation when we experience grace. However in contrast Acts is not talking about spiritual gifts, it instead is talking about "the gift" of the Holy Spirit. Gift here is not charisma it is dōrea which literally just means "gift". The baptism of the Holy Spirit is the gift of the Holy Spirit coming upon us and filling us up like an overwhelming and it follows which seems to be an outburst of tongues or prophecy.

We know that the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, unlike spiritual gifts, are a separate and unique experience to salvation. For example in Acts 8:14-17 believers in Samaria had received the word of God but have not yet received the baptism of the Holy Spirit and so sent for Peter and John to come and lay hands on them so they might receive the Holy Spirit. We also know baptism of the Holy Spirit can be before or after baptism in water and also is a separate experience for example in Acts 10:44-48 gentiles receive the gift of the Holy Spirit and begin to speak in tongues. After the confirmation that they received the gift of the Holy Spirit Peter gets up and says "Can anyone withhold water for baptizing these people, who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?" and then they are baptized in water. The baptism of the Holy Spirit also doesn't seem to be this continued power that is constantly a part of you instead it seems to be more outburst of the Holy Spirit coming upon you, Acts describes it sometimes as the Holy Spirit "falling" upon people.

In the Book of Acts here is when the baptism of the Holy Spirit happens and the what sort of manifestation that happens at the same time

Acts 2:1-4 - mighty rushing wind, tongues as of fire, speaking in tongues
Acts 4:31 - the place shook, received a boldness to speak the word of God
Acts 8:14-17 - unknown but there was a clear sign they received the Holy Spirit
Acts 9:17 - unknown
Acts 10:44-48 - speaking in tongues and praising God
Acts 19:1-6 - speaking in tongues and prophesying

with the exception of Acts 4 all these passages are examples of the baptism of the Holy Spirit that has come upon people for the first time. Acts 2, Acts 10 and Acts 19 all have a clear consistent initial evidence of tongues, Acts 10 even identifies tongues as the evidence to know the Holy Spirit has come upon the people.

Acts 8 and Acts 9 although do not identify tongues it can be implied. In Acts 8 Simon the sorcerer sees the Holy Spirit has come upon people by laying on of hands and tried to offer money for this power. What Simon saw is not known but he saw something that made it clear these people received the Holy Spirit. It does not say tongues because the passage is about Simon and not about how the baptism of the Holy Spirit came upon people. Tongues can be implied because it would be consistent with how the Holy Spirit came upon people in other passages. In a like manor Acts 9 is about Saul's conversion. In the passage he receives the Holy Spirit for the first time and tongues is not mentioned. The detail this passage goes into is about how Saul converted it is not about if he spoke in tongues when he was baptized with the Holy Spirit. Clearly he received the Holy Spirit so a evidence is implied of some sort and again tongues can be assumed as it would be consistent with the other passages.

So speaking in tongues, as displayed in Acts, has this close connection with receiving the bapstim of the Holy Spirit. It does not mean you are "saved" nor does it mean you can be less effective for Christ. It also doesn't mean the Holy Spirit is apart of you which happens upon receive grace. It is an overwhelming of the Holy Spirit that outbursts into things like speaking in tongues. Acts seems to support this idea that tongues is an sign of receiving the baptism of the Holy Spirit when it first comes upon you however to me it is more of an expectation than it is as a needed element. Sometimes I feel we can limit the Holy Spirit when we only look for tongues as the evidence. Jesus said "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit." In a like manor although I may expect the Holy Spirit to look a certain way I do not force it and allow the Holy Spirit to move as he desires

 

[New_Believer]

Thank you for this detailed answer.

 

[stormdancer0]

As a CoG pastor, I can tell you that you are saved when you accept the Lordship of Christ over your life. Even if you never speak in tongues, if Jesus is Lord of your life, you are saved.

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit (or Infilling) is an additional impartation of power and gifts. It can turn a shy wallflower into a bold witness for Christ, in my case in an instant. Others, it just seems to build up until it bursts forth.

I also know people who claim that if you don't speak in tongues, you are not saved. I even know people who say that saved or not, Spirit-filled or not, if you sin (say, tell a lie) and die before you ask God to forgive you, you'll go to hell. I don't believe this, and see no evidence of either of these claims in scripture, except some verses that are taken out of context and expanded to their most radical possible meaning.

I believe you ARE more effective after receiving this gift. But it is not necessary for salvation.

 

[New_Believer]

As a CoG pastor, I can tell you that you are saved when you accept the Lordship of Christ over your life. Even if you never speak in tongues, if Jesus is Lord of your life, you are saved.

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit (or Infilling) is an additional impartation of power and gifts. It can turn a shy wallflower into a bold witness for Christ, in my case in an instant. Others, it just seems to build up until it bursts forth.

