sanctification.

[justbyfaith]

Brought here to the forefront from a different thread:

Galatians 3:14, Romans 5:5, and Ephesians 3:19 tell us that through faith in Jesus Christ we are filled with the fulness of the love of God by the Spirit. Romans 8:4 tells us that if we walk after the Spirit and not after the flesh, the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us. Also the love I speak about from Romans 5:5 is the fulfilling of the law...Romans 13:8-10, 1 John 5:2-3, 2 John 1:6.

1 John 1:8 tells us that all of us have sin...but 1 John 3:5-9 shows us that this is not speaking of us being unable to not commit sin from moment to moment...it is speaking of indwelling sin...and indwelling sin can be rendered dead (Romans 7:8, Romans 6:6-7, Galatians 5:24) so that it has no authority over what we do in our behaviour.

We become one flesh with Jesus Christ according to Ephesians 5:30-32; we are purified in our souls according to 1 Peter 1:22, and in Titus 3:4-7 our soul and spirit is regenerated and renewed. And in 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 we can be sanctified wholly in the spirit and soul and body.

In Hebrews 10:14 those who are sanctified (wholly) have been perfected for ever.

Now I do not claim to be sinless; I consider that I have not apprehended this sanctification that I speak of: and in Philippians 3:15 it states that as many as are perfect shall have this attitude.

Proverbs 4:18 says, But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.

Therefore in my process of sanctification, I seek to move ever forward and never backward (see also Philippians 3:16).

If I ever reach what Proverbs 4:18 calls the perfect day, I may never know it, although it may be the truth. Because as a born again Christian, my eyes are fixed on Jesus (2 Corinthians 3:18) and not on my inward parts; unless the Holy Spirit is specifically pointing out something to me that is not pleasing to Him.

I find that He points those kinds of things out less and less as time passes, because He is sanctifying me on a daily basis, and I am becoming more and more like Christ through being immersed in His word from day to day (Romans 8:29, Romans 12:1-2).

 

[1stcenturylady]

Brought here to the forefront from a different thread:

Galatians 3:14, Romans 5:5, and Ephesians 3:19 tell us that through faith in Jesus Christ we are filled with the fulness of the love of God by the Spirit. Romans 8:4 tells us that if we walk after the Spirit and not after the flesh, the righteousness of the law is fulfilled in us. Also the love I speak about from Romans 5:5 is the fulfilling of the law...Romans 13:8-10, 1 John 5:2-3, 2 John 1:6.

1 John 1:8 tells us that all of us have sin...but 1 John 3:5-9 shows us that this is not speaking of us being unable to not commit sin from moment to moment...it is speaking of indwelling sin...and indwelling sin can be rendered dead (Romans 7:8, Romans 6:6-7, Galatians 5:24) so that it has no authority over what we do in our behaviour.

We become one flesh with Jesus Christ according to Ephesians 5:30-32; we are purified in our souls according to 1 Peter 1:22, and in Titus 3:4-7 our soul and spirit is regenerated and renewed. And in 1 Thessalonians 5:23-24 we can be sanctified wholly in the spirit and soul and body.

In Hebrews 10:14 those who are sanctified (wholly) have been perfected for ever.

Now I do not claim to be sinless; I consider that I have not apprehended this sanctification that I speak of: and in Philippians 3:15 it states that as many as are perfect shall have this attitude.

Proverbs 4:18 says, But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.

Therefore in my process of sanctification, I seek to move ever forward and never backward (see also Philippians 3:16).

If I ever reach what Proverbs 4:18 calls the perfect day, I may never know it, although it may be the truth. Because as a born again Christian, my eyes are fixed on Jesus (2 Corinthians 3:18) and not on my inward parts; unless the Holy Spirit is specifically pointing out something to me that is not pleasing to Him.

I find that He points those kinds of things out less and less as time passes, because He is sanctifying me on a daily basis, and I am becoming more and more like Christ through being immersed in His word from day to day (Romans 8:29, Romans 12:1-2).

We are almost on the same wave length. But you still understand 1 John 1:8 to be a Christian! That belief has been taken to the extreme. You are not doing that, so don't take me wrong, but you can't apply it to Christians at all. Those who do and act on it are not even Christians. Romans 8:9 says they don't belong to Christ because they don't have the Spirit of Christ (in whom is no (willful) sin 1 John 3:5). You can even see it on the forums. By their fruit you will know them. But it is not just a few individuals - WHOLE DENOMINATIONS TEACH FALSE DOCTRINE.

