Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
I don't think that we can earn our salvation through our works by any means, it's impossible.
However our works are important to God, in fact Jesus said "If you love me keep my commandments" (KJV).
Maybe I should clarify myself. I believe God makes himself known to us and it's only through his grace and his son, our Saviour in which we can be saved.
However, there were conditions placed on our salvation, and we have been given free moral agency to decide whether or not to follow God's law.
Here would be an example of free will. We know that the Bible teaches against murder, but I could still go and commit it (not going to), but I could because of free will.
Another point.....this might stir things up....but.......I don't believe the Bible teaches the sinners prayer.
No one never said man does not have a freewill. He jut does not have a freewill towards salvation.Here would be an example of free will. We know that the Bible teaches against murder, but I could still go and commit it (not going to), but I could because of free will.
Another point.....this might stir things up....but.......I don't believe the Bible teaches the sinners prayer.
"I believe salvation starts the moment you believe."
BINGO!!!!!!
And so it does.
My Roommate led be to the Lord in his bedroom in our apartment on a Wednesday night, and INSTANTLY when I "Believed in faith" - everything changed - and 50 years later it's STILL there!!
I KNOW whom I have believed, and am persuaded that HE is able to KEEP that which I've committed unto HIM against that day.
No one never said man does not have a freewill. He jut does not have a freewill towards salvation.
"I believe salvation starts the moment you believe."
BINGO!!!!!!
And so it does.
What do you mean by this? Do you believe that everyone is going to be saved without a choice (although the choice would be heaven every time), or have I got the wrong end of the stick?
So if a person WANTS to be saved, yet God is not calling them, then they can't do a thing about it, can they? It's not like they can say "Hey God, I want to be saved today!" and He will just open their heart to believe and receive Jesus.
Faith is incredibly important and without it we couldn't know God, however salvation is not just dependent on faith. Peter and the apostles were commanded to go and preach baptism for the remission of sins. (Mark 16:16).
With statements like John 3:16 and the like - they're all true of course, they're in the Bible, but it is not a contradiction with baptism, repentance and confession. It would be if it said faith only. (James 2:24.)
We must remember three things and discern all things in scripture...
Newsong...I hope it is not too late. You are regurgitating nonsense from calvin's teachings that are extremely short-sighted and not in accordance with scripture.
There are several important factors that we need to practice in proper hermeneutical scripture interpretation, and the first one is that God does not contradict Himself - ever. The passages of scripture that calvin, and those who follow him today (following man, not God), use in their teachings directly contradict other passages when interpreted as they interpret them.
The second thing to remember is that scripture needs to be interpreted in line with God's character, and the teachings of calvin do not follow this rule either. The teachings of calvin state that God created billions upon billions of people in the history of the world that He will not choose for eternal life...He only chooses a select few...thereby passively selecting everyone else for an eternity in hell that they do not deserve if He is the one causing them to go there by not selecting them for heaven.
Scripture teaches us that God is love, and that He desires no one to die and go to hell, therefore, calvinistic teachings are unscriptural. OSAS is nonsense that is not taught in scripture, for OSAS comes directly out of the spiritually immature understanding of scripture that brings calvin's ideas of selection. Calvin was only three years old in the Lord (if he ever was truly saved, coming out of the man-made religious system he came out of) when he devised what are today called the 5 points of calvinism, and until his death many years later he never changed is original beliefs.
Now, here is some wisdom we should follow...who do you know that was only three years old in their faith who has not changed what they first believed in, many years later. I can tell you that I know some...they have been calling themselves "Christians" for many years, yet all they do is sit in their pews every Sunday, they use Christian jargon, but other than that they do nothing. They hardly spend time in the Word, they only get what they are told by others...they don't serve God in any way...they are just "spiritual" couch-potatoes. They haven't grown in Christ one bit in years.
I am not getting on to you about this, so please don't get defensive, I am just trying to help you see more clearly the things that it seems you are choosing to believe in. Calvin was wrong because of the following...
Hosea 4:6
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge....
Isaiah 5:13
Therefore my people go into exile for lack of accurate knowledge....
Matthew 22:29
But Jesus answered them, "You are wrong, because you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God."
What I am saying is this...many in his time hailed calvin as a genius because they were fighting the catholic church and his doctrine went against that taught by the catholic church, so he was a hero to millions trying to free themselves from their reign. So, because he was widely accepted because of this, his doctrine was also widely accepted in a time when the Reformation was still in infancy. He was hailed as a scholar, and people believed that his doctrine was right because he was a hailed as a scholar. I can tell you with all gravity that there are those who are hailed as scholars today in God's Word that are no more spiritual, nor God believing, than my chair I am sitting on right now.
Am I saying that he was not truly converted? No, because no one knows that for sure except God...and that is my point. Scripture can only be understood by people who do four things...
1st - they have to be born again (regenerated - which means that the Spirit of God has come into them and dwells in them), because unless they have the Spirit of God in them to teach them what the scriptures are saying, they will come up with all kinds of nonsensical ideas of what scripture is trying to tell them...
1Co 2:14
The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned.
The word "spiritually" here is the adverbial form of "pneumatikos" meaning "by the assistance of the Spirit of God," and if calvin was never truly born again, regenerated, then this explains why he could not understand what he was reading and misinterpreted it. Again, only God knows if he was truly regenerated or not, and this was a common happenstance in the history of the church (I have read where ministers were leading churches for years after their "conversion" to Christianity, that never had a born again experience for years afterward...the revivalist William Haslam was such a man).
If a man does not have the Spirit of God in him to cause him to discern the intended meaning of scripture, then that man will not come to the correct interpretation of that scripture. Was calvin born again? None of us knows today, and that is why we need to study scripture on our own, with the prayerful aid of the Spirit, laying aside what we have been taught by others until we discover that their words are indeed true. In other words...be a Berean...like in the book of Acts...and double check all that you are taught, for much of what we are taught by others is not in accordance with accurate knowledge of the scriptures.
2nd - they must be walking in the Spirit. If we are not walking in the Spirit, then we are not participating in the New Covenant, and if we are not participating in the New Covenant, then we are walking in disobedience to God and His Spirit will not help us do anything.
3rd - we must be studying God's Word prayerfully. What I mean is this, God authored the Word through chosen vessels, chosen to deliver that Word to us...but they did not write it, God wrote it through their hand. As my signature states, and is true, and is no lie, one can only know and understand the scriptures that God authored by spending time with Him in prayer over the scriptures, earnestly seeking from Him the understanding of what He intended to say to us.
4th - we must understand and apply proper hermeneutical study of God's Word. That means, there are certain rules to follow in order to interpret scripture, and in calvin's case - and his followers - they leave behind many of those rules in an effort to come to their erroneous conclusions about doctrinal statements.
If a man (or woman) is not meeting all four requirements, they will not always come away from scriptural study with accurate knowledge on what scriptures says. I have been a minister now for over 25 years, beginning with doing "battle" with JW's doctrine, and then such atrocities found within the Body of Christ...I am not tooting my horn, I am only trying to show you that I know what I am talking about...and the Body of Christ today is riddled with doctrines that are not accurately, scripturally, interpreted.
Blessings to you!
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?