I also know people who claim that if you don't speak in tongues, you are not saved. I even know people who say that saved or not, Spirit-filled or not, if you sin (say, tell a lie) and die before you ask God to forgive you, you'll go to hell. I don't believe this, and see no evidence of either of these claims in scripture, except some verses that are taken out of context and expanded to their most radical possible meaning.

I believe you ARE more effective after receiving this gift. But it is not necessary for salvation.

Yeah I agree with what you're saying. I also believe that the Holy Spirit gives us other gifts. A guest preacher came to our church today for revival. He's 19 years old and preaches like a pro. A talent like that comes from the Holy Spirit. From my understanding we all receive spiritual gifts, I guess only some will receive the gift of speaking in tongues. Even though I'm a Baptist I'm open to the idea of tongues speaking because I've seen it in the Bible.

As for the people who claim other ways to be saved other than Jesus Christ, they cause a lot of confusion. I guess that's why it's so important to read the Bible on your own because it has the real truth. Anyways, thanks for the insight.

 

[stormdancer0]

Yeah I agree with what you're saying. I also believe that the Holy Spirit gives us other gifts. A guest preacher came to our church today for revival. He's 19 years old and preaches like a pro. A talent like that comes from the Holy Spirit. From my understanding we all receive spiritual gifts, I guess only some will receive the gift of speaking in tongues. Even though I'm a Baptist I'm open to the idea of tongues speaking because I've seen it in the Bible.

As for the people who claim other ways to be saved other than Jesus Christ, they cause a lot of confusion. I guess that's why it's so important to read the Bible on your own because it has the real truth. Anyways, thanks for the insight.

I remind my congregation that they should check out what I say. For one thing, I could be wrong - I'm human, and make mistakes.

For another thing, they wouldn't ask me to chew their food for them to make it easier to digest. Why would they do that with the Bible? The only spiritual meal some Christians ever get is a regurgitated meal already partially digested from some pastor. I will teach them (and they frequently teach me), but I expect them to feed themselves, too.

I know, it's a strange analogy, but it sticks in the mind. No one's ever called me normal!!

 

[tturt]

In response to: "From my understanding we all receive spiritual gifts, I guess only some will receive the gift of speaking in tongues."

I use to think that way until I did a Biblical study of speaking in tongues. This is a bit of what I found:

There’s a diversity of tongues (I Cor. 12:28) for spiritual edification:

1 – personal edification (I Cor 14:4) &
2 - church edification (some of the Scripture in I Cor 14) which includes the gift of tongues and interpretation).

The groups that received tongues in Scripture, they all received tongues except one group.
1- Pentecost in the Upper Room, Acts 2:4 And they were all …”
2-Cornelius’ house filled with friends and family Acts 10:44 “While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them…”
3----Disciples of Ephesus Acts 19 7And all the…
4--Acts 4 end of the chapter, Peter and all the people prayed and were filled

The only group where it doesn't say all received is on the day of Pentecost, not in the Upper Room, where there were mockers of tongues.

Any believer can speak in tongues but it's like salvation in that - we have to want it. Also, there is church edification. So there is a group of believers that will give messages in tongues and these messages will be interpreted in the language of those in attendance at believers' meetings.

Some purposes and benefits of tongues:
1-are a supernatural language Ephesians 6:18, Acts 2.4
2- builds up our faith and keep ourselves in the love of God. Jude 1:20-21
3- magnifies God. Acts 10::46
4- prayers can be Spirit-led Eph 6:18
5.are a way of giving God thanks well 1 Cor 14:15-17
6. enables us to sing Spiritual songs:Eph 5:19, Col 3:16
7. increases our revelation of the Word of God. I John 2:20 & 27 Eph 4:11.

Sometimes PH believers are accused of bragging about speaking in tongues. But usually when people brag about something they want to keep "it" for themselves. I've yet to meet a PH believer who speaks in tongues who doesn't want every other believer to speak in tongues for personal edification.

 

[New_Believer]

In response to: "From my understanding we all receive spiritual gifts, I guess only some will receive the gift of speaking in tongues."

I use to think that way until I did a Biblical study of speaking in tongues. This is a bit of what I found:

There’s a diversity of tongues (I Cor. 12:28) for spiritual edification:

1 – personal edification (I Cor 14:4) &
2 - church edification (some of the Scripture in I Cor 14) which includes the gift of tongues and interpretation).

The groups that received tongues in Scripture, they all received tongues except one group.
1- Pentecost in the Upper Room, Acts 2:4 And they were all …”
2-Cornelius’ house filled with friends and family Acts 10:44 “While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them…”
3----Disciples of Ephesus Acts 19 7And all the…
4--Acts 4 end of the chapter, Peter and all the people prayed and were filled

The only group where it doesn't say all received is on the day of Pentecost, not in the Upper Room, where there were mockers of tongues.

Any believer can speak in tongues but it's like salvation in that - we have to want it. Also, there is church edification. So there is a group of believers that will give messages in tongues and these messages will be interpreted in the language of those in attendance at believers' meetings.

