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profiting off ministry

dayhiker

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Your example of a guy in Brazil who is a billionaire make his money in broadcasting not from collecting tithes. Tho he has been accused of mishandling church money in the past. So its not clear to me that he has prospered off of the church.
 
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ByTheSpirit

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Anything is possible, Jesus said so... what are the chances someone with sooo much wealth would be a "church leader" though? Especially if they chose to spend some of it on such a foolish thing as a Temple of Solomon replica... Give that money to the poor..
 
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Andry

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That's kinda presumptuous isn't it, that chances are God wouldn't call the wealthy to be a church leaders?

Also, how much money should he give to the poor? Give an actual # or % that you think he should give.

And to be clear, I'm neither agreeing or disagreeing with the guy.
 
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So billionaires can't be pastors or pastors can't be billionaires? Or both?
21 Jesus said to him, "If you wish to be complete , go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me."

But when the young man heard this statement, he went away grieving; for he was one who owned much property. And Jesus said to His disciples, "Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

When the disciples heard this, they were very astonished and said, "Then who can be saved?"

And looking at them Jesus said to them, "With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."

Matthew 19:24, Mark 10:25
Not impossible, but hard. And how does it fit with the earlier verses...
You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; Honor your father and mother; and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
Are the leaders lying about how much they need to fund a building or broadcast; are they stealing by telling people God will not bless them unless money is donated to them?

Are they loving the impoverished, dislocated workers, disabled, sick shut-ins as themselves? Insisting that donations are necessary and God's will, but then spending donations on fleets of sports cars?

If a minister is making large amounts without donations or high salaries, it can be from book sales and speaking engagements.

But we must ask also if they are breaking non-profit principles and taking kickbacks (or protection) for backing political agendas, corporations, etc. We hear of comedians who are paid to mention Applebee's in their routines. Some TV preachers have larger audiences, and might be tempted to do the same.

A certain megachurch pastor is running a month-long series on drones. Who benefits from that? Certainly not the parishioners.
 
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The other thread had some good verses:

1 Peter 5: Be shepherds over the flock God has entrusted to you. Watch over it as God does: Don't do this because you have to, but because you want to. Don't do it out of greed, but out of a desire to serve.

Titus 1:7 For an overseer, as God's steward, must be above reproach. He must not be arrogant or quick-tempered or a drunkard or violent or greedy for gain

(overseer)
1 Tim 3:3 not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money.

Part of "Seeing the kingdom" involves God's intervention here on earth. If we distance ourselves from His ways, and from relying on Him, then He can leave us to our own devices and stop moving in our ministries.

The greedy leaders might still be saved, but left to depend on their idols of choice.
 
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Stefos

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Hi everyone,

THE point is this:

Biblical model versus Pastorianity or "Modern day Christianity as being watched on t.v. & as being pushed by Protestant non-denominational denominations."

It's not about Orthodoxy or Catholicism or Protestantism.

It's about God's written word, which none of the denoms. mentioned above are reading in context. The traditions of men have superseded what God's written word, which contains the pattern, talk about! It's sad but true.

And most importantly it's about Christ IN YOU, the hope of glory.

Christ who's name is Faithful & True (The book of Revelation says this) and who is full of Love, Grace & Mercy is about conforming a people to be just like him........period.

This can only happen when we consistently surrender to him & follow him daily and "pass the tests" the Father puts us through!

There is no option B folks.

Let's follow Jesus together....
God Bless you all....Follow the Lord Jesus, Let the Holy Spirit lead

Stefos
 
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phydaux

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Well Phy,

Nice to be back!

Have you stopped fellowshipping at Calvary Chapel and decided to follow the biblical model yet?

You should, it's the ONLY one sanctioned by the Lord.

Stefos

Nope. I'm still wrong.

Jesus loves you, bro, and so do I.
 
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Stefos

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Hi Phy,

I like this quote:
"In essentials, Unity. In nonessentials, Liberty. In all things, Agape."

It's true.

The first thing is Essentials.

If a person doesn't read God's written word for what it is,
they've missed the essentials hence the 5000+ Protestant denominations to include non-denoms, various brands of Orthodoxy and Catholic brands.

I'm sorry brother but there are ramifications for not following what the written word says.

It's called the wrong model where Pastor is glorified, individual believers ministries are effective squelched OR abnegated due to "Pastor running the show every week" along with the "Board" who "run" the church like a business.

Of course, Pastors ministry is based off of the infamous "tithe."

The saddest part is that most "Pastors" probably know what they are teaching is wrong but allow it and let the sheep "co-minister" when they feel it's the right time and not in accord with what the written word says.

Pastorianity & it's sheeple............Bad mix Phy...Bad mix.
Stefos

God bless you brother......Follow Jesus's example as laid out in the word!
 
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phydaux

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Keep prayin' for me, Stef.

I've got a home fellowship starting this January. (And by "home fellowship" I mean a Cell Group.) My focus is going to be on how I can take what God have given me over the years, and give it back to Him by serving those people as best I can.

Please pray that God give me wisdom for my head & love for my heart, and that He keeps my ego in check because that's where I always fail the hardest.
 
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Stefos

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Keep prayin' for me, Stef.

I've got a home fellowship starting this January. (And by "home fellowship" I mean a Cell Group.) My focus is going to be on how I can take what God have given me over the years, and give it back to Him by serving those people as best I can.

Please pray that God give me wisdom for my head & love for my heart, and that He keeps my ego in check because that's where I always fail the hardest.

Don't worry Phy!

When you have a cell group going and you read God's word, you'll see the difference.

I will pray for you.

Remember to tell ALL the believers that they have a ministry..Each one of them...YOU aren't the leader, let Jesus be!

God bless you!
Stefos
 
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