Question About Sexual Sins

[master_alterserver]

I was wondering about wether you think masturbation is a sexual sin. I have been discussing this at xxxchurch .com and it seems that most Christians say no most of the time. This is disturbing.

 

[bliz]

Why is this disturbing to you?

 

[coolhaircam]

It is a sexual sin. It's sexual pleasure that was meant for marriage not for one's self.

 

[bliz]

On what Scriptural basis can you say that?

 

[DrPepper]

I was wondering about wether you think masturbation is a sexual sin. I have been discussing this at xxxchurch .com and it seems that most Christians say no most of the time. This is disturbing.

There's another thread called "Is Masturbating and looking at pornography wrong?", It's currently on the 2nd Page of this forum, I'll bump it so it appears on the first page, have a look at it, it has some good detailed responses.

 

[bliz]

Becasue The Bible is silent on the subject of mastrubation (Onan was not mastrubating in Genesis 38) I think that this will forever be an issue about which will Christians disagree.

I do not doubt for one moment that God has told some people that they are not to mastrubate. Bizzlebin has made it clear that God has told him it is a sin and I have no trouble believing that it is a sin, for Blizzlebin. But that does not mean that it is a sin for everyone. Paul sets for just this kind of standard over the eating of meat offered to idols. (Romans 14: 13- 22) For some Christians the eating of this meat would be a sin but for others, it is not.

Many people talk a great deal about the mastrubation/lust connection. Let's define our terms:

From the American heritige Dictionary: Lust: 1. sexual cravings, especially excessive or unrestrained 2. Overwhelming desire or craving. lusting, lusted, lusts: To have inordinate or obsessive desire, especially sexual desire

Lust is not normal sexual desire. Lust is not sexual arousal. Note the terms; cravings, excessive, unrestrained, obsessive. When posters volunteer that they cannot imagine mastrubating without lusting, that tells me:

1. far more about their psycho/sexual selves than I care to know
2. that they do not understand the meaning of the word "lust"
3. by their defination of lust, sexual relations within marriage are not possible without committing the sin of lust which makes no sense because God designed sexual expression for marriage

I am not suggesting that everyone should go out and mastrubate. If there are some people that are never tempted to do so, more power to them! I do believe that mastrubation, like eating, or drinking alcohol, can become addictive and can become a real problem - as in "cravings, excessive, unrestrained, obsessive" But no one is suggesting that becasue eating can lead to gluttony that we should not eat. (There are those who would argue that becasue the drinking of wine can lead to drunkeness no one should drink, but I am not among them.)

I think that the designation of mastrubation as a sin has caused men and women needless guilt and pain. We should indeed feel great guilt and shame and pain over our sins; but when we are often so busy doing so over imagined sins, we tend to focus on the wrong things. Even when actions are clearly sexual sin, we seem to pounce on those (in ourselves and in others) and ignore other sins.

For example, while everyone knows the story of the City of Sodom, few people pay any attention to Ezekiel 16:49 - 50 "Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did deststable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen." Clearly sexual sin is mentioned under "detestable things" but why do we give so little heed to being "arrognant, overfed, unconcerned, haughty and not helping the poor?

I know that many of you are young people have been taught that mastrubation is a sexual sin, and I mean no disrespect to those who have taught you or to your choice to believe in what they have said. I am not encouraging anyone to alter their view, particularly, not if God has made it clear to you that you should not mastrubate. But I am weary of, and leary of, those who insist that what God has declared sin for themselves must be a sin for everyone else. There are many things that God clearly labels as SIN for all of us; let's limit our edicts to those things.

 

[master_alterserver]

But in Genesis 38, it explains the sacredness of sperm and that it is meant only for reproducing. This disturbs me that so many Christians are blind to their faith and that they have recieved a twisted cathechisis.

 

[bliz]

You need to go back and reread Genesis 38.

