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Peter and Paul

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eph3Nine

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PETER AND PAUL


  • QUESTION: I've been told that Peter's epistles were addressed to believers of the Kingdom church, and not to the Church of this dispensation, the Body of Christ. My question concerns his second epistle. In the salutation, the apostle addressed his letter "to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Savior Jesus Christ." In chapter three, verses 15 and 16, he noted that "....our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given to him hath written unto you." Did Paul write letters to the Kingdom church, or was Peter's letter written to believers in the Body of Christ?
  • ANSWER: Peter wrote to Jews who continued to follow Christ's teachings for the Kingdom Dispensation. Peter and Paul were friends. They each represented a different Dispensation, but each fellowshiped with the other's group. Paul visited Jerusalem and met with the Kingdom Apostles. Peter visited Antioch and met with the Grace Gospel Apostles. They understood and accepted the differences and similarities. Even though they followed Christ through different Household Rules, they both served the same Lord and Savior. Paul opposed Peter to his face when he withdrew from eating with Gentiles in Antioch when some Jews visited from Jerusalem. Peter was afraid of these men. Paul called Peter's actions hypocrisy and said they "were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel." Paul reminded Peter and other Jews who had followed him that "We who are Jews by birth and not 'Gentile sinners' know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ." (Galatians 2)

    Peter told his Jewish audience that though Paul wrote letters containing "some things that are hard to understand," what he wrote was Scripture and true. Paul apparently wrote one or more letters to people he knew from the Kingdom Dispensation, but we have no record of them. Paul wrote other letters that were not saved as part of God's Word. Letter writing was a primary means of communication at that time. Paul's ministry was specifically to Gentiles and Jews in the Age of Grace. That was his calling and authority. His letters were copied and sent from church to church to church. It may be that Peter's audience also read copies of Paul's letters to Christian churches. Paul's teaching was quite different from Peter's because his was a different Dispensation of God. Peter made it clear that even though Paul's teaching was hard to understand, it was still God's Word and should be revered as Truth. Peter may have also written a letter or letters to Gentile believers. Peter visited Gentile churches and knew the believers on a personal basis. He may have stayed in contact with them by letter. However, Peter did not have the authority to write the Gentiles as "their" apostle. Peter's authority was to the Jews. Paul's to the Gentiles.
 
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eph3Nine

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eph3Nine

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Ebb said:
What are the answers to the three questions posed by I Corinthians 1:13?

13Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

No, No, No.

This proves your division of Paul and Peter's gospel is a false teaching.

Its not false...its UPDATED! You really do need to study it out, instead of just saying, "the sky isnt falling, it isnt it isnt". :)
 
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eph3Nine

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Ebb said:
What are the answers to the three questions posed by I Corinthians 1:13?

13Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

No, No, No.

This proves your division of Paul and Peter's gospel is a false teaching.

LOL...it would take more than this to prove Gods MYSTERY program to be false. :)

1 Cor was addressed to the most carnal people on the face of the earth! God called em "saints"...as their identity HAD changed, but their immature thinking and behavior had not yet had time to play 'catch up'. They were still arguing over the "elemental things" like baptism and tongues and silly things that stirred up their flesh. Dont yank scripture out of context to try and prove what cannot be proven when scripture is allowed to speak for itself.

You are fighting NOT against flesh and blood here...God revealed it, God warns against going BACK to any OTHER gospel that was BEFORE IT, and he tells us that by Pauls information we are to be ESTABLISHED in the faith..NOT by Peters information, but Pauls...WHY? Because its brand NEW and is the ONLY Information dealing with the BODY OF CHRIST which was in times PAST still a SECRET and HID IN GOD.

Your argument IS , and will continue to be with God Himself. Its one I can assure you , you will not win. Hes not into a contest with you, He simply wants you to STOP, put aside preconceived 'churchianity' and 'religiousity' ideas , and READ the scriptures rightly divided.

Its NOT hard...but the pride will take a blow.
 
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biblebeliever123

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Ebb said:
What are the answers to the three questions posed by I Corinthians 1:13?

13Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

No, No, No.

This proves your division of Paul and Peter's gospel is a false teaching.

The answer to the three questions posed is no, no, no...agreed...but it does not prove that Peter and Paul's gospel is the same!!

We are told by Paul (by divine inspiration, just as those 3 questions are posed) in the same letter.... 1 Corinthians 4:16 Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.
1 Corinthians 11:1 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.

And also.... Philippians 3:17 Brethren, be followers together of me, and mark them which walk so as ye have us for an ensample.
1 Thessalonians 1:6 And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost.
2 Thessalonians 3:7 For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;2 Thessalonians 3:8 Neither did we eat any man's bread for nought; but wrought with labour and travail night and day, that we might not be chargeable to any of you:2 Thessalonians 3:9 Not because we have not power, but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us.

Paul calls the gospel he preached..."MY" gospel; "OUR" gospel; "that gospel which I (Paul) preach among the gentiles; the gospel which was preached of me (paul)

Romans 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to MY GOSPEL.
Romans 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to MY GOSPEL, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you THE GOSPEL WHICH I PREACHED UNTO YOU , which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 Corinthians 4:3 But if OUR GOSPEL be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
Galatians 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them THAT GOSPEL WHICH I PREACH AMONG THE GENTILES , but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
1 Thessalonians 1:5 For OUR GOSPEL came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.
2 Thessalonians 2:14 Whereunto he called you by OUR GOSPEL, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 Timothy 2:8 Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to MY GOSPEL;

What does Paul mean when he says...Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

There is an apparent change in God's dealing with mankind...Paul's epistles make it very clear and apparent. Paul was given a new message, a new ministry....not the same message and ministry that Peter and the 11 had to the nation Israel.
To Paul was committed a dispensation of the gospel; he was made the minister of that gospel; it was given to Paul to give to 'you ward'.

Christ is not divided...Paul was most definitely not crucified for us...and we are not baptized in the name of Paul.... but there is MOST DEFINITELY a different message given to Paul that was not to Peter and the apostles of Israel. It's the preaching of Jesus Christ .....how?? ACCORDING to the REVELATION OF THE MYSTERY.
 
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Ebb

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biblebeliever123 said:
Paul calls the gospel he preached..."MY" gospel; "OUR" gospel; "that gospel which I (Paul) preach among the gentiles; the gospel which was preached of me (paul)

Romans 2:16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to MY GOSPEL.
Romans 16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to MY GOSPEL, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you THE GOSPEL WHICH I PREACHED UNTO YOU , which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 Corinthians 4:3 But if OUR GOSPEL be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:
Galatians 2:2 And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them THAT GOSPEL WHICH I PREACH AMONG THE GENTILES , but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain.
1 Thessalonians 1:5 For OUR GOSPEL came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.
2 Thessalonians 2:14 Whereunto he called you by OUR GOSPEL, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2 Timothy 2:8 Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to MY GOSPEL;

What does Paul mean when he says...Romans 11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

There is an apparent change in God's dealing with mankind...Paul's epistles make it very clear and apparent. Paul was given a new message, a new ministry....not the same message and ministry that Peter and the 11 had to the nation Israel.
To Paul was committed a dispensation of the gospel; he was made the minister of that gospel; it was given to Paul to give to 'you ward'.

Christ is not divided...Paul was most definitely not crucified for us...and we are not baptized in the name of Paul.... but there is MOST DEFINITELY a different message given to Paul that was not to Peter and the apostles of Israel. It's the preaching of Jesus Christ .....how?? ACCORDING to the REVELATION OF THE MYSTERY.

Thanks for the response and the scriptures. Some more scriptures where Paul spoke about the gospel would include:


8But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. Galatians 1:7-9


3But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him. 2 Corinthians 11:3-4


Since Paul would not be condemning Peter here, which he calls a "pillar" (Gal 2:9), the gospel, then, must be the same gospel, and the Jesus, the same Jesus, albeit to different groups. Paul, being entrused to the ministry to the Gentiles, is given additional information, but this is not opposed to Peter's, but complimentary.
 
