please help. I don't know what to do

[KayJay2000]

This could be extremely long so I will try to cut it down a lot.

I am in a marriage that makes me sad and I can't give my husband the love and intimacy he wants. I know I can't end the marriage but it's not fair on either of us if things continue how they are.

Basically, my husband has had problems with anger and alcohol ever since I've known him. (We have been married for 14 years). He shouts and swears at me loads, telling me everything is my fault. For example he through out all the plants I was growing and when I asked him why he shouted and swore at me for ages telling me that was my fault. In the past he has thrown things across the room and even broken his hand by thumping a door in anger. I do all the childcare as well as work all the hours our children are at school and I'm studying for a degree, but if I ask for any help in the house I get shouted and sworn at. All I generally ask is for him to clear up after himself. Every time I put our children to bed that would also cause an argument as I was apparently being out of order reading to them every night and giving them a bath a couple of times a week. He spends £500 a month on alcohol and therefore putting us into financial difficulty. He has a few weeks a couple of times a year that he doesn't drink so says there is no problem. There have been times when I have been really scared by his aggressive anger and scared to have out children near him.

Sex is a huge issue and hasn't happened for about 7 years. I was raped as a teenager and didn't tell anyone about it until I told my husband 6 years ago. I didn't tell anyone at all as firstly I blamed myself and secondly the memories were too painful. My husband was extremely angry when I told him about this and I really regreted telling him. He is still angry at me about this now. Due to what happened as a teenager I have always found sex hard (in fact I am so scared of it that I actually have panic attacks every time we had sex and I get flashbacks of what happened). Sex stopped happening early on in our marriage as I found it really hard as if my husband wanted sex he expected me to also. But if it was the other way round he would get angry at me. If I tried to put my arm round him in bed or talk to him he would hit me. I soon learned to go to bed and turn the other way and only talk if he wanted to. Soon any intimacy at all was gone.

I don't know what to do. My husband has said thousands of times over the years that he will stop but it never lasts. I try to not allow myself to believe him any more as I am always so upset when he doesn't change. At the moment he is slightly better then he has been but even if he did manage to change I don't think I could ever give him the intimacy and sex that he wants as even the thought of being intimate with him really scares me. I really don't know what to do.

 

[johndoo]

His issue is his verbal and physical abuse, alcohol abuse, and anger issues. These are not appropriate for any marriage. He may be depressed but he would need to take an active role in working on these issues for there to be any improvement.

Your issue that you have portrayed is sex aversion and it can be treated with high quality therapy.
Start where you can. Talk to your pastor. See a marriage counselor. Your local doctor may be able to direct you to resources. I've prayed for you and your children.

 

[ValleyGal]

KayJay, your first order of priority is safety for you and your children. It is traumatic for your children to witness his anger and rage. Where I live, this is a child protection issue. Please, talk to a social worker. They can help you make a plan and find you a safe place to go. They can help you figure out what is next for your marriage, for you, and for your children. The important part is that they see your willingness to protect them from the constant fear they live in. Even if you do not involve a social worker and do this on your own, you need to get your children and yourself to a safe place. Once you are in a safe place and do not live in your constant heightened fear, you will be able to evaluate your situation more clearly and make decisions that are not based on your immediate fears.

If you do leave in order to find safety, you should seek therapy for yourself and maybe even for your children. You should deal with your rape, but also you need to work through your marriage issues and fear as well, and learn how to set some firm boundaries.

Boundaries with your husband are important. You are responsible for yourself as well as your children, so you need to decide how you will and will not be treated, and what kinds of ways you allow your children to live. It means letting in the good and keeping out the bad. Your husband's drinking and raging are bad, and you can choose to not live with his issues anymore - without telling him that he needs to change.

He does not have to change if he does not want to. His behaviour is his business. But you can change...and you do not have to allow yourself or your children be treated in this way or live in this angry atmosphere. You can choose to have relationships with healthy people who are able to manage their anger appropriately. Once he has shown that he is healthy and can manage his own emotions and drinking, then you could re-evaluate the marriage, if you are so inclined at that time. That is a healthy boundary. Imo, it is necessary to establish boundaries - what you will and will not accept - and the first one pertains to yours and your children`s safety and well-being.

 

[sdmsanjose]

By Kayjay
Basically, my husband has had problems with anger and alcohol ever since I've known him.

At the moment he is slightly better than he has been but even if he did manage to change I don't think I could ever give him the intimacy and sex that he wants as even the thought of being intimate with him really scares me. I really don't know what to do.

By ValleyGal
KayJay, your first order of priority is safety for you and your children.