False teaching about a Christian: 1 John 1:8 and Romans 7:14-23. They avoid 1 John 3:9, even to the point of mocking, because it goes against their pet verses, and they don't want their head to explode.

True teaching about a Christian: 1 John 1:7, 1 John 3:5-9 and Romans 7:13 through Romans 8:9).

You are seeing 1 John 1:8 with western eyes, not eastern. That is the whole problem in a nutshell. Most Christians are western, and understand Greek writing styles. But Paul and John and the rest of the apostles are eastern with a Semitic writing style, no matter what language it is written in - only the style matters. You'll never understand what the apostles are saying if you don't understand what they mean. Many combine 1 John 1:8 with Romans 7:14-23, because that is what they erroneously understand.

Lord Byron, romantic poet of the early 1800’s, walked into a pub and sat down at a table by the fire. Sitting at the table next to him he overheard the heated conversation of two gentlemen discussing the meaning of a poem – one written by the poet himself. He listened with amusement as they debated over the meaning of the poem, both completely missing the point. Finally, he chimed in with the true meaning of the poem, introducing himself as the author. Even so they stood their ground preferring their own interpretations, and both argued with Lord Byron over the meaning of the poem.

 

[justbyfaith]

It seems to me that you have a hurdle to overcome in my thinking if I am going to believe what you are saying about 1 John 1:8.

And that is, that John says, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

When John says, we, is he not referring to himself and other believers?

If he were referring to unbelievers, would he not have said, If you say that you have no sin, you deceive yourselves and the truth is not in you?

 

[justbyfaith]

Also from another thread, that I want to bring to the forefront:

(The question being, what one message would you bring to America if you could?)

The message of Matthew 13:41-42 and Matthew 13:49-50 and Matthew 7:23, which America seems to have forgotten.

Matthew 13:41-42, The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Matthew 13:49-50, So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Matthew 7:23, And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Also, maybe Matthew 5:29-30, And if thy right eye causeth thee to sin, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is better for thee that one of thy members should perish, than that thy whole body should be cast into hell. And if thy right hand causeth thee to sin, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is better for thee that one of thy members perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

This is not to exalt a hellfire and brimstone message, but to give people an understanding about the severity of sin. For these things are intertwined. Because men no longer endure sound doctrine concerning the fires of hell (2 Timothy 4:1-5), they also have forgotten that sin will put a man in hell, and have come up with the doctrines of greasy grace ("sloppy agape"), and have turned the grace of our God into lasciviousness (Jude 1:3-4) by preaching OSAS doctrine without its true qualifications that one must be holy and continue to be holy if he is going to even have eternal security (1 John 2:17, 1 John 3:6, Hebrews 12:14).

PS Matthew 5:29-30, as should be well-known by now, was a statement of hyperbole (exaggeration to make a point); the point being that sin will put a man in hell and therefore if the most important thing to you in your life is causing you to sin you ought to get rid of it so that you can avoid the temptation to sin; in order that you might have the victory over sin and therefore enter into heaven instead of hell, though it be without that important thing that you enter heaven with.

For example, I once knew someone who loved baseball; and thought that if there were no baseball in heaven he didn't want to go there. To me this was insanity; for baseball was an idol in his life. Unfortunately at the time I did not think of it as an idol or as a sin that God wanted to deal with and I told him that there is baseball in heaven because I did not want to seem legalistic or religious. (The fact is that we don't know--1 Corinthians 2:9)

 

[1stcenturylady]

It seems to me that you have a hurdle to overcome in my thinking if I am going to believe what you are saying about 1 John 1:8.

And that is, that John says, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

When John says, we, is he not referring to himself and other believers?

If he were referring to unbelievers, would he not have said, If you say that you have no sin, you deceive yourselves and the truth is not in you?

Again, your western eyes, dear. Semitic - first person. Look at what Paul said in the first person, even though when the law came on Mt. Sinai, Paul wasn't even born yet!

Romans 7:
7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.” 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire. For apart from the law sin was dead. 9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was to bring life, I found to bring death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it killed me. 12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.

I hope you are as hungry for truth as I already believe you are. There is much I would love to show you. The apostles wrote instructions in the first person. Why? Because they are not God. Jesus is God. The commandments will certainly say you, or thou, and also the beatitudes. Open your mind. This is new stuff to you, but it will help you immensely.

John was speaking in the first person, but more importantly, why did he write the epistle in the first place, besides the Semitic writing style? When you can answer that question, you will begin to know what was happening in his congregation. So why did he write it? And why would first person be necessary? Were they all on the same page? Would he separate them in his own congregation into you and us.

 

[justbyfaith]

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