Mystical Side of Eastern Orthodox (And other ?s)

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

Greetings my lovely brothers and sisters in Christ!

I was just curious of the mysticism behind EO, I've read and heard of the RC side of this, but what of the EO?

As well, I have a hard time digesting the liturgy tradition, from my own experience in the Spirit, He has in no way led me in that direction. (and I'm not dismissing it as worthless btw). I'm just trying to understand how much is truly true or if its just tradition. EO by far interests me the most to study of all the denominations out there.

Right now, I'm living it up and loving the glory in a recent glory movement, if its a movement at all but awareness being stumbled upon. Prominent speakers such as John Crowder, Benjamin Dunn, Matt Ford, Matt Spinks, Brandon Barthrop are some. I do not consider them leaders but a speakers for this current awareness being revealed. I actually enjoy Christ in a house assembly so full of the love of Christ. Just a background for you lovables.

Please do share your own experiences in EO, I genuinely wish to learn more.

LinuxLurker01 · Dec 1, 2010

The liturgy is central to Orthodox life. What about it is hard for you to digest? You seem to have created a false dichotomy between tradition and truth, by the way -- we keep the ancient traditions because they are true, not the other way around.

ProScribe · Dec 1, 2010

I would say the mystic side of the Eastern Orthodox religion is based on the very nature of the God we worship in spirit and truth.

Lukaris · Dec 1, 2010

ProScribe said:
I would say the mystic side of the Eastern Orthodox religion is based on the very nature of the God we worship in spirit and truth.

Second this. Just think John 4:24.Then see the pattern of worship starting with Moses, to Solomon, to the imagery of holy of holies like in Isaiah & Revelation. Within this are our hymns, epistle & Gospel readings, homily, the Lord's prayer, the holy Eucharist etc.

choirfiend · Dec 1, 2010

Can you explain your movement a little more ? I never heard of it or any of the speakers, but I'm interested to know where you're coming from!

Mary of Bethany · Dec 1, 2010

LogosRhema said:
Greetings my lovely brothers and sisters in Christ!

I was just curious of the mysticism behind EO, I've read and heard of the RC side of this, but what of the EO?

As well, I have a hard time digesting the liturgy tradition, from my own experience in the Spirit, He has in no way led me in that direction. (and I'm not dismissing it as worthless btw). I'm just trying to understand how much is truly true or if its just tradition. EO by far interests me the most to study of all the denominations out there.

Right now, I'm living it up and loving the glory in a recent glory movement, if its a movement at all but awareness being stumbled upon. Prominent speakers such as John Crowder, Benjamin Dunn, Matt Ford, Matt Spinks, Brandon Barthrop are some. I do not consider them leaders but a speakers for this current awareness being revealed. I actually enjoy Christ in a house assembly so full of the love of Christ. Just a background for you lovables.

Please do share your own experiences in EO, I genuinely wish to learn more.

Hi there!

I grew up Southern Baptist, not charismatic, so I'm really not familiar with the movement you're talking about, but I wanted to say that you will find in Orthodoxy a real, true, emphasis on the Holy Spirit and His work in us. It takes a very different form/look from the charismatic/pentecostal movements, but believe it or not, it is not incompatible with structured worship.

The Holy Spirit has never been "demoted" to a lesser part of the Holy Trinity, or turned into a "thing" or "feeling" instead of a Divine Person, as has happened in some Christian traditions.

Mary

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

LinuxLurker01 said:
The liturgy is central to Orthodox life. What about it is hard for you to digest? You seem to have created a false dichotomy between tradition and truth, by the way -- we keep the ancient traditions because they are true, not the other way around.

I understand it is central, and your claim of "ancient traditions because they are true". According to whom? Because of a long history? The world has a long history of running from God, an ancient way, does it make it right? No!

More detail, I do not accept traditions based on "well its just the way we have always done this". Digging deeper than that.

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

choirfiend said:
Can you explain your movement a little more ? I never heard of it or any of the speakers, but I'm interested to know where you're coming from!