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biblebeliever123

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Ebb said:
Thanks for the response and the scriptures. Some more scriptures where Paul spoke about the gospel would include:



8But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. Galatians 1:7-9



3But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him. 2 Corinthians 11:3-4



Since Paul would not be condemning Peter here, which he calls a "pillar" (Gal 2:9), the gospel, then, must be the same gospel, and the Jesus, the same Jesus, albeit to different groups. Paul, being entrused to the ministry to the Gentiles, is given additional information, but this is not opposed to Peter's, but complimentary.


Let's go a little further into the context.. Galatians 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Paul's message was given to him not by any man but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Galatians 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,Galatians 1:16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:Galatians 1:17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.

In chapter 2 Paul went to Jerusalem BY REVELATION. He says that he "communicated unto them (them who? peter and apostles) THAT GOSPEL WHICH I PREACH AMONG THE GENTILES, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain." (verse 2)

If Paul preached the same gospel why is it said 'that gospel which I preach among the gentiles' or why have to 'communicate' this gospel 'privately to them which were of some reputation'.

In verses 6,7, Paul says '....in conference (they) ADDED NOTHING TO ME, BUT CONTRARIWISE'. Paul understood the prophetic program so they could add nothing to him (paul) but 'contrariwise' he (paul) was able to add something to them... that gospel which he preached among the gentiles (the preaching of Jesus Christ ACCORDING TO THE REVELATION OF THE MYSTERY).

Peter, James, John were ministers of the circumcision... and they agreed to confine their ministry to that little flock. If they preached the kingdom gospel to those at galatia they would indeed have been preaching another gospel than that which Paul preached unto them. If people this very day preach 'repent and be baptized for the remission of sins'... if they preach the 'gospel of the kingdom' rather than the gospel message given to and through the apostle Paul by the risen, ascended, glorified Lord for this dispensation of the gospel of the grace of God....those people would be preaching 'another gospel and another Jesus.'

Peter, James, and John gave to Paul and Barnabas "the right hand of fellowship" publicly acknowledging that Paul was NOW God's choice to go to the Gentiles, while they (Peter, James and John) went back to their ministry among the Jews. (gal. 2:7-9)
 
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eph3Nine

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biblebeliever123 said:
Let's go a little further into the context.. Galatians 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.Galatians 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Paul's message was given to him not by any man but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Galatians 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,Galatians 1:16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:Galatians 1:17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.

In chapter 2 Paul went to Jerusalem BY REVELATION. He says that he "communicated unto them (them who? peter and apostles) THAT GOSPEL WHICH I PREACH AMONG THE GENTILES, but privately to them which were of reputation, lest by any means I should run, or had run, in vain." (verse 2)

If Paul preached the same gospel why is it said 'that gospel which I preach among the gentiles' or why have to 'communicate' this gospel 'privately to them which were of some reputation'.

In verses 6,7, Paul says '....in conference (they) ADDED NOTHING TO ME, BUT CONTRARIWISE'. Paul understood the prophetic program so they could add nothing to him (paul) but 'contrariwise' he (paul) was able to add something to them... that gospel which he preached among the gentiles (the preaching of Jesus Christ ACCORDING TO THE REVELATION OF THE MYSTERY).

Peter, James, John were ministers of the circumcision... and they agreed to confine their ministry to that little flock. If they preached the kingdom gospel to those at galatia they would indeed have been preaching another gospel than that which Paul preached unto them. If people this very day preach 'repent and be baptized for the remission of sins'... if they preach the 'gospel of the kingdom' rather than the gospel message given to and through the apostle Paul by the risen, ascended, glorified Lord for this dispensation of the gospel of the grace of God....those people would be preaching 'another gospel and another Jesus.'

Peter, James, and John gave to Paul and Barnabas "the right hand of fellowship" publicly acknowledging that Paul was NOW God's choice to go to the Gentiles, while they (Peter, James and John) went back to their ministry among the Jews. (gal. 2:7-9)

Aaaaaamen...so clear.
 
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