• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
  • We hope the site problems here are now solved, however, if you still have any issues, please start a ticket in Contact Us

My Truth is the ONLY Truth

Meshavrischika

for Thy greater honor and glory
Jun 12, 2007
20,903
1,566
OK
✟50,603.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
Seems to me that people make this statement alot and don't seem to realize that they are just as flawed and open to being wrong as the rest of us are...

I fail to see how it is moral to say "this is truth" and try to make someone eat it with a spoon and smile when personal experience of the "eater" doesn't jive with the "truth" they're being fed.
 

Beanieboy

Senior Veteran
Jan 20, 2006
6,297
1,214
62
✟65,132.00
Faith
Christian
There is a Buddhist saying, "If someone tells you that he is a seeker of Truth, listen to him. If someone claims to have found the Truth, run away."

Anyone who claims to hold the truth is only teacher, and never student. They refuse to listen or to consider their own infallibility. However, they will disguise their ego as "God's Truth", "God's Word" and God's infallibility.

To claim to know the entire mind of God would be something I would laugh at if it wouldn't be redundant to do so.

I generally try not to get sucked into pointless conversations with them, because as much as I try to discuss, it is unheard, even if I can disprove what they are saying. The same person will simply stop the conversation, only to start another thread with the same claim that was just disproven, and blame anyone who is in disagreement to be against God.

Were God the poster, they would have a point - and the world would be in serious trouble.
 
Upvote 0

Phred

Junior Mint
Aug 12, 2003
5,373
998
✟22,717.00
Country
United States
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
There is a Buddhist saying, "If someone tells you that he is a seeker of Truth, listen to him. If someone claims to have found the Truth, run away."

Anyone who claims to hold the truth is only teacher, and never student. They refuse to listen or to consider their own infallibility. However, they will disguise their ego as "God's Truth", "God's Word" and God's infallibility.

To claim to know the entire mind of God would be something I would laugh at if it wouldn't be redundant to do so.

I generally try not to get sucked into pointless conversations with them, because as much as I try to discuss, it is unheard, even if I can disprove what they are saying. The same person will simply stop the conversation, only to start another thread with the same claim that was just disproven, and blame anyone who is in disagreement to be against God.

Were God the poster, they would have a point - and the world would be in serious trouble.
And yet... you're comfortable assuming that a god exists.
 
Upvote 0

Beanieboy

Senior Veteran
Jan 20, 2006
6,297
1,214
62
✟65,132.00
Faith
Christian
And yet... you're comfortable assuming that a god exists.

I'm unsure I follow.

My definition of God is kind of radical. I don't believe God lives up on the mountain, and hurls thunderbolts.

Rather, I think that God is the totality of all humans - that we are literally one with God, and that God is also literally love.
I find it interesting how people say, "God is love", but never contemplate that.
"Everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. He who does not love does not know God for God is love."

When people are married, they love each other, and often talk about being "one" with each other, which is more about their feeling of being a team, being a part of each other, that simply sex.

People, in loving each other, tap into that love energy - but it always comes from within, not without.

One can surely argue that there is no God. One can argue that there is no such thing as love. I can argue that you are simply a hallucination in my mind, and I alone exist. This may be a dream, and when I wake up, all of it will be gone.

However, one cannot be proven while the other disproven. All of that is speculative, and opposing views pondered, and come to your own conclusions.

If you told people 500 years ago that you get sick from visible germs that are not visible to the human eye, they would say that is ridiculous. If you told someone that all matter is fluid and moving, even sold objects, again they would call your silly.

All one can do is to draw conclusions, and then keep their mind open that they may be wrong, so as to update their understandings.

And yeah, I'm very comfortable with that.
 
Upvote 0

Beanieboy

Senior Veteran
Jan 20, 2006
6,297
1,214
62
✟65,132.00
Faith
Christian
One of the things that I strongly remember from another board was that there were some people that would get really angry because I hadn't converted yet. I said, "I wasn't aware that I needed to convert to be part of this disscussion board. I don't, for example, go hang out in a church, with no intention of converting. This is a board for people of all faiths. I believe that there is some truth in all religions, so that is why I came here."

