Questions about the Baha'i

LoAmmi · Apr 27, 2015

I will point out, though, that Heaven arguments can also be silly. I once had someone tell me that in Heaven they will be perfectly happy, BUT, you will receive bigger houses or whatever the more souls you bring in for Jesus. Ok, but if everybody is PERFECTLY HAPPY, that means having more of whatever can't make you more perfectly happy, so what's the point?

dlamberth · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin said:
only the first verse would apply on what?

To the point that you were trying to make.

.

Niblo · Apr 27, 2015

LoAmmi said:
"It's hotter in mine!"

That’s as maybe….but we get to drink pus!

Mumin · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin · Apr 27, 2015

LoAmmi · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin said:
You are the one who says it. Not me or dcalling. We are just quoting.

Just quoting what you believe.

dlamberth · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin said:
I was referring to inventing things. I like love.

Is the Love a mother has for her new born child, "invented"?
Is a persons Love of God, "invented"?
Do you reject that Love of God as well?

.

Supreme · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin said:
I was referring to inventing things. I like love.

God loves us, and it is our duty to love Him back.

Mumin · Apr 27, 2015

LoAmmi · Apr 27, 2015

I also didn't quote you.

jacknife · Apr 27, 2015

LoAmmi said:
I will point out, though, that Heaven arguments can also be silly. I once had someone tell me that in Heaven they will be perfectly happy, BUT, you will receive bigger houses or whatever the more souls you bring in for Jesus. Ok, but if everybody is PERFECTLY HAPPY, that means having more of whatever can't make you more perfectly happy, so what's the point?

I had someone on these forums tell me that in heaven he will gain power over the souls of the dead.

Mumin · Apr 27, 2015

Supreme · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin said:
us=the whole humanity? If the Bible says so, then those are evidences of contradiction/corruption, because other verses say otherwise:

Romans 9:13 Just as it is written: Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.
Romans 9:14 What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all
Romans 9:15 For he says to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.
Romans 9:16 It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God's mercy.

Ecclesiastes 3:8 a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace.

Leviticus 20:23 You must not live according to the customs of the nations I am going to drive out before you. Because they did all these things, I abhorred them.

Deuteronomy 18:12 Anyone who does these things is detestable to the Lord, and because of these detestable practices the Lord your God will drive out those nations before you.

Leviticus 26:30 I will destroy your high places, cut down your incense altars and pile your dead bodies on the lifeless forms of your idols, and I will abhor you.

According to the Bible, prophet Jesus said this:

Luke 14:26 If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters yes, even his own life he cannot be my disciple.

And these verses make distinction on who you must love: Luke 10:27-36

Genuinely struggling to see how there is any contradiction there. In fact, I'm certain- there is no contradiction.

smaneck · Apr 27, 2015

Niblo said:
Hello Susan,

Please reference these verses so I can read them for myself...and get back to you with comments!

Many thanks...and I hope it goes well with the Dean.

Have a great day.

Yep, got done what I needed to do. I'm thinking of verses like this:

"And for every nation [umma] is a term. So when their time has come, they will not remain behind an hour, nor will they precede it. O children of Adam, if there come to you messengers from among you relating to you My verses, then whoever fears Allah and reforms - there will be no fear concerning them, nor will they grieve." (7:35)

“And Joseph came to you aforetime with clear tokens, but ye ceased not to doubt of the message with which He came to you, until, when He died, ye said, ‘God will by no means raise up a Messenger after Him.’ Thus God misleadeth him who is the transgressor the doubter.” (40:34)

"And the Jews say, "The hand of Allah is chained." Chained are their hands, and cursed are they for what they say. Rather, both His hands are extended; He spends however He wills. And that which has been revealed to you from your Lord will surely increase many of them in transgression and disbelief"
(Qur'an 5:64)

"Say, `If every ocean become ink for the words of my Lord, surely, the ocean would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even though WE brought the like thereof as further help.'" (18:109)

"We said: “Get you down from here, all of you, and guidance shall come to you from Me: then, whoever will follow My guidance need have no fear, nor shall they grieve. But those who refuse to accept this (guidance) and reject Our Signs as false are destined for the Fire where they shall abide for ever.” (2:38-39)

We indeed sent many Messengers before you and We gave them wives and children; and no Messenger had the power to produce a miraculous sign except by the command of Allah. Every age has its own (revealed)
Book. (13:38)

"Alas for human beings! Whenever a messenger comes to them they ridicule him." (36:30)

dcalling · Apr 27, 2015

Mumin said:
Trinity was an example. You don't have to disbelieve, nor to deny the verses. In the case of Baha'is, they try to distort the verses

6:21 And who is more unjust than one who invents about Allah a lie or denies His verses? Indeed, the wrongdoers will not succeed.

5:10 But those who disbelieve and deny Our signs - those are the companions of Hellfire.

The same verses can be used against you When the Quran clearly says the conditions of salvation, when it is clearly shown that the Torah and Gospel is not corrupt, yet you say they are corrupt, and you say those who believe in God and the last days and do good deeds are not going to heaven (just because they are Bahai), arent they all inventions or denies God's verses?

Surat 5:69 For all those who believe in Allah and in the Last Day and do good deeds - be they either believers, Jews, Sabaeans or Christians - neither fear shall fall upon them, nor shall they have any reason to grieve

Arthra · Apr 27, 2015

dlamberth said:
Is the Love a mother has for her new born child, "invented"?
Is a persons Love of God, "invented"?
Do you reject that Love of God as well?

.

In reference to love mentioned earlier I wanted to offer a quote from Abdul-Baha Who indicated there are four types of love...

There are four kinds of love.

"The first is the love that flows from God to man; it consists of the inexhaustible graces, the Divine effulgence and heavenly illumination. Through this love the world of being receives life. Through this love man is endowed with physical existence, until, through the breath of the Holy Spirit -- this same love -- he receives eternal life and becomes the image of the Living God. This love is the origin of all the love in the world of creation.

"The second is the love that flows from man to God. This is faith, attraction to the Divine, enkindlement, progress, entrance into the Kingdom of God, receiving the Bounties of God, illumination with the lights of the Kingdom. This love is the origin of all philanthropy; this love causes the hearts of men to reflect the rays of the Sun of Reality.

"The third is the love of God towards the Self or Identity of God. This is the transfiguration of His Beauty, the reflection of Himself in the mirror of His Creation. This is the reality of love, the Ancient Love, the Eternal Love. Through one ray of this Love all other love exists.

"The fourth is the love of man for man. The love which exists between the hearts of believers is prompted by the ideal of the unity of spirits. This love is attained through the knowledge of God, so that men see the Divine Love reflected in the heart. Each sees in the other the Beauty of God reflected in the soul, and finding this point of similarity, they are attracted to one another in love. This love will make all men the waves of one sea, this love will make them all the stars of one heaven and the fruits of one tree. This love will bring the realization of true accord, the foundation of real unity."

~ Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks p. 58

Niblo · Apr 28, 2015

smaneck said:
Yep, got done what I needed to do. I'm thinking of verses like this:

QUOTE]

Never doubted it!

Thanks for the verses. In āʾ Allāh, I'll come back to you.

Have a great day.

Mumin · Apr 28, 2015

Mumin · Apr 28, 2015

Mumin · Apr 28, 2015

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