As ValleyGal has stated “…your first order of priority is safety for you and your children.”

The next issues for your concerns are your marriage and sex. I am going to give you my advice from a man’s point of view. Your issues with your husband’s alcohol, anger and your sex issues in the past and now are some extremely difficult issues to deal with. In fact your chances of making your marriage work are very low. I do not want to be negative but this is what I see in reality with the issues and chances that you have.

I had an employee that was great in every way except that he was and is an alcoholic. He was a great worker and very generous with his family and did not have anger problems. Because of his alcoholism he has lost the affection of his wife, the respect of his children, and lost many good paying jobs. I personally took him to pastors and 12-step meeting and kept him as an employee for 20 years. He quit his employment with me and went to work for a man that was a drinker like he is. He was fired from that job when he failed the tests for alcohol and has lost other good jobs because of alcohol. He has been jailed and hospitalized several times for his addiction. He is still with his wife but she is there only because she has compromised a lot as she is in survival mode. Her son got kicked out of his apartment along with his 3 children and she refused to take them in. This tells you a little about the miserable existence that this alcoholic man and his family have. I have followed this man and his family for around 30 years and had hopes. The marriage that I see with this man is so miserable that I would think that being a single person in poverty would be better.

You not only have a husband that is an alcoholic but has anger also. In addition, your sex and intimacy situations would be a problem for most men even if they did not have anger and alcohol issues. You ask us what to do and I will tell you my opinion. You should make sure that you and your children are safe and continue your education until you get able to support yourself and children. To concentrate on your marriage is to take away from preparing yourself for a better life. Your marriage is miserable and the chance of it getting substantially better is slim to none and I think slim has left the building.

I know there are some people that think that these issues of anger, alcohol, rape, sex, and intimacy can be overcome but in my observation of real life you will have a much better chance of having a better life by concentrating on you becoming as self-sufficient as your can.

 

[faroukfarouk]

While I don't believe that, Scripturally, divorce is the panacea of all ills, yet personal safety for wives and children in the face of violent, drunken men, is a hugely important issue, which needs to be addressed.

Praying...

 

[Odetta]

You need to physically remove yourself and your children from this dangerous situation, and then you need to concentrate on getting counseling to deal with the rape and abuse. Only then will you be in a position to make a decision on what to do with your marriage. ValleyGirl gave you some very wise advice.

 

[Inkachu]

Definitely get yourself and your children to a safe place first.

If you and your husband are both determined and committed to remain married, then you both need to get into therapy with a professional (not just an untrained "counselor" at church). You need to find healing from the horror that you suffered in the past when you were assaulted, and that will take time. Your husband needs help to overcome his alcohol use and his abusive behaviors towards you.

This is not about a lack of sex. This is about two very damaged people who desperately need help.

 

[sdmsanjose]

By Inkachu
Definitely get yourself and your children to a safe place first.

If you and your husband are both determined and committed to remain married, then you both need to get into counseling with a professional (not just an untrained "counselor" at church). You need to find healing from the horror that you suffered in the past when you were assaulted, and that will take time. Your husband needs help to overcome his alcohol use and his abusive behaviors towards you.

This is not about a lack of sex. This is about two very damaged people who desperately need help.

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[FONT=&quot]I agree with everything that Inkachu said except; the lack of sex will be an issue with just about any man. I think that the most important problems are his alcoholism and abuse but to say that sex has nothing to do with this very damaged marriage; well I have to disagree with Inkachu for once. Kayjay’s horrible trauma about rape is more important and damaging than lack of sex but they are connected and sex is an important issue to address at some point.[/FONT]
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By kayjay
Sex is a huge issue and hasn't happened for about 7 years
At the moment he is slightly better then he has been but even if he did manage to change I don't think I could ever give him the intimacy and sex that he wants as even the thought of being intimate with him really scares me.

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Even Kayjay knows that the lack of sex is one of the problems; even if it is not the most damaging problem.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Kayjay, maybe you and your husband can overcome the alcholism, abuse, rape, lack of sex and intimacy but I still would strongly suggest that[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“you will have a much better chance of having a better life by concentrating on you becoming as self-sufficient as your can.”[/FONT][FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

 

[KayJay2000]

Thank you for all your comments. I agree with all of them and have done for years. I suppose the problem is that I seem incapable of doing anything about it.

A couple of weeks before we got married I noticed this behaviour, but I was young and niavie and I thought everything would be fine. Things got worse and worse but in a.strange way it didn't seem to bother me as things were far worse throughout my whole childhood as my my was very abusive everyday.