They will respond, "It been x years! Why don't you just convert and repent!!!"

Why didn't I?
A) Most of their arguments made no sense.
B) They claim to worship Christ, and yet would I would point out that Romans 12:9 Let your love be without hypocracy. Cling to what is good, abhor what is evil was not a call of how and whom to hate, but how to love - which includes ones enemies, I was told that I didn't know what I was talking about.
I rarely saw the fruits of the Spirit. I saw them as wolves in sheeps clothing.
C) They quoted scripture, and more often than not, twisted it to make it completely the opposite of what was said (using OT to justify hatred of enemies, saying that the most loving thing you could do to a sinner is to hate them, etc.) When I would show how they are false in their logic, they would only listen to scripture. When I used scripture, they said that I had no authority, because I wasn't Christian. Even when I pointed out that Satan himself used scripture when tempting Christ, and Christ allowed it, they wouldn't listen.
D) It seemed like a personal issue with them - that my salvation was something that I was doing against them, and not between God and myself without their involvement. I had to convert to please them. They got angry if I didn't, and one has to ask, how am I angering them? They would say, "You are denying God, and therefore, his enemy, and therefore, I hate you as God hates you.

How does one untangle a soul so caught up in their own lies that they even misinterpret the bible and whom they serve?
 
Upvote 0

Meshavrischika

for Thy greater honor and glory
Jun 12, 2007
20,903
1,566
OK
✟50,603.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
One of the things that I strongly remember from another board was that there were some people that would get really angry because I hadn't converted yet. I said, "I wasn't aware that I needed to convert to be part of this disscussion board. I don't, for example, go hang out in a church, with no intention of converting. This is a board for people of all faiths. I believe that there is some truth in all religions, so that is why I came here."

They will respond, "It been x years! Why don't you just convert and repent!!!"

Why didn't I?
A) Most of their arguments made no sense.
B) They claim to worship Christ, and yet would I would point out that Romans 12:9 Let your love be without hypocracy. Cling to what is good, abhor what is evil was not a call of how and whom to hate, but how to love - which includes ones enemies, I was told that I didn't know what I was talking about.
I rarely saw the fruits of the Spirit. I saw them as wolves in sheeps clothing.
C) They quoted scripture, and more often than not, twisted it to make it completely the opposite of what was said (using OT to justify hatred of enemies, saying that the most loving thing you could do to a sinner is to hate them, etc.) When I would show how they are false in their logic, they would only listen to scripture. When I used scripture, they said that I had no authority, because I wasn't Christian. Even when I pointed out that Satan himself used scripture when tempting Christ, and Christ allowed it, they wouldn't listen.
D) It seemed like a personal issue with them - that my salvation was something that I was doing against them, and not between God and myself without their involvement. I had to convert to please them. They got angry if I didn't, and one has to ask, how am I angering them? They would say, "You are denying God, and therefore, his enemy, and therefore, I hate you as God hates you.

How does one untangle a soul so caught up in their own lies that they even misinterpret the bible and whom they serve?
so... you should convert just for the fun of it or to fit in on a board???

interesting. I've heard better arguments for Christianity :)

So you're a believer in God... I gather that. DO you believe in Christ? (that I'm not clear on).
 
Upvote 0

FaithLikeARock

Let the human mind loose.
Nov 19, 2007
2,802
287
California
✟4,662.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Green
Once again agreeing with Beanie, saying you have the truth turns people away. Very easily. No one wants to be told their wrong. And no one has an entire truth. Never have, never will. God's entire Truth is way out of our league. Having truth isn't what saves you, finding it is.
 