The movement is easy yet hard to explain. There is no set "doctrine" other than strictly reading the Bible right off the page as others have noted to those who I have shared with. The biggest thing is we believe in living in the reality of heaven now and within its pleasures. The drunken Glory, as clearly demonstrated in Acts many, myself included, live in this bliss daily. True freedom and pleasure in our God. The next thing to note is that we believe in the finished works of the cross. Meaning as we are abiding in Christ, drunk on His Glory and Grace, that we will just manifest the fruits of the Spirit through Christ without trying. It becomes a less focus on the law, as the law is bounded on love and focusing purely on Grace and Love.

I've done some writing. I'll link you my facebook where I have several notes written discussing this. http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=172501922763945 This one really speaks clearly what I'm discussing here. Basically through and in Christ we are already holy, perfect, and righteous. Feel free to read the others. I do much discussion on this "finished works of the cross" idea. Read it openly and honestly, too many heresy hunters immediate hear a foreign doctrine and have screamed heresy. Which means nothing to me. I've seen the fruits of this movement and they are very much of the Spirit.

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

Mary of Bethany said:
Hi there!

I grew up Southern Baptist, not charismatic, so I'm really not familiar with the movement you're talking about, but I wanted to say that you will find in Orthodoxy a real, true, emphasis on the Holy Spirit and His work in us. It takes a very different form/look from the charismatic/pentecostal movements, but believe it or not, it is not incompatible with structured worship.

The Holy Spirit has never been "demoted" to a lesser part of the Holy Trinity, or turned into a "thing" or "feeling" instead of a Divine Person, as has happened in some Christian traditions.

Mary

I'm still seeking to understand why EO is liturgical. Just because a claim of an "ancient way" means nothing to me and should to most everyone. Deeper details.

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

And don't be sidetracked too much by sharing where I am now in Christ. I'm not here with a loaded gun behind my back, I honestly want to know more.

RobNJ · Dec 1, 2010

I've looked from Calvinist, to High church Episcopalian, to praise & worship, to being "in the spirit".. and found the Orthodox Liturgy the most spiritually fulfilling of them all.

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

RobNJ said:
I've looked from Calvinist, to High church Episcopalian, to praise & worship, to being "in the spirit".. and found the Orthodox Liturgy the most spiritually fulfilling of them all.

Why?

Antony in Tx · Dec 1, 2010

I will answer your question with a partial quote from John 1:39, "Come and see". You really are welcome to come and visit with us to witness the fullness of our Holy Tradition at work. It's almost impossible to explain in a few sentences.

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

Antony in Tx said:
I will answer your question with a partial quote from John 1:39, "Come and see". You really are welcome to come and visit with us to witness the fullness of our Holy Tradition at work. It's almost impossible to explain in a few sentences.

Let me explain, I have found aboslute bliss and freedom in Christ, in a very thick atmosphere of God's prescence. One in which gets away from tradition and just organic modes of worship. I do plan and wish to visit, but I need to digest some of the... methodology behind it all. I do believe EO kisses holy objects and pictures? I've never been to one, just going by what I may have heard.

Take it from me. Having no traditional background, even shying away from modern churches. I'm in a house church! lol. Kind of see my thought process here?

Christos Anesti · Dec 1, 2010

St Isaac the Syrian often speaks of spiritual inebriation:

When we find love, we partake of heavenly bread and are made strong without labor and toil. The heavenly bread is Christ, who came down from heaven and gave life to the world. This is the nourishment of angels. The person who has found love eats and drinks Christ every day and every hour and is thereby made immortal. When we hear Jesus say, Ye shall eat and drink at the table of my kingdom, what do we suppose we shall eat, if not love? Love, rather than food and drink, is sufficient to nourish a person. This is the wine which maketh glad the heart. Blessed is the one who partakes of this wine! Licentious people have drunk this wine and become chaste; sinners have drunk it and have forgotten the pathways of stumbling; drunkards have drunk this wine and become fasters; the rich have drunk it and desired poverty, the poor have drunk it and been enriched with hope; the sick have drunk it and become strong; the unlearned have taken it and become wise.

Repentance is given us as grace after grace, for repentance is a second regeneration by God. That of which we have received an earnest by baptism, we receive as a gift by means of repentance. Repentance is the door of mercy, opened to those who seek it. By this door we enter into the mercy of God, and apart from this entrance we shall not find mercy.

Blessed is God who uses corporeal objects continually to draw us close in a symbolic way to a knowledge of Gods invisible nature. O name of Jesus, key to all gifts, open up for me the great door to your treasure-house, that I may enter and praise you with the praise that comes from the heart.

