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You should really speak for yourself. Like honestly. Have you studied with me to know whether or not I study Revelation and Daniel by myself?
Oh, I love this question! Great post!
The answer is: Its not the Pope or the RCC!
The beast that once was is: Lucifer -- he once was in heaven
now is not: he's not in heaven because he was cast into the abyss
and will come up out of the abyss: at the appointed time, he will be released and come up out of the spirit realm where he has been confined and will put on a great display of authority and power
The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the Book of Life from the creation of the world will be astonished when they see him. He will astonish the wicked with incredible glory, counterfeit wonders, and miracles.
JohnMarsten said:I think most people didnt even realize the event...
EastCoastRemnant said:There's a danger either way... you think it's not near and fritter away time and opportunities to perfect character or you obsess about the signs and current events and miss oportunities to perfect character.
If we are not centered in Him, improving our relationship with Him, learning of His true character to apply to ourselves... we are in danger.
If so many missed the event, how then did was scripture fulfilled at everyone being astonished at the beasts return?
I apologize!
u know I tend to be a little provocative...
what I meant is that SDA's dont study the books as such but rather try to more fully understand what they have been told...
or do you even consider it possible that the SDA interpretations might be wrong and that you could come up with something else once you studied it...
JohnMarsten said:what I meant was that most people on earth didnt even realize that something was even going on at the time... didnt say anyone was astonished...
Right... But scripture clearly predicts that those outside the faith will be astonished at the beasts return. If they were unaware of it even happening.... How then was this fulfilled?
I can't make something fit that doesn't fit. If we teach that the square goes in the circle hole then obviously we're wrong. I've been to the seminars and I've read the material, and then I read from the scriptures and it simply fits. I don't think it's wise to try to find something wrong when there's nothing wrong. That's how one ends up being deceived. That aside, nothing else makes any sense when it comes to Revelation and Daniel. From what I've seen, only the SDA teaches are consistent throughout both books.
would kindly explain this one to me then, according to EGW satan is in heaven again or am I wrong, maybe it helps make your assumption fit../.
Now, in 1886, according to Ellen White's manuscript 6a (see above) Jesus was standing in the Most Holy Place. But two years later, in 1888, we find him back in the Holy Place before the altar of incense. Then a year later, in 1889, Jesus is back "within the veil where he ministers above the ark of God in the Most Holy Place." (Signs of the Times, Apr. 22, 1889). However, nine years later, in 1898 we find Jesus ministering by the altar of incense in the Holy Place! How could Jesus possibly be ministering in the Holy Place? Look what Ellen White wrote from one of her visions in Early Writings:
I saw the Father rise from the throne, and in a flaming chariot go into the holy of holies within the veil, and sit down. Then Jesus rose up from the throne, and the most of those who were bowed down arose with Him. I did not see one ray of light pass from Jesus to the careless multitude after He arose, and they were left in perfect darkness. ... Then a cloudy chariot, with wheels like flaming fire, surrounded by angels, came to where Jesus was. He stepped into the chariot and was borne to the holiest, where the Father sat. There I beheld Jesus, a great High Priest, standing before the Father. (p. 55)Here we have the Father and Jesus moving into the Most Holy Place in 1844. Now look what happens to those poor souls who did not realize that Jesus moved from the Holy Place to the Most Holy Place in 1844:
I turned to look at the company who were still bowed before the throne; they did not know that Jesus had left it. Satan appeared to be by the throne, trying to carry on the work of God. I saw them look up to the throne, and pray, "Father, give us Thy Spirit." Satan would then breathe upon them an unholy influence... (p. 56)Ellen White sees Satan in the Holy Place that Jesus has just recently vacated in 1844, trying to carry on the work of God! But in 1888, Jesus has apparently returned to the Holy Place. The question is, where is Satan? Is he still there in the Holy Place with Christ? Are they working together? Or did they swap places? Did Satan move into the Most Holy Place when Christ entered the Holy Place? Does it get any more confusing than this?
thats what I meant with that SDA dont study the scriptures, they just try to make it fit with what they learned...
I disagree. I think SDA's study the bible just as much as anyone else. I feel like others try to make the bible fit what they've learned. This comes in when you toss out scripture A to hold to an understanding of what you may believe scripture B says. And since you can't keep em both, you explain one away. That's not what Adventist's do.
Allow me to interject. I came to this forum to bring new light to many different topics, all of which are of an interpretation that the mainstream SDA either does not know, or flat out rejects, because they commonly hold to a false interpretation. There are however among the "common" SDAs, those who study for themselves. It is this class that you have offended.
All these things that Ellen White saw were things in her visions. They do not pertain to the time in which she wrote them. Some are of future events and others are events that have already been fulfilled. From pg 56, it is still a future event to us today. There is no dating of any of these events which she wrote about.
what makes you think its a future event? the fact that it didnt happen as of yet?
I apologize!
but generally speaking I think I was right, and if, in effect, those who study for themselves come up with different conclusions and try to share these... they might face some serious repercussions... so I know which techniques are used by SDAs.... in order to preserve the unity of thought
no, no, thats not how it works in the sda...
let me put is this way... because maybe I wasnt clear on what I said...
when I said SDAs dont study scripture, I didnt mean they dont read it... or they dont interpret it...
what I meant is, that SDAs have one interpretation which they pass on to their sheep, the sheep will listen to what the man in the front has to say, open their bibles when a verse is given to double check if this is really so and then jump a couple of books further in the bible to double check another verse which helps understand the previous one... so in the end, studying in the sda is just proving to yourself what you have been taught. You are given one way of thinking and now you have to study the bible in order to be fluent in this one way of thinking or interpreting... and in case you would come up with something different better not tell anyoneisnt that how it goes? be honest!
I apologize!
but generally speaking I think I was right, and if, in effect, those who study for themselves come up with different conclusions and try to share these... they might face some serious repercussions... so I know which techniques are used by SDAs.... in order to preserve the unity of thought
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