Upvote 0

allhart

Messianic believer
Feb 24, 2007
7,543
231
54
Turlock, CA
✟31,377.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Truth, Can be recipes for fat free living.As a self indulger/sinner and as for a Christian revering God 's love. We try to become more Christ minded in our walk. I tell you this, I talk about a lot about The Bad and the Good , but truly the the gospel is Good news.
As for non Christians they seem to gravitate towards hell bound issues and everything involved in and around it ,but the savor that can reconcile our lives is good news. Is over looked. This is Good Friday look at what Good God has done for the sinner John 3:16. Happy Easter everyone.
 
Upvote 0

Beanieboy

Senior Veteran
Jan 20, 2006
6,297
1,214
62
✟65,132.00
Faith
Christian
so... you should convert just for the fun of it or to fit in on a board???

interesting. I've heard better arguments for Christianity :)

So you're a believer in God... I gather that. DO you believe in Christ? (that I'm not clear on).

I believe in a broad idea of God. I think that I am God and God is me. Often, when people are on psychedelics, they will say, "I was one with the universe!" I think that is reaching Nirvana in a way - realizing that we are all a part of each other and everything.

Buddhism teaches that you are Buddha, you don't "become" Buddha. You are Buddha, and Buddha is all things.

Unfortunately, this seems to have been taken out of Christianity. My mother asked my brother-in-law to talk to me while he drove me to the airport. He asked me about New Age thinking in my city. I told him that there was nothing really new age about it, but that when I prayed, I went inside, not outside. I knew "god" was there, and didn't have to stare at the ceiling, wondering if he was paying attention.

He said, "When I look inside, all I see is evil. And the only good inside of me is God."

I said, "That's too bad. I see a good person, and I'm sad you can't acknowledge that. That is God's gift to us, and you are trashing that. Not only that, but if you believe that you "invite Christ into your heart", why do you see only darkness when you look inside, and turn your head to the clouds? Why do you separate yourself so much from God?"

Christians believe that there is only one path, one truth, and everyone else goes to hell.

I question the necesity of blood, or a pure human sacrifice. Christ spent far more time telling us how to live, and than how to die.
If I can forgive without bloodshed, and am a reflection of God, then God can as well. I think that God is far more about love, and teaching us to love, than about worshipping him, toiling for him, avoiding his wrath, and hoping we won't fry in the afterlife. I think God is literally love.

I was raised Christian, and spoke in tongues at 18, but my view of God and Christianity is very radical that where it started. Because I was raised in a very religious family, I explain my ideas in a Bible mindset, and the more I learn about other religions, the more they seem the same. I am fascinated by the beliefs of shamans, who claim that there is spirit life in plants, who refer to them as "teachers" with very distinct personalities. Natives revered the land, and lived in harmony. When I contrast that to the Western idea of domination of the planet, you can see how it is destroyed. Mention this, and people will claim that you "worship the creation instead of the creator." I once told someone that I saw God in all things - the bird singing is God singing. The trees blowing is God dancing. Accused of worshipping nature and false gods, the Christian said, "I see a bird and think ' that's just a dumb bird.'" Would you, however, receive a gift from a friend and say, "that's just a dumb sweater"? Don't you think of your friend ever time you wear it? Wouldn't they be hurt if you just used it to wash your floor, because its yours and you can do whatever you want?

I hope that explains it better. It's complicated. I believe that everyone has a puzzle piece of God, and if you put them all together, you will understand better. I think it is designed that way to force us to connect. And when I hear someone say, "No, God is defintely a duck's head!!!" while I have a piece of blue sky, who refuses to think that the red wood, the pond, the weather vane, may make a bigger picture, of a farm, I shrug and walk away.

The Church often teaches not to question, not to look outside the religion, and not to contemplate something more.

I don't subscribe to a "we believe..." but rather, "This is what I believe so far."
 
Upvote 0

Meshavrischika

for Thy greater honor and glory
Jun 12, 2007
20,903
1,566
OK
✟50,603.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
I believe in a broad idea of God. I think that I am God and God is me. Often, when people are on psychedelics, they will say, "I was one with the universe!" I think that is reaching Nirvana in a way - realizing that we are all a part of each other and everything.

