My main problem in life is alcoholism

[GTthaREBORN]

I know that God can cure me when I am ready. I think that God will never do this on demand because I need to learn something, about the value of my health and life, and when I am ready to understand this, the alcoholism will resolve.

It is often said that God knows all, and knows what you will say or ask before you pray. I definitely believe this is true. And I believe God knows the exact moment that I will be cured. I believe that my involvement, and desire to be cured is part of what will bring this about.

If there was no purpose for anything, for believers, God would simply cure me and people like me with similar problems. The reason a problem persists is when we really don't apply ourselves and look for the answers. I believe that God wants to help, and wants us to succeed, but feels that it would be all too easy to just "cure" us. We must apply ourselves each day and remain faithful to our belief system, and we will eventually figure every little single thing out which is a problem, and that there WILL be a solution. But it will not be given unless we dedicate ourselves.

 

[madison1101]

Alcoholism is a progressive, fatal disease, and can only seriously be dealt with through total abstinence from it. It gets worse as time goes on, if not arrested, through totally stopping the drinking.

If you have been drinking on a daily basis, it is absolutely necessary to get medical help detoxing. Detoxing from alcohol without medical supervision can, and has been fatal.

While I believe that God can, and does, cure people of all types of maladies, I tend to know more believers who found help and hope in Alcoholics Anonymous. I am one of them.

AA was founded on Christian principles. Everyone of the 12 Steps of the AA program are rooted in the Bible. I stopped drinking, and have not had a drink, in over two and a half years.

If you are interested, there is a Life Recovery Bible you can begin to study to learn the Biblical basis of the Steps in the AA program.

 

[Alivewire]

I have spent countless hours meditating about the relationship between an Alcoholic and his/her relationship with God. My personal belief regarding recovery, is a formula that is similar but more precise than the 12 step program. I believe that the most important attribute needed or necessary for recovery, is definitely the same one needed for his/her own spirituality. " A Foundation." If the 12 step program really fits the idealism of ones spirituality, the demands must be the same regarding the committment of both related paths. Let's look at 2 different situations to evaluate the differences.....
Example 1.
An alcoholic gets arrested for OWI. Court order states an alcohol assessment and follow up treatment. The offender is of no religious affiliation and has no belief in any God. When attending the program, it is asked and taught, that one accepts that a higher power exists and you indeed are powerless over your addiction. As a non believer, ignorant to Christianity or any religion at all, that's a 'Hard Sell." However, the court order holds true and needs to be upheld. So one will listen and participate, often relying on saviness and street smarts in regards to group and counselor discussions.Eventually,... completing the obligation needed to move on with their life.
Probable outcome? Temporary strength and effort. Long term...." I have persevered and won't drive or do that again!" What typically happens.....is simple and almost always the case......" Damn! I knew better, i was just lit and messed up!" By that, we can use examples of .....fighting, driving drunk...adultery, isolating from family/friends etc... Hahaha..you get the point.
Ok let's look at my 2nd example...

An alcoholic gets arrested for OWI. Court order states an alcohol assessment and follow up treatment. The offender is armed with the background of Religious persuasion.When attending the program, it is asked and taught, that one accepts that a higher power exists and you indeed are powerless over your addiction. In both examples, regardless of your beliefs you are being taught and asked to base your recovery on the belief that a higher power exists and that it is the necessary part in breaking your addiction. In this example, we are assuming you are well informed regarding God or your higher power. So as you participate in group or counselor discussions...you really have a belief system in tact. Probable outcome? Life lasting strength and effort. What can you do differently, to join our 2nd example? As I stated above, build a foundation! Sounds simple and Trite. Think about marriage or a family's relationship. The ones that work and hold true all have 1 and only 1 attribute in common.....a Foundation! By that, I mean...no matter how bad or wild things get..there is a belief you must have that triggers" Hey...this isn't the way I wanna live!" To define that realization of " right or wrong" one needs to find that " Higher power" before trying to cure an addiction through the 12 step program.

Recommended course of action? Prior to attending AA or a court ordered program, seek out " Get togethers or Bible groups" and see if you can build a foundation. The key is....building a foundation.....it's the secret required for parenting, marriage,spirituality, recovery and absolutely everything long term.

I wish you all the best, and again....if you need to make a change....start by building your spiritual foundation......the rest follows suit!

