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New Vatican Document Uses “BCE” Instead of “BC.” Wait. What?

Michie

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I’m assuming this is a translation snafu. I know. I know. The old joke is that anytime the pope says anything outlandish it’s dismissed as a translation issue. But regardless of who in the Vatican did this, it’s kind of indicative of the mindset.

I mean, BCE? Really?

For those unclear, BC is “before Christ.” Modern secularist demand that we write BCE (Before Common Era” whatever that means. But to think that people in the Vatican in charge of translating the pope’s words are so secularized as to make this mistake is quite telling.

This is not something to be dismissed. Either Christ is the center of everything or he’s not. Make up your mind.

Continued below.
 

Cosmic Charlie

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It depends upon the document, really. BCE and CE are considered secularly scholarly.

BC and AD are not.

Is this something we're really going to get upset about ?

I mean, the dates aren't even right. Christ's birthday is usually given at 4 or 5 AD and the whole timing is off by one year anyway since there was no year zero.
 
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RileyG

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It depends upon the document, really. BCE and CE are considered secularly scholarly.

BC and AD are not.

Is this something we're really going to get upset about ?

I mean, the dates aren't even right. Christ's birthday is usually given at 4 or 5 AD and the whole timing is off by one year anyway since there was no year zero.
Yeah, that’s true.

Nothing to be upset about.

Just a fun fact.
 
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JSRG

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It looks like this was indeed a translation thing, and the original document didn't write it like that. Frustratingly, the linked article, despite being about this document, does not bother to link to the document, which is here:

This is the English one. We also come to another frustration: Whereas other pages on the Vatican that are available in multiple languages have a convenient thing in the upper right corner that lets you go there, this page doesn't let you switch over. You have to click on the link that brings you back to August (08), on that page click on the options of IT and ES in the upper right hand corner, then click back onto the document in the new page! The Italian one includes translations in other languages, so it looks like the Italian is original while the others are translations. You can find the Italian here:

The English one says:

12. Thanks to an evangelical discernment of culture, we can recognize the presence of the Spirit in the variety of human experiences, seeing the seeds of the Spirit’s presencealreadyplanted in the events, sensibilities, desires and profound yearnings present within hearts and in social, cultural and spiritual settings.We can see this, for example, in the approach taken by Paul before the Areopagus, as related in theActs of the Apostles(17:16-34).In his address, Paul says of God: “‘In him we live and move and have our being’; and as some of your own poets have said, ‘We too are his offspring’.”(Acts17:28).This verse contains two quotations: one indirect, from the poet Epimenides (sixth century B.C.E.), and the other direct, from thePhaenomenaof the poet Aratus of Soli (third century B.C.E.), who wrote of the constellations and the signs of good and bad weather.Here, “Paul reveals that he is a ‘reader’ while also demonstrating his method of approaching the literary text, which is an evangelical discernment of culture.The Athenians dismiss him as aspermologos, a ‘babbler’, but literally ‘a gatherer of seeds’.What was surely meant to be an insult proved, ironically, to be profoundly true.Paul gathered the seeds of pagan poetry and, overcoming his first impressions (cf.Acts17:16), acknowledges the Athenians to be ‘extremely religious’ and sees in the pages of their classical literature a veritablepraeparatio evangelica”[6].

Yes, the lack of spaces in things like "presencealreadyplanted was there in the original. Oddly, this is also in the Italian:

12. Grazie al discernimento evangelico della cultura, è possibile riconoscere la presenza dello Spirito nella variegata realtà umana, è possibile, cioè, cogliere il semegiàpiantato della presenza dello Spirito negli avvenimenti, nelle sensibilità, nei desideri, nelle tensioni profonde dei cuori e dei contesti sociali, culturali e spirituali. Possiamo ad esempio riconoscere negliAtti degli Apostoli, lì dove si parla della presenza di Paolo all’Areopago (cfr.At17,16-34), un simile approccio. Paolo, parlando di Dio, afferma: «In lui infatti viviamo, ci muoviamo ed esistiamo, come anche alcuni dei vostri poeti hanno detto: “Poiché di lui stirpe noi siamo» (At17,28). In questo versetto sono presenti due citazioni: una indiretta nella prima parte, dove si cita il poeta Epimenide (VI sec. a. C.), ed una diretta, che cita iFenomenidel poeta Arato di Silo (III sec. a. C.), il quale canta le costellazioni e i segni del buono e cattivo tempo. Qui «Paolo si rivela “lettore” di poesia e lascia intuire il suo mododiaccostarsi al testo letterario, che non può non far riflettere in ordine a un discernimento evangelico della cultura. Egli viene definito dagli ateniesispermologos, cioè “cornacchia, chiacchierone, ciarlatano”, ma letteralmente “raccoglitore di semi”. Quella che era certamente un’ingiuria sembra, paradossalmente, una verità profonda. Paolo raccoglie i semi della poesia pagana e, uscendo da un precedente atteggiamento di profonda indignazione (cfr.At17,16), giunge a riconoscere gli ateniesi come “religiosissimi” e vede in quelle pagine della loro letteratura classica una vera e propriapreparatio evangelica»[6].

Here we also see some cases of words being combined, often in the same places; "seme già piantato" we see "semegiàpiantato".

But the important thing here is not typos, but the dates. We see "(VI sec. a. C.)" and "(III sec. a. C.)". "a. C." is the Italian version of BC, standing for "avanti Cristo" which means before Christ (looking into it, it seems "avanti" meaning before is a dated use and in modern language it normally means something like forward or onward, but the dated use is retained in the expression avanti Cristo). So in the Italian, it uses the equivalent of BC, not BCE. If you are curious, the equivalent of BCE/CE in Italian (that is, the method of retaining the BC/AD years but dropping any reference to Jesus) appears to be EV and AEV, for Era Volgare (common era) and Avanti l'Era Volgare (before common era).

Looking at other translations, the French uses "avant J.-C.", German "v. Chr.", Spanish "a.C.", Portuguese "a.C.", Polish "przed Chr.", and Arabic "قبل المسيح". All of these translate out to "before Christ". So it looks like opting for the more secular B.C.E. was only in the English.
 
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BC and AD come from the Gregorian Calendar which is the most accurate calendar ever conceived.

Even a secular man like Neil DeGrasse Tyson recognizes who made the calendar. He says CE and BCE are non sensical and refuses to use them. I first heard CE and BCE from Jehovahs witnesses because they do not believe Jesus is God.

Secular scholastics are not very scholastic as they pass narrative off for science. Science has been reduced to fables and stories and no one notices because it is current thought that science does not include God. We all just go along and believe what so called science says, even though they have no idea what they are talking about.

So called modern science has abandoned philosophical first principles in favor of their narrative that is becoming increasingly suspect, the more you look at it.

Most people don’t look, because of ridicule and peer pressure. Serious scientist are beginning to see that Genesis is more scientific than the outlandish myth of evolution. Just look at the data rather than listening to the narrative

Let’s get back to first principles and observational science, rather than the Cliff Calvin like narrative we are subjected to today

The first thing is to not say it is no big deal to let the atheists control the narrative
 
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