At that time,as per Deuteronomy 25) if a woman was widowed without children the law required that the a male relative lay with the widow to father a son by her so that the widow would have a son of the bloodline who could inherit. Without a son, the deceased husband's property would be absorbed by his remaining brothers since women could not inherit. This situation would leave the widow with no financial support and without a bloodline for the deceased brother.

So, Onan's job was to impregnant Tamar, but scripture says, that knowing any children would not be his, he spilled his seed, more than once. His actions were declared as "wicked", but what was wicked was his attempt to thwart his obligation. There was a prescribed procedure whereby Onan could have gotten out of doing this, but he did not take that course of action; he attempted to deceive everyone. A son born of Tamar would inherit, meaning that Onan would have a smaller estate.
So, out of selfishness or greed , Onan was defying God's law. That is what was wicked.

"The sacredness of sperm" - I'm sorry... do you really believe that sperm is sacred??? I cannot see that as anything other than colossal male ego talking - not yours, but someone's.

If sperm is only for reproduction, does this mean that men are sinning when they have a nocturnal emissions? Does that mean that men who never marry, but who are constantly producing sperm are sinning?

 

[Irocc]

I do not doubt for one moment that God has told some people that they are not to mastrubate. Bizzlebin has made it clear that God has told him it is a sin and I have no trouble believing that it is a sin, for Blizzlebin. But that does not mean that it is a sin for everyone. Paul sets for just this kind of standard over the eating of meat offered to idols. (Romans 14: 13- 22) For some Christians the eating of this meat would be a sin but for others, it is not.

I don't think that God would tell one person that it is sin to do something and yet it be no sin for others. The story in Romans 14: 13-22 about meat,wasn't sin. Paul was using that to tell the christians that they shouldn't do anythg that would make them that are young in the faith to fall.
Masturbation is a different thg all together. When someone is doing it, they are all alone and nobody else gets to know unless they confess it or tell somebody else.
What I know is that, when somethg is sin and God says it is, then it is for everyone. God is a repector of no man and His standard will not be brought down for anyone.
That's where I stand.
But I stand to be corrected.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

Anyone can ask God. It is not some secret. It is a form of impurity. If anyone has the Spirit, they will know it is a sin.

 

[prestonw]

I do not understand why people believe it is a sin. For some reason this Biblical myth is wide spread.

Leviticus 15:16-18 (NIV):

16 " 'When a man has an emission of sperm, he must bathe his whole body with water, and he will be unclean till evening. 17 Any clothing or leather that has sperm on it must be washed with water, and it will be unclean till evening. 18 When a man lies with a woman and there is an emission of sperm, both must bathe with water, and they will be unclean till evening.

Notice how it doesn't talk about a man lying with a women until verse 18. The previous two verses are talking about masturbation. So, the bible says that if you touch, you should wash up after. Sounds like good sense to me.

 

[bliz]

Bizzlebin,

I do wish that you would not implying that those of us who do not share your view on this subject, are not Christians.

How do we have the Spirit? By becoming a Christian. You said, "If anyone has the Spirit, they will know it is a sin." Therefore, since I disagree with you about this subject, it is logical to conclude that I am not spirit filled, and therefore, not a Christian ... according to you.

I see no Biblical foundation for this argument at all.

Personally, your charge neither offends or bothers me, becasue I know my status as Christian, bought and paid for by the blood of Christ and am quite secure in my salvation. But not all readers on this site are and your words could be hurtful and harmful.

Clearly you feel quite passionatly about this subject. I have no desire to change your mind or your actions. I highly respect your personal decision on this matter and I think that discussions like this one are healthy for the individual and for the Body of Christ. But I will not step aside while you imply that mastrubation is somehow a salvation issue or that those who disagree with you could not have been Christians in the first place.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

The scriptures are clear, but some people do not understand them. So I asked for confirmation from God, and some people don't believe that either. I don't think it is a matter of my views vs someone else's views. 2 Corinthians 12:21

I am afraid that when I come again my God will humble me before you, and I will be grieved over many who have sinned earlier and have not repented of theimpurity, sexual sin and debauchery in which they have indulged.