 

[madison1101]

I have spent countless hours meditating about the relationship between an Alcoholic and his/her relationship with God. My personal belief regarding recovery, is a formula that is similar but more precise than the 12 step program. I believe that the most important attribute needed or necessary for recovery, is definitely the same one needed for his/her own spirituality. " A Foundation." If the 12 step program really fits the idealism of ones spirituality, the demands must be the same regarding the committment of both related paths. Let's look at 2 different situations to evaluate the differences.....
Example 1.
An alcoholic gets arrested for OWI. Court order states an alcohol assessment and follow up treatment. The offender is of no religious affiliation and has no belief in any God. When attending the program, it is asked and taught, that one accepts that a higher power exists and you indeed are powerless over your addiction. As a non believer, ignorant to Christianity or any religion at all, that's a 'Hard Sell." However, the court order holds true and needs to be upheld. So one will listen and participate, often relying on saviness and street smarts in regards to group and counselor discussions.Eventually,... completing the obligation needed to move on with their life.
Probable outcome? Temporary strength and effort. Long term...." I have persevered and won't drive or do that again!" What typically happens.....is simple and almost always the case......" Damn! I knew better, i was just lit and messed up!" By that, we can use examples of .....fighting, driving drunk...adultery, isolating from family/friends etc... Hahaha..you get the point.
Ok let's look at my 2nd example...

An alcoholic gets arrested for OWI. Court order states an alcohol assessment and follow up treatment. The offender is armed with the background of Religious persuasion.When attending the program, it is asked and taught, that one accepts that a higher power exists and you indeed are powerless over your addiction. In both examples, regardless of your beliefs you are being taught and asked to base your recovery on the belief that a higher power exists and that it is the necessary part in breaking your addiction. In this example, we are assuming you are well informed regarding God or your higher power. So as you participate in group or counselor discussions...you really have a belief system in tact. Probable outcome? Life lasting strength and effort. What can you do differently, to join our 2nd example? As I stated above, build a foundation! Sounds simple and Trite. Think about marriage or a family's relationship. The ones that work and hold true all have 1 and only 1 attribute in common.....a Foundation! By that, I mean...no matter how bad or wild things get..there is a belief you must have that triggers" Hey...this isn't the way I wanna live!" To define that realization of " right or wrong" one needs to find that " Higher power" before trying to cure an addiction through the 12 step program.

Recommended course of action? Prior to attending AA or a court ordered program, seek out " Get togethers or Bible groups" and see if you can build a foundation. The key is....building a foundation.....it's the secret required for parenting, marriage,spirituality, recovery and absolutely everything long term.

I wish you all the best, and again....if you need to make a change....start by building your spiritual foundation......the rest follows suit!

Are you in recovery? Are you sharing from your own experience? Your advice to wait till one gets a spiritual foundation is extremely dangerous. While a person is busy building that foundation they could kill someone in a DUI, or die from this disease of alcoholism. Plus, anything done while under the influence is futile, because most alcoholics can barely think straight while they are under the influence. No spiritual foundation can be laid until the alcoholic puts down the drink, and that is what the First Step of AA is all about. The Spiritual Foundation starts to get laid with the Second and Third Steps. It continues to get stronger when the alcoholic, while sober, cleans house by doing an intensive self-examination and confessing it to God and someone else in the Fourth and Fifth Steps. More Spiritual growth takes place by trusting God to remove the behaviors examined in cleaning house while doing the Sixth and Seventh Steps. More self-examination reveals people we have harmed, and amends are made, restoring relationships in the Eighth and Ninth Steps. Daily housecleaning is begun in the Tenth Step. The practice of prayer and meditation is learned and practiced in the Eleventh Step. Finally, ministry to others suffering from alcoholism is begun in the Twelfth Step.

There can be no Spiritual foundation laid till the alcoholic puts down the drink.

Bible study can be done by reading the Life Recovery Bible.

God bless.

 

[Alivewire]

Ahh yeah. We definitely have a different belief system in regards to this topic.

 

[madison1101]

Ahh yeah. We definitely have a different belief system in regards to this topic.

Are you an alcoholic? Are you in recovery?

If not, why are you posting?

Do you work in the field of addictions and alcoholism?

I am a recovering alcoholic. I also work in the field.

 

[Alivewire]

Hello madison1101!
I think you have wonderful intentions in regards to offering sincere advice to afflicted addicts.
You took issue with my post that described the importance of building a spiritual foundation, prior to entering the AA committment that a court will order...(in the example I gave.)

Because you have an active and well-intentioned chat path here...I thought it more tactful to: private message you in answering your reply, but I have too few.

Firstly, In the post I made, I was referring to the person that may have been convicted of an OWI related crime. Could relate to even a domestic crime, a crime that involved theft etc......a crime resulting from Usage of alcohol.

