Herman Hedning
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And that could have been the case if the rocks making up the canyon had been completely uniform and the erosion absolutely even. However, this is not the case. Everyone knows this.
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If so, the slope should be the same and continuous all the way down to the river.
Everyone doesn't know this. Some people are abysmally and purposely ignorant.And that could have been the case if the rocks making up the canyon had been completely uniform and the erosion absolutely even. However, this is not the case. Everyone knows this.
Where you are going is to impune the integrity of geologists while knowing nothing about the subject yourself.Didn't evolutionists uses the lack of meandering at the bottom of the Mt. St. Helens canyons against rapid erosion? They knew exactly that it formed rapidly, because there isn't any meandering but just flat bottom. They accepted that those canyons formed rapidly compare to the Grand Canyon - that takes longer time they say. But the lack of meandering can be argue against rapid erosion ONLY when they knew those canyons were formed rapidly already. Had it not been the case, they would have concluded that it takes long periods of time, just like anybody today can make the same claim. If I go see the canyons on Mt. St. Helens today, heck, I would make the same uniformatarian assumption. And might have conclude something it like this: "The canyons formed slowly and it may even have had meandering". See where I'm going?
The steepness of cliff slopes does depend on the compressive strength of the rock forming them. For example some of the steepest cliffs in the Grand Canyon are in the 400-800 foot thick sections of the very hard Redwall Limestones.(Think: why does the inner gorge of the Grand Canyon has a much steeper slope? The schist is not that harder than sandstone.)
. Cohesive strenght and compressive strenght are correlated and "harder" rocks are more difficult to erode. For example erosion caused by breaching of the lava dams in the Grand Canyon eroded away nearly all of the basalt from the lavas without significantly eroded the stronger Vishnu Schists and Zorastor Granites. To use erosion of soft mud and ash that has no cohesive strength as an analogy for erosion of solid rock makes no sense.You did not see what I said. The power of erosion by water is similar to that of ice. The hardness of material is not an important factor. It is the cohesiveness of the material. In this sense, a fractured rock formation (does not matter what kind of rock) can be as easily eroded as (to a scale) unconsolidated pyroclastic material.
So it was not turbulent but somehow eventually carved a canyon thousands of feet deep in rock with sufficient compressive strength to support cliffs thousand of feet high. How did that work?In you mind, is the Noah's Flood like a storm with huge force of turbulent flow? That is not true. In many, if not all, places, the water level must just rise quietly (imagine a volcanic eruption along a midoceanic ridge, nobody would even notice it).
So tell us what sea water chemistry resulted in a flood depositing the very pure Mississippian Redwall limestones in a layer 400-800 feet thick atop all the underlaying layers and how is it that the only macro fossils in the Redwalls are Mississippian? Or don't you think the Redwall is a flood deposit? Perhaps you could tell us exactly which layers are flood deposits and which aren't.We interpret the time required for limestone deposit based on the current seawater chemistry. We should know the water chemistry during the Noah's Flood must be very very different. A quick deposition of limestone is not chemically impossible (such as the carbonate deposit in a hydrothermal environment).
The Redwall Limestone is medium gray on fresh exposures but is colored by a superficial red stain derived from the overlying formations. It is characteristically well bedded; but, when viewed from a distance it appears almost as a single massive unit, because the subtle divisions between strata are not etched out in sufficient relief to be seen from the canyon rim. In many places, especially in the lower part of the Redwall Cliff, beds of bright red jasper are found, some of which are semiprecious gern quality. The Redwall Limestone is a very pure calcium carbonate rock containing less than one percent sand and shale particles. Its origin is as interesting as its topographic expression. The pure limestone indicates that it was formed in a relatively wide, shallow, quiet sea, far from shale and clay deposition near the shore. Fossil sea shells and a wide variety of other marine life including common corals are found within the Redwall Limestone. Most of the fossils are preserved in remarkable detail.
If God is in control of nature as you have shown, then please don't try and convince me that He sent the Colorado River to forge the Grand Canyon.
Once again, and let's make this plain as day:
The Grand Canyon came first, then the Colorado River.
The very Documentation that shows God in control of nature also shows God in control of time; and if you think the Colorado River had time to forge the Grand Canyon at God's command, then you must think it hyper-forged it, eh?
And that could have been the case if the rocks making up the canyon had been completely uniform and the erosion absolutely even. However, this is not the case. Everyone knows this.
Here is where the problem is. The inner gorge rocks are not more erosion resistant than those rocks above it.
The steepness of cliff slopes does depend on the compressive strength of the rock forming them. For example some of the steepest cliffs in the Grand Canyon are in the 400-800 foot thick sections of the very hard Redwall Limestones.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Butte_and_Muav_formations_in_Grand_Canyon.jpg
So you are claiming that the metamorphic and igneous rocks of the inner gorge (Vishnu Schists and Zoraster Granites) are not more resistant to erosion than the sandstones, mudstones, shales, basalts and limestone interbedded with shale of the Unkar Group, Nankoweap formation and Chaur group. I would like to see a citation on this. The inner gorge rocks may not be more resistant to erosion than the pure hard limestones of the Redwall (which also forms sheer cliffs) but I think that granites and schists are more resistant to erosion than sandstones, mudstones and shale of these groups and I am virtually certain they are more resistant to erosion than the Cardenas Lavas.Here is where the problem is. The inner gorge rocks are not more erosion resistant than those rocks above it.
The rocks above are more exposed and have been so for a longer time.
. Cohesive strenght and compressive strenght are correlated and "harder" rocks are more difficult to erode. For example erosion caused by breaching of the lava dams in the Grand Canyon eroded away nearly all of the basalt from the lavas without significantly eroded the stronger Vishnu Schists and Zorastor Granites. To use erosion of soft mud and ash that has no cohesive strength as an analogy for erosion of solid rock makes no sense.
So it was not turbulent but somehow eventually carved a canyon thousands of feet deep in rock with sufficient compressive strength to support cliffs thousand of feet high. How did that work?
So tell us what sea water chemistry resulted in a flood depositing the very pure Mississippian Redwall limestones in a layer 400-800 feet thick atop all the underlaying layers and how is it that the only macro fossils in the Redwalls are Mississippian? Or don't you think the Redwall is a flood deposit? Perhaps you could tell us exactly which layers are flood deposits and which aren't.
Geologic Formations of Utah: Redwall Formation
This sure doesn't sound like something deposited by a global flood to me.
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