Some purposes and benefits of tongues:
1-are a supernatural language Ephesians 6:18, Acts 2.4
2- builds up our faith and keep ourselves in the love of God. Jude 1:20-21
3- magnifies God. Acts 10::46
4- prayers can be Spirit-led Eph 6:18
5.are a way of giving God thanks well 1 Cor 14:15-17
6. enables us to sing Spiritual songs:Eph 5:19, Col 3:16
7. increases our revelation of the Word of God. I John 2:20 & 27 Eph 4:11.

Sometimes PH believers are accused of bragging about speaking in tongues. But usually when people brag about something they want to keep "it" for themselves. I've yet to meet a PH believer who speaks in tongues who doesn't want every other believer to speak in tongues for personal edification.

Good point. I've always wondered why only certain churches speak in tongues. This would explain it.

 

[stormdancer0]

The only group where it doesn't say all received is on the day of Pentecost, not in the Upper Room, where there were mockers of tongues.

Tturt, can you give me scriptural references for this? I've never heard there were mockers of tongues in the upper room.

 

[tturt]

For a second you scared me because I don't always type what I'm thinking but in your post it states "..., not in the Upper Room, ..." Did I miss it somewhere else? Or what am I missing?

 

[New_Believer]

I suggest you think, pray, and read.

I always try to do that. I just wanted to get some insight of people who have experienced it. I'm not taking anything as fact.

 

[tturt]

I think, pray, and read too. Some interpretation of Scripture isn't the way PH folks look at it. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and interpretation. PH have studied and they know the gifts they have.

 

[tturt]

One of my stories is - my father-in-law was a Baptist minister and preached against tongues for decades. But toward the end of his life, he was praying one day and said Lord, I'm open to anything, use me anyway you desire. The next second he began speaking in tongues and was really shocked. Several weeks later when he was telling me about it, I've never seen him so joyous. But he did say several times, I wish I could go back to those sermons and not preach against them.

PH = Pentecostal

I'm not saying that every utterance is God sent. But for there to be a counterfeit means there is an authentic.

By the way many denominations now have pockets of believers who speak in tongues.

I chose not to look at alternatives. There's no need to because I trust Yahweh to give believers good gifts, pure gifts. Because it's in Scripture and trust Scripture more than any one's opinion including my own.

If a halo appeared or some other acceptable sign, there wouldn't be half of these discussions. It's the babbling that gets some people's spirit ruffled. Books have been written about the purposes of tongues.

I tell you what - pray and ask Yahweh to forgive you that you want His opinion and that you're open to receive tongues if He wants you to have them.

 

[New_Believer]

I think, pray, and read too. I just want to let you know (your wording) your interpretation of Scripture isn't the way PH folks look at it. You're entitled to your interpretation and they're entitled to theirs. They've studied and they know the gifts they have.

I see now you weren't referring to me.

 

[stormdancer0]

I have experienced this gift, many many times. What do you need perspective on?

 

[DamianWarS]

Tturt, can you give me scriptural references for this? I've never heard there were mockers of tongues in the upper room.

I'm assuming he is referring to Acts 2:13 "But others were mocking and saying, They are full of sweet wine." which of course prompted Peter's famous sermon beginning with the words "these men are not drunk as you suppose..."

 

[NOTurTypical]

I've been to The Church of God before which practiced speaking in tongues. But it wasn't really my thing, it just scared me honestly. But I've heard some Pentecostals (and similar denominations) say that speaking in tongues is being truly baptized in the Spirit. Now I believe that accepting Christ is the way to salvation, but others have said that if you have never spoke in tongues you are going to Hell because you are not saved. Is this what all Pentecostals believe? If so, please explain why. I'm a born again Christian but have never spoken in tongues.

Do not listen to that lie. Read Romans 10:9, there is no mention of tongues in that verse that outlines what a person must believe in order to be saved. Also remember 1 Corinthians 12:3, NO MAN can say that Jesus Christ is the Lord except by the Holy Spirit. If you know and affirm that Jesus Christ is Lord that means you have the Holy Spirit.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

"I've never heard there were mockers of tongues in the upper room."

There IS no "Scripture for that", since it never happened.

It was when the disciples got OUTSIDE into the crowd that there were "Mockers".

 

[tturt]

Perhaps someone was using a speed reading strategy - reading every other word. But this is what was posted -

From post #7
"The only group where it doesn't say all received is on the day of Pentecost, not in the Upper Room, where there were mockers of tongues."

 

[stormdancer0]

I'm assuming he is referring to Acts 2:13 "But others were mocking and saying, They are full of sweet wine." which of course prompted Peter's famous sermon beginning with the words "these men are not drunk as you suppose..."

This happened outside, when the celebrating disciples spilled into the streets, not in the upper room.