Buddhism teaches that you are Buddha, you don't "become" Buddha. You are Buddha, and Buddha is all things.

Unfortunately, this seems to have been taken out of Christianity. My mother asked my brother-in-law to talk to me while he drove me to the airport. He asked me about New Age thinking in my city. I told him that there was nothing really new age about it, but that when I prayed, I went inside, not outside. I knew "god" was there, and didn't have to stare at the ceiling, wondering if he was paying attention.

He said, "When I look inside, all I see is evil. And the only good inside of me is God."
:doh:
I said, "That's too bad. I see a good person, and I'm sad you can't acknowledge that. That is God's gift to us, and you are trashing that. Not only that, but if you believe that you "invite Christ into your heart", why do you see only darkness when you look inside, and turn your head to the clouds? Why do you separate yourself so much from God?"

Christians believe that there is only one path, one truth, and everyone else goes to hell.
I'd beg to differ being one... but that's another thread :)
I question the necesity of blood, or a pure human sacrifice. Christ spent far more time telling us how to live, and than how to die.
If I can forgive without bloodshed, and am a reflection of God, then God can as well. I think that God is far more about love, and teaching us to love, than about worshipping him, toiling for him, avoiding his wrath, and hoping we won't fry in the afterlife. I think God is literally love.
:thumbsup:
I was raised Christian, and spoke in tongues at 18, but my view of God and Christianity is very radical that where it started. Because I was raised in a very religious family, I explain my ideas in a Bible mindset, and the more I learn about other religions, the more they seem the same.
:hug: thanks!
 
Upvote 0

Beanieboy

Senior Veteran
Jan 20, 2006
6,297
1,214
62
✟65,132.00
Faith
Christian

I think "I am The Way, The Truth, and The Light" use usually used to mean "the one truth", and very appropriate for the tread.
I have been told by most Christians that there is only 1 way to God, and that is through Jesus, accepting him as your PL&S, etc.

Because this is the "Only Truth", it seems appropriate for you to explain how you disagree.
 
Upvote 0

Meshavrischika

for Thy greater honor and glory
Jun 12, 2007
20,903
1,566
OK
✟50,603.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
I think "I am The Way, The Truth, and The Light" use usually used to mean "the one truth", and very appropriate for the tread.
I have been told by most Christians that there is only 1 way to God, and that is through Jesus, accepting him as your PL&S, etc.

Because this is the "Only Truth", it seems appropriate for you to explain how you disagree.
I'm way more accepting of the idea that others are welcome into the fold. The Christians for example, did not replace the Jews... we were grafted in (implying that the other branches were not all ripped off - KWIM?). I also believe that God is omnipotent and His ways go beyond my understanding. Therefore, there is the distinct possibility that others will be included and it's not my place to say they won't. This is MY path that He has led me down, and therefore is 100% right for me. For others? (just an example: Should I deny the faithful Jew entry because he didn't do it MY WAY?) Certainly not.
 
Upvote 0

allhart

Messianic believer
Feb 24, 2007
7,543
231
54
Turlock, CA
✟31,377.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
allhart, you're a great guy and all, but I just don't feel that way. We can still be friends though, right?
Friends indeed. Let me just state this, though, as for God not being in one's life; you walk through life in your own strength having no need for God. Just as an 18 year old tells his parent. I don't need you, I've got it, but in his stubbornness he needs you more than ever; therefore, he cannot be reached until he loses his way or has the notion to ask the question. Nor can God reach us until we lose our way. In my experience life is truly out of my control. I only work through life (try & try again )and in my discovery God's wisdom is better than anyone else's notion. As for you, I appreciate you and what you offer as a open minded debate. Making for interesting dialog. My love for you and others will never die. Once I was lost now am found. God bless.
 
Upvote 0