It seems to me that Jesus, and therefore God, would disapprove of defending yourself (turn the other cheek and all that). But I couldn't bring myself to lay there and take a beating if threatened with physical harm. What do you guys think?
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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
Self Defense
- Thread starter PatrickofDetroit
- Start date
I think if someone gives me an unprovoked slap for no reason, you can be pretty sure the last thing i'll be doing is turning the other cheek. Turning my fist into their face maybe, but certainly not turning the other cheek.
I'm an internet hard man you see
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GrannieAnnie
Senior Veteran
I would not only physically defend myself, but if someone I loved who could not defend themselves needed defending, then I would willingly physically defend them too. I have very frail parents, aged 89 and 97, and we take them shopping sometimes. One time a group of young women wouldn't get out of my parents way and they said something abusive to my parents....I stopped, went back to these women and gave them a piece of my mind....if they'd taken it further I would have been physical if I'd had to.....no one touches my parents in an aggressive way and gets away with it if I'm around.....I'd feel the same way about my little grandchildren..... I would not worry about the consequences to myself.....I would defend my family.
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T
Tenka
Guest
I'm not a Christian but I don't think that 'turn the other cheek' thing is about not offering resistence to assault.
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ShieldOFaith
Well-Known Member
~ Turn the Other Cheek? ~
By George Crocker
There seems to be a lot of confusion in Christian circles regarding our Lord's statement in Matthew 5:39: "But I tell you not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also." (New King James Version. Emphasis mine). Many take this verse and claim that it is not right nor lawful for a Christian to defend himself or herself ...
Conclusion
This short article is not meant to be the last answer on the issue nor do I expect to necessarily change the pacifists' minds. However I hope that I have shown that "turning the other cheek" does not forbid one to use self-defense when one's life and/or family is facing life threatening situations. Referring to the Matt. 5:38-39 passage to prove pacifism is misleading and wrong.
I am thoroughly convinced that the Scriptures allow us to defend ourselves. That means that I have God-given rights to "bear arms" in order to do so. Only God can take away those rights. I conclude with a quote from the late Dr. A. T. Robertson, a Greek language scholar, on the Matthew passage:
Jesus protested when smitten on the cheek ( John 18:22). And Jesus denounced the Pharisees ( Matt 23) and fought the devil always. The language of Jesus is bold and picturesque and is not to be pressed too literally (he is speaking here of the passage Matthew 5:38-39 in question, GC). Paradoxes startle and make us think. We are expected to fill in the other side of the picture
. Aggressive or offensive war by nations is also condemned, but not necessarily defensive war or defense against robbery and murder. Professional pacifism may be mere cowardice. (A.T. Robertson. "Word Pictures in the New Testament", Vol. I, p. 48).
http://www.salemreformed.org/pages/articles/turn-the-cheek.php
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I hope you read the whole thing and understand a little more about self-defense.
http://www.salemreformed.org/pages/articles/turn-the-cheek.php
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I hope you read the whole thing and understand a little more about self-defense.
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Vene
In memory of ChordatesLegacy
Life is a basic human right. If it's threatened I am willing to fight. But, I would rather run. Why? Because of the the inherent risk in any fight.
I'm no expert on the Bible either, but didn't Jesus say something to his disciples about bringing a sword (one of the few weapons of the era that was used purely for fighting).
I'm no expert on the Bible either, but didn't Jesus say something to his disciples about bringing a sword (one of the few weapons of the era that was used purely for fighting).
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MikeMcK
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First of all, "turn the other cheek" has nothing to do with self defense. It's referring to seeking revenge.
Second, if Jesus disapproves of self defense, then explain why He commanded His disciples to go out and buy swords to defend themselves with.
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God is uber vengeful.
How can you be vengeful and all forgiving at the same time?
PARADOX
BTW- Patrick of Detroit, lighten up there young man, life is a lot more abusive than that
How can you be vengeful and all forgiving at the same time?
PARADOX
BTW- Patrick of Detroit, lighten up there young man, life is a lot more abusive than that
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I think Jesus was aware of Peter having a sword prior to his arrest and had not told him to get rid of it. I also think Jesus complemented a Roman Soldier for his faith and did not tell him he had to stop being a soldier. I think we have the right and the duty to defend ourselves and our family and other innocent people that are being mistreated.
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bgrass1234
Regular Member
We have an obligation to defend others, "Love always protects." But to defend only yourself by harming the aggressor is selfishness. I would concede that if others are dependent upon you, i.e. family, then you may need to defend yourself to be able to take care of your family. Although the argument could be made that if you defend yourself to take care of your family, then you faith is not strong enough to trust God to provide for them.
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FaithLikeARock
Let the human mind loose.
I try to be a pacifist so I personally would only fight back if necessary. But while it may not be the best choice, it's not a sin either.
However if it's the case of words (someone calls you a name so you call back) it is wrong, which I think is more what Jesus was talking about.
However if it's the case of words (someone calls you a name so you call back) it is wrong, which I think is more what Jesus was talking about.
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All violence is technically against my religion (Quakerism), but if there's no other escape from a threatening situation, I don't mind defending myself. I'm sure Jesus understands.
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FaithLikeARock
Let the human mind loose.
Ah, WorldFriction you confused me! I see your name on the closed thread under "Last poster" and came in and saw "Risingmoon" and was like "WHAT?!"
But that's just off-topic.
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