Oregon Standoff

[smaneck]

It seems most of the participants in the Oregon standoff are Mormons. Now I'm not suggesting that the Mormon Church is responsible for its wingnuts, but the Church does have a lot of power and authority in relationship to its membership. I would think it would be helpful at this point if the Church were to send in one of their Bishops or higher-ups there to mediate a solution. Perhaps tell them to stand-down on pain of excommunication?

 

[Chesterton]

When the government takes away something valuable that rightfully belongs to you, you too will become a "wingnut", or at least I hope you will.

 

[smaneck]

When the government takes away something valuable that rightfully belongs to you, you too will become a "wingnut", or at least I hope you will.

It rightfully belongs to the Northern Paiute Tribe who have worked out an arrangement with the federal government allowing them to use the land according to their traditional practices. Without giving up their rightful claim they appear to be satisfied with the federal government's stewardship over the refuge. It does not and never did belong to ranchers, miners or loggers. As the tribal chief pointed out, these ranchers did not come over on the Bering Strait, that they can claim this land.

 

[Chesterton]

It rightfully belongs to the Northern Paiute Tribe who have worked out an arrangement with the federal government allowing them to use the land according to their traditional practices. Without giving up their rightful claim they appear to be satisfied with the federal government's stewardship over the refuge. It does not and never did belong to ranchers, miners or loggers. As the tribal chief pointed out, these ranchers did not come over on the Bering Strait, that they can claim this land.

Interesting. Where do you live, and did you have a pleasant trip across the Strait?

 

[smaneck]

Interesting. Where do you live, and did you have a pleasant trip across the Strait?

I'm not trying to claim federal land as my own.

 

[withwonderingawe]

Do we actually know the history or who owned what and when?

 

[Zoness]

When the government takes away something valuable that rightfully belongs to you, you too will become a "wingnut", or at least I hope you will.

Which is why I'm surprised the natives haven't tried something similar, especially since it started as their land. They probably knew that if they tried it, the military would have incinerated them by now.

 

[smaneck]

Which is why I'm surprised the natives haven't tried something similar, especially since it started as their land.

Because they have an agreement with the government to use that land for its traditional purposes. They can hunt there, perform their sacred ceremonies, gather reeds for their baskets, etc. And the government has to pay for the upkeep. So unless the Native Americans want to build a casino on that land or use it for other commercial purposes, I'd say the current arrangement works for them.

 

[smaneck]

Do we actually know the history or who owned what and when?

The Northern Paiute settled in that land about 1300 years ago.In southeastern Oregon, the Burns Paiute and the other Northern Paiute tribes possess unceded claims to what was once a 1.78-million-acre reservation called the Malheur Indian Reservation. The Malheur Wildlife Refuge was just a small part of that reservation, and although the tribe signed a treaty with the U.S. government in 1868, it was never ratified by Congress and the land remains unceded.
Read more athttp://indiancountrytodaymedianetwo...n-militia-northern-paiutes-trail-tears-162990

 

[JackRT]

The Northern Paiute settled in that land about 1300 years ago.In southeastern Oregon, the Burns Paiute and the other Northern Paiute tribes possess unceded claims to what was once a 1.78-million-acre reservation called the Malheur Indian Reservation. The Malheur Wildlife Refuge was just a small part of that reservation, and although the tribe signed a treaty with the U.S. government in 1868, it was never ratified by Congress and the land remains unceded.
Read more athttp://indiancountrytodaymedianetwo...n-militia-northern-paiutes-trail-tears-162990

Treaties signed by the tribes with the USA have a long history of breakage.

 

[withwonderingawe]

So why are these people protesting ? I'm sorry when I heard the guy was calling himself Captain Moroni I just started to ignore the whole thing. Our 12th Article of Faith reads;

We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

It's one thing to have a little civil disobedience by chaining yourself to the front door and quite another to bringing guns strapped to your hip.

 

[Alla27]

It seems most of the participants in the Oregon standoff are Mormons. Now I'm not suggesting that the Mormon Church is responsible for its wingnuts, but the Church does have a lot of power and authority in relationship to its membership.

Really? Interesting that I have been a member since 2003 and only now I am learning this from non LDS.
what kind of power does the Church have in relationship to me? could you tell me, please? If I am LDS I have to know this.

 

[Ironhold]

It seems most of the participants in the Oregon standoff are Mormons.

...which the church is pretty upset about.

 

[smaneck]

Treaties signed by the tribes with the USA have a long history of breakage.

Really?

 

[Chesterton]

Really? Interesting that I have been a member since 2003 and only now I am learning this from non LDS.
what kind of power does the Church have in relationship to me? could you tell me, please? If I am LDS I have to know this.

Yeah, don't give it a moment's thought, it's a non-issue. Some posters would love to draw attention to a splinter in a distant brother's eye to distract from the beam in a closer brother's eye.

 

[smaneck]

...which the church is pretty upset about.

They need to send someone to Oregon and tell this to the Bundys directly. They ought to send somebody to talk to Cliven about his behavior as well. These guys claim they aren't afraid to die, it wouldn't hurt for the church to suggest what might happen to them afterwards.

 

[smaneck]

Really? Interesting that I have been a member since 2003 and only now I am learning this from non LDS.
what kind of power does the Church have in relationship to me? could you tell me, please? If I am LDS I have to know this.

If you go and marry a second wife they will excommunicate you. Why shouldn't they excommunicate Mormons for engaging in armed insurrection?

 

[smaneck]

Yeah, don't give it a moment's thought, it's a non-issue. Some posters would love to draw attention to a splinter in a distant brother's eye to distract from the beam in a closer brother's eye.

Go stuff it, Chesterton. The Mormons here know I don't get my jollies attacking them like most of the Christians on this forum have.

 

[withwonderingawe]

If you go and marry a second wife they will excommunicate you. Why shouldn't they excommunicate Mormons for engaging in armed insurrection?

They may do it yet, his real problem will start if he kills someone. If he's taken out his covenants and then he kills some one there is no forgiveness, he'll have to pay for it himself.

" Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him." 1 John 3:15

 

[nightflight]

It rightfully belongs to the Northern Paiute Tribe who have worked out an arrangement with the federal government allowing them to use the land according to their traditional practices. Without giving up their rightful claim they appear to be satisfied with the federal government's stewardship over the refuge. It does not and never did belong to ranchers, miners or loggers. As the tribal chief pointed out, these ranchers did not come over on the Bering Strait, that they can claim this land.

Nobody now alive came over the Bering Straight.