Initially sex was ok. It scared me but I thought it was just me being silly. I didn't link it to being raped as I thought that was entirely my fault. Sex got harder and harder for me, but I still did it when my husband wanted to. Soon he started to hit me in bed if I tried to start conversation or started trying to initiate sex. I learned the only way to not be hit in bed was to get into bed and go straight to sleep facing the other way. I then started to make excuses for not having sex as it was scaring me more and more. The smell of alcohol and after being shouted and sworn at made it really hard for me to want sex and then having no intimacy at all just straight to sex made it all impossible for me to have sex. I started to make excuses as I was so scared and just the thought of it would cause me to hyperventilate and have flashbacks.

After a few years of no sex and lots of anger, shouting and drinking, his behaviour was really scaring me and I started to think the whole thing was my fault due to the lack of sex. I went to a councellor and tried to sort out our sex life. I realised that being raped and abused by my mother as a child was not my fault and I began to realise how it was effecting me. I told my husband about what had happened to me as a child which took me great courage as I hadn't told anyone before. He was extremely angry at me about this which made opening up to him even harder than it already was.

The counsellor said to take things very slowly with sex and start with massaging only. We tried this on a few occasions but my husband wanted more than just that and although I had made it very clear what we could and couldn't do, he would always take it a lot further than what I was comfortable with. This happened a few times and it got to the point that I couldn't even do the massaging as I was too scared as I didn't feel I could trust him to keep to the boundaries. Since then the whole idea of sex absolutely petrifies me and makes me feel physically sick.

My husband has just come home now so I will add something else to this post later.

 

[KayJay2000]

Sorry if my last post was too much detail. I'm not trying to say that it's not my fault. I know I should have somehow told my husband sooner than I did. I know he blames everything on me because of this and I know he is partly right although his anger and alcohol problems were there there before all this happened. Actually, the more I think about this, the more confused I am.

As I said in my last post, I know I need to do something but I haven't got the courage to. Also at the moment things aren't quite as bad. Also, if I am honest, this is normal to me. My mum put me through far far worse thoughout my childhood and teenage years so I sort of feel like I shouldn't complain now. My children mean everything to me and I am trying to do what is best for them. I don't want to have to put them through us seperating. After what I went through as a child all I want is a perfect childhood for my children and to me seperating is not that. I also worry about what the church will say. I have spoken to a couple of people at church who say that unless he is hitting me (he hasn't for a long time) then I should stay.

 

[DZoolander]

So your children are oblivious to what's going on between you and your husband, and you think they will continue to be so?

...and you think that the environment you are exposing them to is "the perfect childhood"?

 

[tall73]

It sounds unlikely they would not be aware of his drinking problems. If it has been years since he hit you they may not be aware of that. What changed to make him stop hitting you? Does he ever still threaten to hit you?

How old are the kids?

It sounds like he is maintaining a job? When he quits drinking for a couple weeks, is this on purpose? How much does he drink per day?

Is he angry when he doesn't drink?

 

[Inkachu]

Sdm - I wasn't saying that a lack of sex in a marriage isn't a problem. But in this instance, IMHO, it's a symptom of much bigger underlying problems. The lack of sex isn't CAUSING the current marital problems, it's a natural result of the trauma, abuse, and unresolved issues going on.

Lack of sex in a HEALTHY marriage is a problem. This isn't that sort of scenario. I wouldn't expect a healthy sex life to be occurring in a marriage filled with abuse, resentment, and baggage.

 

[Inkachu]

Thank you for all your comments. I agree with all of them and have done for years. I suppose the problem is that I seem incapable of doing anything about it.

A couple of weeks before we got married I noticed this behaviour, but I was young and niavie and I thought everything would be fine. Things got worse and worse but in a.strange way it didn't seem to bother me as things were far worse throughout my whole childhood as my my was very abusive everyday.

Initially sex was ok. It scared me but I thought it was just me being silly. I didn't link it to being raped as I thought that was entirely my fault. Sex got harder and harder for me, but I still did it when my husband wanted to. Soon he started to hit me in bed if I tried to start conversation or started trying to initiate sex. I learned the only way to not be hit in bed was to get into bed and go straight to sleep facing the other way. I then started to make excuses for not having sex as it was scaring me more and more. The smell of alcohol and after being shouted and sworn at made it really hard for me to want sex and then having no intimacy at all just straight to sex made it all impossible for me to have sex. I started to make excuses as I was so scared and just the thought of it would cause me to hyperventilate and have flashbacks.

