Godchaser_70
Married happily to my nupreacher
oh goodness yes,thats just the first step. then we are to receive the gift of speaking in tongues. read acts 1 its great
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oh goodness yes,thats just the first step. then we are to receive the gift of speaking in tongues. read acts 1 its greatA very simple yet hugely controversial topic.Once we have accepted Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. Are we automatically destined for Heaven?
its not hard to get to heaven sweety,all he wants from you is a clean heart. and he wants you to be saved first of all. people get that confused.everyone is destined by God to be with Him forever, but everyone does not get to Heaven because not everyone does God's will, which summed up can be said this way: doing everything He wants and none of what He doesn't want.
I dont believe in OSAS. It's not in the Bible, so i don't know who came up with othe than the devil.
JEsus said it is very hard to get to heaven and that there are few who make it. (Mt 7, etc)
I was at one time wholly against OSAS. I believed that it was not biblical and has sent many a person to hell. My father in-law is a SBC preacher and have had many of discussions about this subject. Now tho I am still not convinced that OSAS is true, I am willing to make some concessions.
OSAS can only be true if:
We do not come to Christ on our own free will, but on the predestination of God.
We cannot be given free choice to accept Christ and then be refused that freedom to "un-chose" Him.
Though I am not saying one way or the other, I do find myself at this point in my faith to re-evaluate predestination. Its something that I am struggling with (which I don't think is a bad thing). I've been a staunch free will guy for a long time and have many questions about it.
Either OSAS is true in light of predestination or the whole thing is false. I don't think you can have one without the other.
J.
there's no such thing as once saved always saved.I was at one time wholly against OSAS. I believed that it was not biblical and has sent many a person to hell. My father in-law is a SBC preacher and have had many of discussions about this subject. Now tho I am still not convinced that OSAS is true, I am willing to make some concessions.
OSAS can only be true if:
We do not come to Christ on our own free will, but on the predestination of God.
We cannot be given free choice to accept Christ and then be refused that freedom to "un-chose" Him.
Though I am not saying one way or the other, I do find myself at this point in my faith to re-evaluate predestination. Its something that I am struggling with (which I don't think is a bad thing). I've been a staunch free will guy for a long time and have many questions about it.
Either OSAS is true in light of predestination or the whole thing is false. I don't think you can have one without the other.
J.
Osas is evidence of a skewed focus.
##
It really is an answer to questions about oneself and has the individual person as it's focus. The real answer to such questions is, "cling to the cross and don't worry about it."
The Lord threatened those in revelations with blotting their names out of the book of Life if they did not repent and do the first works (their gospel slightly changed). Your name is not in the Book of Life if you aren't saved. So this is my example I am using.A very simple yet hugely controversial topic.Once we have accepted Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. Are we automatically destined for Heaven?
## Yes and no.A very simple yet hugely controversial topic.Once we have accepted Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. Are we automatically destined for Heaven?
## You do realise that about a million people - at least - have said all that stuffHello outoftheloop,
Thank you for sharing your testamony. I think testamonies are important among professing believers. As far as the Catholic Church and your coming back to Christ, that's great and I am glad to hear of your willingness to repent (Luke 13:3) and return to Christ Jesus.
Still, I was brought-up Catholic and went to a Catholic School, baptized and confirmed and so much more. I have NOTHING BAD to say about those who attend mass and other things the Catholic Church provides. I have just come to learn so muchg more than I did when I was in Catholic School and church. I have come to learn about the many "traditions" that the Catholic Church still teach and have been for so long. I understand what the "real presence" is in the Host. But do you realize while you're listening to the priest, who is holding up the Host, that "he is asking God to make THIS (Host) BECOME FOR US the Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ?" Cannabalism is outlawed in both the OLD & NEW TESTAMENT. Also, the dinking of blood is outlawed in the Old and New Tesaments. How can one deduce from Jhn 6:55 and others that Jesus wants us to "eat His flesh and drink His LITERAL Blood" from these passages when it is clearly taught otherwise concerning the eating of human flesh and blood ;
1Cr 10:18 , "They who eat . . . are partakers" (joint communicants). "Is" in both cases in this verse is literal, not represents. He who with faith partakes of the cup and the bread, partakes really but spiritually of the blood and body of Christ ( Eph 5:30, 32 ), and of the benefits of His sacrifice on the cross (compare 1Cr 10:18 ). In contrast to this is to have "fellowship with devils" ( 1Cr 10:20 ). ALFORD explains, "The cup . . . is the [joint] participation (that is, that whereby the act of participation takes place) of the blood," &c. It is the seal of our living union with, and a means of our partaking of, Christ as our Saviour ( Jhn 653-57). It is not said, "The cup . . . is the blood," or "the bread . . . is the body," but "is the communion [joint-participation] of the blood . . . body." If the bread be changed into the literal body of Christ, where is the sign of the sacrament? Romanists eat Christ "in remembrance of Himself." To drink literal blood would have been an abomination to Jews, which the first Christians were (Lev 17:11-12). Breaking the bread was part of the act of consecrating it, for thus was represented the crucifixion of Christ's body (1 Cor 11:24). The distinct specification of the bread and the wine disproves the Romish doctrine of concomitancy, and exclusion of the laity from the cup.
Cheers,
Yohonron
## That is one of the most sensible remarks in this thread.That is very very true....the focus should be on Christ, living for Him, and leading others to Him. If we do that, we won't have to worry about other things like OSAS.
A very simple yet hugely controversial topic.Once we have accepted Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. Are we automatically destined for Heaven?
No. Predetermination dictates our eternal fate (Acts 13:48).A very simple yet hugely controversial topic.Once we have accepted Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior. Are we automatically destined for Heaven?
yes but that last psg doesn't mean that people who have once been baptized into Christ & have tasted the goodness of his grace cannot be restored to his grace. it doesn't mean the soul that has gone astray is hopeless. This is improtant because a lot of nonCatholics think this is so, i being one of them (years ago. i was never a "nonCatholic" but i wasn't catechized until several yrs ago, wasn't in the Church, etc). I was filled w/ the Holy Spirit when a teenager & for a couple yrs was madly in love with Jesus and everything was fine, but "things" happend & i fell away. for years i went through various experiences & my spirituality went gradually down-hill. Then one day i prayed the rosary & began seeing things differently. its a very long story waht all i went through but i came back to Christ, even in spite of the devil telling me i was hopeless, that i might as well stop w/ the rosary already because God didn't want me back
But because a person's soul is more "dirtied" (my word) after having been filled w/ the HS (then sinning), he has more to endure in getting back in totally right relationshiop with God. You can see a small stain on a brand new white sheet much better than you can on an old, printed one
anyway, i have found that only the Catholic Church can put this "Humpty Dumpty" of my miserable soul back together again: the power of the mass, Confession, the rosary, the Real Presence. People outside the Church don't know what they are missing. yes, there are unsavory people therein who don't much resemble Christians... but oh well. Jesus is there.
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