Nudity

The Bellman · Jun 18, 2004

I was reading the thread on censorship, and was pleased to see that most people seem to be of the opinion that nobody has the right to censor something based solely on the possibility/probability that some will be offended by it.

However, it made me think about public nudity. If it's wrong to censor something just because someone might be offended by it, is it wrong to refuse to allow people to be naked in public (since people might be offended by it)? If not, what's the difference?

Philosoft · Jun 18, 2004

I think public nudity might be more objectionable because of increased health risks or disturbing the peace or something like that. I don't think it's really a censorship issue.

seebs · Jun 18, 2004

I don't see it as a censorship issue.

I see no obvious moral objection to nudity in and of itself, but it may disturb people. The key to censorship is that you're not just preventing some people from seeing something; you're preventing anyone from seeing it. A prohibition on public nudity is less akin to censorship, and more akin to restricting what can go on billboards, or in public spaces at malls.

Archivist · Jun 19, 2004

I think that there are valid reasons as to why the government should have the power to ban or at least restrict public nudity including, as pointed out by Philosoft, health concerns.

However, I do not believe that the government should have the power to prevent women from going topless in public in any place where men are permitted to go topless. While female breasts are secondary sexual characeristics--just as male chest hair is a secondary sexual characteristic--they are not sexual organs.

The fact is that American society has become obsessed with the female breasts. We see them used in advertising and in entertainment. However, if they were commomly seen in public this obsession would be greatly reduced. You don't find this same obsession in Europe where seeing topless women in public is a common occurrence.

transientlife · Jun 19, 2004

Good points, Archivist. American society hypersexualizes everything.

Obertray · Jun 19, 2004

Damn you Eurpoeans and your advanced moral standards!!!

Logic · Jun 19, 2004

I was just about to post about how other parts of the world don't associate nudity with sex, like America, but I see somebody else already did. Therefore, I leave you with post that is useless for all intents and purposes.

Mish · Jun 19, 2004

You don't find this same obsession in Europe where seeing topless women in public is a common occurrence.

I come from Europe, what part of Europe is this? Seriously! It's time for a holiday ot the place where all the women go topless!

Archivist · Jun 19, 2004

Mish said:
I come from Europe, what part of Europe is this? Seriously! It's time for a holiday ot the place where all the women go topless!

I was in France two years ago and every beach I visited in the southern part of the country was topless and I even saw some people sunbathing completely naked. I'm told that it is also common in Spain, Italy and Greece, although I've never been to those countries so I can't confirm that. We did have an Italian student here at our school several years ago and she complained that she was not able to sunbath topless in public here. When I was last in Europe I was also in Germany and saw people sunbathing naked in public parks.

By the way, you could easily pick out the American men on the French beaches--they were the ones staring at the topless women. The Frenchmen didn't seem to pay much attention.

The Bellman · Jun 19, 2004

Archivist said:
I was in France two years ago and every beach I visited in the southern part of the country was topless and I even saw some people sunbathing completely naked. I'm told that it is also common in Spain, Italy and Greece, although I've never been to those countries so I can't confirm that. We did have an Italian student here at our school several years ago and she complained that she was not able to sunbath topless in public here. When I was last in Europe I was also in Germany and saw people sunbathing naked in public parks.

By the way, you could easily pick out the American men on the French beaches--they were the ones staring at the topless women. The Frenchmen didn't seem to pay much attention.

It is that way in Australia, too...on every beach, you will see topless women. Nobody thinks twice about it.

Archivist · Jun 19, 2004

The Bellman said:
It is that way in Australia, too...on every beach, you will see topless women. Nobody thinks twice about it.

That's what would eventually happen in the United States if topless beaches became the norm...we would get to the point where breasts would be no big deal. This would have several advantages--women would have significantly better body images, women would probably be more willing to perform self-exams for breast cancer, and America would gain additional tourists from Europe and Australia.

Aduro Amnis · Jun 19, 2004

The question is why should the human body be offensive?

transientlife · Jun 19, 2004

Yeah I don't get the big hoopla over breasts...everyone's got 'em. The whole Janet Jackson ordeal didn't seem like that much of an atrocity to me. It's the human body! Sheesh.

Everything is so hypersexualized here, that and of course you have some hypersensitive people as well It'd be to our best interest to decrease both, if ya ask me.

Archivist · Jun 19, 2004

transientlife said:
Yeah I don't get the big hoopla over breasts...everyone's got 'em. The whole Janet Jackson ordeal didn't seem like that much of an atrocity to me. It's the human body! Sheesh.

Everything is so hypersexualized here, that and of course you have some hypersensitive people as well It'd be to our best interest to decrease both, if ya ask me.

I actually missed seeing Miss Jackson's breats during the Superbowl halftime show. I thought the show was so bad that I went to the kitchen to get some more chips, cheese, crackers and veggies for the second half. Don't think I missed much. You are correct--everyone's got 'em.

How much money is wasted in this country on cosmetic breast implants? If seeing female breasts was more commonplace I think a lot of that surgery wouldn't take place.

transientlife · Jun 19, 2004

I didn't see it either (I watched maybe 5 minutes of the entire super bowl)...well, barely saw it, the one doctor at work was downloading it after it happened, but I didn't see much, the clip was so jumpy (bad connection I suppose haha)

I commend her for being able to make fun of herself on SNL after that, though.

Archivist · Jun 19, 2004

transientlife said:
I commend her for being able to make fun of herself on SNL after that, though.

I missed that SNL--I don't stay up that late very often unless I'm working on a paper, which is what will probably keep me up very late tonight. I heard that she did a great job. It's nice when someome can make fun of themselves after something like that!

Norseman · Jun 19, 2004

Bleh, this country is 70% (give or take) christian, and in their own dogma, in the very first chapter of their only canonized book it says that men and women didn't start wearing clothes until they became sinful. To be non-sinful wouldn't it make sense to strip the clothes? God obviously didn't seem to mind, afterall it wasn't he who told them to wear clothes, it was indirectly satan was it not?

And then for those who aren't christian, what's it matter? Everyone has the same body parts (give or take) so who cares whose you see and whose you don't? The only reason I can conceive of wearing clothes for is for protection against radiation/weather.

Why is it such a big deal?

Aduro Amnis · Jun 19, 2004

Radiation? Dude radiation can easily pass through clothes.

Oh and I SAW the Janet Jackson thing, you didn't realize what was there until she did.

Norseman · Jun 19, 2004

Not so much. I know I'm very sensitive to sunburning, but I only get a sunburn when I don't have my shirt on. Another thing to note might be that many females have uneven tans, due to their bathing suits having been in the way of radiation. Clothes certaintly help protect against radiation, but I have no clue what the SPF would be.

rainbowprism · Jun 20, 2004

I don't know if I'd be too keen about sitting on a subway seat that tons of other naked butts had been sitting on too. The health and sanitary risks are what give me the heebie-jeebies.

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