After a few years of no sex and lots of anger, shouting and drinking, his behaviour was really scaring me and I started to think the whole thing was my fault due to the lack of sex. I went to a councellor and tried to sort out our sex life. I realised that being raped and abused by my mother as a child was not my fault and I began to realise how it was effecting me. I told my husband about what had happened to me as a child which took me great courage as I hadn't told anyone before. He was extremely angry at me about this which made opening up to him even harder than it already was.

The counsellor said to take things very slowly with sex and start with massaging only. We tried this on a few occasions but my husband wanted more than just that and although I had made it very clear what we could and couldn't do, he would always take it a lot further than what I was comfortable with. This happened a few times and it got to the point that I couldn't even do the massaging as I was too scared as I didn't feel I could trust him to keep to the boundaries. Since then the whole idea of sex absolutely petrifies me and makes me feel physically sick.

My husband has just come home now so I will add something else to this post later.

I don't know what kind of counselor this was, but in my opinion, they were a complete idiot to try and "fix" your sex life without addressing your childhood abuse OR the fact that your husband has an alcohol problem and hits you!!

For God's sake, if you get into therapy (which I hope you will), do NOT go back to that same counselor!! Find a professional, please.

 

[ValleyGal]

As I said in my last post, I know I need to do something but I haven't got the courage to. Also at the moment things aren't quite as bad. Also, if I am honest, this is normal to me. My mum put me through far far worse thoughout my childhood and teenage years so I sort of feel like I shouldn't complain now. My children mean everything to me and I am trying to do what is best for them. I don't want to have to put them through us seperating. After what I went through as a child all I want is a perfect childhood for my children and to me seperating is not that. I also worry about what the church will say. I have spoken to a couple of people at church who say that unless he is hitting me (he hasn't for a long time) then I should stay.

It is better for children to be raised by one single parent in a peaceful home rather than a home where there is strife, anger, drinking, etc. Children are resilient and can adapt to a separation, but if they come from this kind of atmosphere as an adult, they will learn that this is an acceptable way for them to conduct themselves in their own marriages. It affects them negatively for a lifetime - which is why it is a child protection issue. Living this way is traumatic for them, just as your own childhood was traumatic for you, having an abusive mother. Just because it is "normal" for you does not make it right for your children, and if you really are trying to do what is best for them, then think about what keeping them there is doing to them.

Living with an angry person raises stress response, so you are always living at the fight/flight/freeze state. This is very, very hard on a person's system, and the long term effects of living this way are not good. If they grow up in this heightened state of stress, they will have long term consequences - physical as well as mental/emotional.

Why do you care what the church says more than you care how your children grow up? A separation does not mean it is permanent. You are in danger of physical abuse. For him to use fear as a means to control you or your children is a form of mental abuse. And if you stay, you are in fact party to his mental abuse of your children. Protecting your children is your primary concern right now....not what the church thinks. Besides, if the church thinks you should stay unless he is hitting you, then they have no idea about domestic abuse and violence.

I am 100% serious when I say to go find a social worker. They can help you. You said you don't have the courage to do something about your situation...but you will find a social worker to be very helpful and supportive so that you can sort out what is the best thing for you and your children, and they will help you do what is best for you and your children. They will give you all referrals for professional helps as you each need it, they will help with legalities of it all, etc.

 

[Inkachu]

Living with an angry person raises stress response, so you are always living at the fight/flight/freeze state. This is very, very hard on a person's system, and the long term effects of living this way are not good. If they grow up in this heightened state of stress, they will have long term consequences - physical as well as mental/emotional.

This is SO very true. I grew up in a house with constant fighting. I was having panic attacks when I was a little girl, but I was too little and naive to know what they were, so we called them my "jitter jatters" because I would lie in bed and physically tremble and didn't know why. As a teen it expanded into full blown, constant anxiety, panic attacks, and depression that led to self-injury. I still struggle with it to this day (I'm in my 30's now). While the jolt of separation may be extremely difficult in the short term, if it brings about changes that result in a more peaceful home life for your children, it'll be worth it. Please don't sentence your kids to the problems I've dealt with all my life.

 

[sdmsanjose]

[FONT=&quot]By Inkachu[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Sdm - I wasn't saying that a lack of sex in a marriage isn't a problem. But in this instance, IMHO, it's a symptom of much bigger underlying problems[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I can agree with your statement above 100%[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]By Inkachu[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]I don't know what kind of counselor this was, but in my opinion, they were a complete idiot to try and "fix" your sex life without addressing your childhood abuse OR the fact that your husband has an alcohol problem and hits you!!