These people knew scripture as well, yet Paul says they have not repented yet.

Ephesians 4:19

Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more.

Paul also says that these people have become so involved in sin that they cannot tell the difference themselves, and that they crave more mof any type of impurity.

If you still don't see it as sin, I ask you to ask God personally.

 

[prestonw]

The scriptures are clear, but some people do not understand them. So I asked for confirmation from God, and some people don't believe that either. I don't think it is a matter of my views vs someone else's views. 2 Corinthians 12:21

I am afraid that when I come again my God will humble me before you, and I will be grieved over many who have sinned earlier and have not repented of theimpurity, sexual sin and debauchery in which they have indulged.

These people knew scripture as well, yet Paul says they have not repented yet.

Ephesians 4:19

Having lost all sensitivity, they have given themselves over to sensuality so as to indulge in every kind of impurity, with a continual lust for more.

Paul also says that these people have become so involved in sin that they cannot tell the difference themselves, and that they crave more mof any type of impurity.

If you still don't see it as sin, I ask you to ask God personally.

This says nothing specific about the issue. The verses that I posted above specifically address the issue. Obviously lusting during the act could be considered a sin as cound doing it in excess, but neither are requirements to the process. I'm sorry, but can you find a verse that specifically calls masturbation a "sexual sin." I have found a verse that just calls it an unclean act, just as it calls sex itself an unclean act, just as it calls menstruation an unclean act.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

The verse you used is not referring to that. It is a form of impurity

 

[prestonw]

The verse you used is not referring to that. It is a form of impurity

What is it referring to then? Do you have a verse in the Bible that addresses the issue in a more direct way then Leviticus 15:16-18? The verses that you noted talk about "sexual sin," but fail to define what "sexual sin" is.

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

When the Bible was written this was so obvious that it wasn't included. It was just something not done, even among many pagans. I ask you to personally ask God.

 

[Faith In God]

This says nothing specific about the issue. The verses that I posted above specifically address the issue. Obviously lusting during the act could be considered a sin as cound doing it in excess, but neither are requirements to the process. I'm sorry, but can you find a verse that specifically calls masturbation a "sexual sin." I have found a verse that just calls it an unclean act, just as it calls sex itself an unclean act, just as it calls menstruation an unclean act.

Dude. if this has already been addressed, forgive me, but touching yourself requires lust.

Don't even argue. It doesn't happen if you are not thinking of lustful things. (nasty thing it is)

Lust is adultery of the heart, and wil be judged.

 

[ByGrace]

I was wondering about wether you think masturbation is a sexual sin. I have been discussing this at xxxchurch .com and it seems that most Christians say no most of the time. This is disturbing.

I struggled with this topic for quite some time. I continually tried to justify why this would be ok and even though I could come up with some convincing arguments (?) the fact that GOD was telling me it was sin was obvious. I have come to a place where I know that we are incapable of overcoming our sins without the Grace of GOD and we have to give it over to HIM. This entails recognizing that it is sin and WANTING to overcome it, not just agreeing that GOD sees it that way. GOD will give you the victory over this if you seek HIM. HE has done this for me and I stand in awe at how quickly HE did it once it was given to HIM. I tried for years to do it myself but failed every time. GOD is our victory. WHile this is not like most sexual sins, you might want to get the books by Steve Gallagher that deal with sexual idolatry. They are amazing in their insight. He is part of the ministry called "pure life" and was given the victory over some attrocious sexual addictions himself. Here is his website........

http://www.purelifeministries.org/

When it is all said and done, we need to look to GOD for the answer to our problems, not mankind. You can find plenty of people that will tell you things are not sinful but GOD is not one of them.

 

[prestonw]

Dude. if this has already been addressed, forgive me, but touching yourself requires lust.

I disagree. For a lot of people it is a major component, but it doesn't have to be.