O my Hope, pour into my heart the inebriation that consists in the hope of you. O Jesus Christ, the resurrection and light of all worlds, place upon my souls head the crown of knowledge of you; open before me all of a sudden the door of mercies, cause the rays of your grace to shine out in my heart.

O Christ, who are covered with light as though with a garment, who for my sake stood naked in front of Pilate, clothe me with that might which you caused to overshadow the saints, whereby they conquered this world of struggle. May your Divinity, Lord, take pleasure in me, and lead me above the world to be with you.

I give praise to your holy Nature, Lord, for you have made my nature a sanctuary for your hiddenness and a tabernacle for your holy mysteries, a place where you can dwell, and a holy temple for your Divinity.

Antony in Tx · Dec 1, 2010

Come and see..

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

Christos Anesti said:
St Isaac the Syrian often speaks of spiritual inebriation:

When we find love, we partake of heavenly bread and are made strong without labor and toil. The heavenly bread is Christ, who came down from heaven and gave life to the world. This is the nourishment of angels. The person who has found love eats and drinks Christ every day and every hour and is thereby made immortal. When we hear Jesus say, Ye shall eat and drink at the table of my kingdom, what do we suppose we shall eat, if not love? Love, rather than food and drink, is sufficient to nourish a person. This is the wine which maketh glad the heart. Blessed is the one who partakes of this wine! Licentious people have drunk this wine and become chaste; sinners have drunk it and have forgotten the pathways of stumbling; drunkards have drunk this wine and become fasters; the rich have drunk it and desired poverty, the poor have drunk it and been enriched with hope; the sick have drunk it and become strong; the unlearned have taken it and become wise.

Repentance is given us as grace after grace, for repentance is a second regeneration by God. That of which we have received an earnest by baptism, we receive as a gift by means of repentance. Repentance is the door of mercy, opened to those who seek it. By this door we enter into the mercy of God, and apart from this entrance we shall not find mercy.

Blessed is God who uses corporeal objects continually to draw us close in a symbolic way to a knowledge of Gods invisible nature. O name of Jesus, key to all gifts, open up for me the great door to your treasure-house, that I may enter and praise you with the praise that comes from the heart.

O my Hope, pour into my heart the inebriation that consists in the hope of you. O Jesus Christ, the resurrection and light of all worlds, place upon my souls head the crown of knowledge of you; open before me all of a sudden the door of mercies, cause the rays of your grace to shine out in my heart.

O Christ, who are covered with light as though with a garment, who for my sake stood naked in front of Pilate, clothe me with that might which you caused to overshadow the saints, whereby they conquered this world of struggle. May your Divinity, Lord, take pleasure in me, and lead me above the world to be with you.

I give praise to your holy Nature, Lord, for you have made my nature a sanctuary for your hiddenness and a tabernacle for your holy mysteries, a place where you can dwell, and a holy temple for your Divinity.

Whoa... ALOT of Glory on this. This lays out EXACTLY where I come from. Hallelujah, beautiful.

LogosRhema · Dec 1, 2010

Antony in Tx said:
Come and see..

Open up Antony, I'd really want to know more first via spoken before my visit. Much like I have to explain what my happen at my house group, I'd like to know more from you!

Antony in Tx · Dec 1, 2010

If you can't handle going to a church near you for Divine Liturgy, perhaps visiting with the priest on a weekday and asking questions while visiting/touring the church. As an alternate, I would recommend that you consider visiting an Orthodox monastery near you and arrange to speak with the abbot. It's just so much more than words can say on the web.

Maybe others can say it better than me, but it is really wrapped up in saying, Come and See.

Etsi · Dec 2, 2010

Antony in Tx said:
If you can't handle going to a church near you for Divine Liturgy, perhaps visiting with the priest on a weekday and asking questions while visiting/touring the church. As an alternate, I would recommend that you consider visiting an Orthodox monastery near you and arrange to speak with the abbot. It's just so much more than words can say on the web.

Maybe others can say it better than me, but it is really wrapped up in saying, Come and See.

It's not like Protestantism where everything is laid out in an outline. Anything verbal you get here will only be shadow of what is.

Mystical Side of Eastern Orthodox (And other ?s)

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