For God's sake, if you get into therapy (which I hope you will), do NOT go back to that same counselor!! Find a professional, please.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Kayjay, when you go back to therapy I hope you realize how important the message to you above is![/FONT]

 

[sdmsanjose]

[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]By ValleyGal[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is better for children to be raised by one single parent in a peaceful home rather than a home where there is strife, anger, drinking, etc[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]This is 100% true and my father’s life proves this! My father and his sisters had problems when they were real young and their alcoholic and abusive father was in the home. When my grandmother because a single mother she raised the children into teen agers and adults in a peaceful home. My father and all his sisters grew up to be very good people and were successful. The few problems my father had in life were directly related to his father’s alcoholism and abuse.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
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[FONT=&quot]By ValleyGal[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Living with an angry person raises stress response, so you are always living at the fight/flight/freeze state. This is very, very hard on a person's system, and the long term effects of living this way are not good. If they grow up in this heightened state of stress, they will have long term consequences - physical as well as mental/emotional.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And if you stay, you are in fact party to his mental abuse of your children.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Protecting your children is your primary concern right now....not what the church thinks.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Protecting your children is definitely your primary concern and they should not be exposed to such stress while you wait for your husband to get better or even for you to get better. Get the stress off your children then get to work on you getting better; you have no control over your husband so do not wait for him.[/FONT]

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Sorry if my last post was too much detail. I'm not trying to say that it's not my fault. I know I should have somehow told my husband sooner than I did. I know he blames everything on me because of this and I know he is partly right although his anger and alcohol problems were there there before all this happened. Actually, the more I think about this, the more confused I am.

As I said in my last post, I know I need to do something but I haven't got the courage to. Also at the moment things aren't quite as bad. Also, if I am honest, this is normal to me. My mum put me through far far worse thoughout my childhood and teenage years so I sort of feel like I shouldn't complain now. My children mean everything to me and I am trying to do what is best for them. I don't want to have to put them through us seperating. After what I went through as a child all I want is a perfect childhood for my children and to me seperating is not that. I also worry about what the church will say. I have spoken to a couple of people at church who say that unless he is hitting me (he hasn't for a long time) then I should stay.

I am currently separated from my husband who has alcohol and anger issues. I don't know about where you live, but where I am, punching walls and destroying property are domestic violence offenses.

I put up with his behavior for almost 16 years. Finally, I had enough and called the police. He was arrested, spent 3 weeks in jail (because I wouldn't bail him out) and is serving 18 months on probation, court ordered alcohol, anger management and domestic violence classes. Fortunately, we have no children.

I bolded the above where you said you wanted a "perfect" childhood for your children. Do you really think them living with someone who shows those sort of behaviors is giving them a "perfect" childhood?

The best advice I can give you from someone who's been there is to separate. IMMEDIATELY. Get you and your children to a place of safety. His abuse of you is NOT your fault. However it is your fault that you've let it go on this long (as my therapist told me).

Regarding what people at church might say...who cares? They don't live in your house.

Here's what I did...maybe you can find something in there.
When my husband was released from jail, I told him that he could not and would not live with me. He also could not contact me for any reason whatsoever until such time as I was ready for contact. It took a couple of months. At that point we started marriage counseling and going to church together. That was ALL the contact we had, still living separately. We are still in that stage right now. I need time to heal, to live without wondering when the next explosion would come, and he needs time to do what he needs to do. We are coming up on a decision point...whether to resume some sort of relationship...more like dating again, but no intimate contact. It has been an eye-opening experience for BOTH of us...he has come to the realization that he is an abuser, and is attempting to deal with the repercussions of that behavior, and I am realizing that I put up with his rubbish for FAR too long.

I truly think that if we had children, I would have ended the marriage. But since we didn't and don't...I was more willing to put up with it.

I do care deeply for my husband. I don't know that I "love" him anymore, I don't trust him and I don't respect him. We are working through a process to see if we can reconcile. I don't know how this story will end.

And, no, I have not even THOUGHT about another relationship. I know I am still dealing with the 16 years of abuse and no where near emotionally healthy to think about ANY relationship with a man...even my husband. I'm building a life that is healthy and peaceful. If my husband fits in it, then we will reconcile. If not...then we won't.

 

[Inkachu]

FWIW my parents stayed together (barely), and while it gave me a sense of security, it also exposed me and my brother to decades of fights, arguments, screaming, yelling, throwing things, anxiety, terror, guilt, sadness, and a host of other horribly unhealthy things that we carry to this day. I'm not an advocate of divorce, but when a family is broken to the point of abuse (physical, verbal, and/or emotional), especially when children are involved, I am very much an advocate for separation and safety until things are dealt with and repaired via counseling.