As courts decide the sentence for anyone that fits my example, almost always, an alcohol assessment will coincide with the fine and or jail time. At the assessment, the counselor will almost always, recognize the client has experienced " A loss of control" while using. At that point, one on one and/or Alcohol counseling will be the path of treatment recommended and required for the individual to meet the court order given.

One of the first things the counselor will require, is that you attend AA meetings at a certain frequency. These meetings will be often proven via signatures, from the speaker that held the meeting.

What I hoped to say, and must have failed lol, is that for a newcomer to the AA scene, it's effectiveness relies on selling the new member the idealsim that...."He or she has a higher power" and they themselves are powerless against alcohol.

I tried to describe the pitfalls that an attendee may face when confronted with this advice. I am still of the belief, That when presented with the situation I describe, the best way to compliment the court order, is to build a foundation with Christ. Let me explain by looking at a recent post you made: YOU STATED:

.
In addition to an AA sponsor, I have a Spiritual mentor. She is a mature woman I met a church ages ago. We started out where she guided me in learning what God said about Himself and me in His Word. She also held me accountable to working my AA 12 Steps. I confided all me secrets to her. She always taught me what God's Word had to say about my distorted thinking, in order for me to learn that what I was thinking was not the Truth, but a lie from the Devil.
Here's an example of how she would do that. My brother Jack would be 61 years old today, BUT he died suddenly four years ago. The alcoholic in me would think, "It's too painful today to deal with Jack's birthday. I can't stand how I feel. It's awful he died so young. I'm mad at God for robbing my family of him, my baby brother, and my Dad. I think I'll go buy a bottle of wine and get drunk, so I won't have to feel so bad." (I used to think this way.)
Ruth has taught me what God says about all my thinking. "Praise the Lord, Jack was a believer in Jesus, so he is celebrating his birthday in heaven with Neil and Daddy. What a better way to celebrate than with Jesus. Yes, it hurts to miss him on this special day. God can give me the strength to get through this time without hurting myself. AND, God loves me so much, He sent His Son to die for me, and give me that strength. Plus, if I get drunk, I will feel a lot worse afterward. Only the Devil wants to hurt me. God wants me to take care of myself so that I can help other people who are hurting from lost loved ones. It's hard, but God is faithful to strengthen me."
Your mentor started out by stating what God menat to you and his word. That's all my post was saying. The prize is based on the 12 step program and doing it. To compliment it...one should first seek out their higher power as the 12 step program starts with it. Build a foundation and then you can utilize the 12 steps. If one chooses not to....odds are, they will play the game and get through their sentence with no real course of healing!

 

[madison1101]

Hello madison1101!
I think you have wonderful intentions in regards to offering sincere advice to afflicted addicts.
You took issue with my post that described the importance of building a spiritual foundation, prior to entering the AA committment that a court will order...(in the example I gave.)

Because you have an active and well-intentioned chat path here...I thought it more tactful to: private message you in answering your reply, but I have too few.

Firstly, In the post I made, I was referring to the person that may have been convicted of an OWI related crime. Could relate to even a domestic crime, a crime that involved theft etc......a crime resulting from Usage of alcohol.

As courts decide the sentence for anyone that fits my example, almost always, an alcohol assessment will coincide with the fine and or jail time. At the assessment, the counselor will almost always, recognize the client has experienced " A loss of control" while using. At that point, one on one and/or Alcohol counseling will be the path of treatment recommended and required for the individual to meet the court order given.

One of the first things the counselor will require, is that you attend AA meetings at a certain frequency. These meetings will be often proven via signatures, from the speaker that held the meeting.

What I hoped to say, and must have failed lol, is that for a newcomer to the AA scene, it's effectiveness relies on selling the new member the idealsim that...."He or she has a higher power" and they themselves are powerless against alcohol.

I tried to describe the pitfalls that an attendee may face when confronted with this advice. I am still of the belief, That when presented with the situation I describe, the best way to compliment the court order, is to build a foundation with Christ. Let me explain by looking at a recent post you made: YOU STATED:

.
In addition to an AA sponsor, I have a Spiritual mentor. She is a mature woman I met a church ages ago. We started out where she guided me in learning what God said about Himself and me in His Word. She also held me accountable to working my AA 12 Steps. I confided all me secrets to her. She always taught me what God's Word had to say about my distorted thinking, in order for me to learn that what I was thinking was not the Truth, but a lie from the Devil.
Here's an example of how she would do that. My brother Jack would be 61 years old today, BUT he died suddenly four years ago. The alcoholic in me would think, "It's too painful today to deal with Jack's birthday. I can't stand how I feel. It's awful he died so young. I'm mad at God for robbing my family of him, my baby brother, and my Dad. I think I'll go buy a bottle of wine and get drunk, so I won't have to feel so bad." (I used to think this way.)
Ruth has taught me what God says about all my thinking. "Praise the Lord, Jack was a believer in Jesus, so he is celebrating his birthday in heaven with Neil and Daddy. What a better way to celebrate than with Jesus. Yes, it hurts to miss him on this special day. God can give me the strength to get through this time without hurting myself. AND, God loves me so much, He sent His Son to die for me, and give me that strength. Plus, if I get drunk, I will feel a lot worse afterward. Only the Devil wants to hurt me. God wants me to take care of myself so that I can help other people who are hurting from lost loved ones. It's hard, but God is faithful to strengthen me."
Your mentor started out by stating what God menat to you and his word. That's all my post was saying. The prize is based on the 12 step program and doing it. To compliment it...one should first seek out their higher power as the 12 step program starts with it. Build a foundation and then you can utilize the 12 steps. If one chooses not to....odds are, they will play the game and get through their sentence with no real course of healing!

You have twice failed to answer my specific questions about you. Are you an alcoholic? Are you in recovery? Are you speaking from experience of your own?

Since this is a Christian Forum, I base my advice as though I am speaking to people who would name Christ as their Higher Power. How their relationship with Christ develops is totally up to them. I gave specific guidance on having a discipleship/mentorship relationship with a mature believer who would hold the person in early recovery accountable to the Spiritual disciplines that foster Spiritual growth, PLUS this person should be teaching them Scripture and guiding them in their study of God's Word. This should be done at the same time that a person starts attending AA, finding a sponsor and working the 12 Steps.

Many people, like myself, don't have the courts order them to attend AA. I came to AA at the encouragement of my psychotherapist. Many people attend AA after being in a treatment facility. They are not coerced at all. When I first started attending, I did not have my discipler/mentor. I still was able to grow Spiritually, just not to the depth I have had with Ruth.

Please answer my questions about yourself.

 

[ChristianFlockForums]

One of my favorite AA verse that could apply here is.....Keep it Simple Stupid..

 

[BlessedDove]

I am an alcoholic and am in recovery. madison1101 knows her stuff and shares it well.

 

[Oakcyclist]

I know that God can cure me when I am ready. I think that God will never do this on demand because I need to learn something, about the value of my health and life, and when I am ready to understand this, the alcoholism will resolve.

It is often said that God knows all, and knows what you will say or ask before you pray. I definitely believe this is true. And I believe God knows the exact moment that I will be cured. I believe that my involvement, and desire to be cured is part of what will bring this about.

If there was no purpose for anything, for believers, God would simply cure me and people like me with similar problems. The reason a problem persists is when we really don't apply ourselves and look for the answers. I believe that God wants to help, and wants us to succeed, but feels that it would be all too easy to just "cure" us. We must apply ourselves each day and remain faithful to our belief system, and we will eventually figure every little single thing out which is a problem, and that there WILL be a solution. But it will not be given unless we dedicate ourselves.

It's my main problem too. I'm on the verge of losing the woman I love and our home - I've already lost my job and this past Wednesday I nearly lost my life. I decided that Tuesday would be my last day drinking so I went out a with a bang so to speak. The next day I called a friend and arranged to attend AA with him. I stayed drink free all day and on the way to the Wed night meeting suffered a pretty hard core seizure and ended up in the ER. If I hadn't been close to a fire station when it happened Lord knows what would have happened to me. I had noticed little shakes throughout the day but kind of ignored them and thought if I could to the meeting I would be okay b/c I could just sit there - meeting was walking distance. But alas I never made it and nearly died. If that doesn't convince you to stop nothing will. I went to AA last night - a small group but it forced me to share my story and was very helpful. I know with support and a lot of prayer I'll make it through this very difficult period but I urge to stop for the sake of your health. And for your friends and family that love you.

 

[PBA]

I am the problem.
Alcohol is but a symptom of a disease called Alcohol-ism.
AA offers a solution for those who have a desire not to drink. Beyond that, AA offers a daily reprieve to guard against taking the first drink and also to deal with the ism's of this disease. That is a daily reprieve that is contingent upon our spiritual condition. For the founders of AA that meant surrender to God, abiding in Christ, and following Him.
That is what works for me also - Attending AA, working my AA program, and abiding in Christ daily. First things first - don't drink and detox out of the alcoholic fog.
Thanks for posting/sharing.

 

[guyfromnb]

Even though AA is not allied to any religious movement or other kind of organizations I believe that it was inspired by God... And it's literature were really (and still are) of a big help for me along with my knowledge of the Bible... I especially loved the Big Book, the Daily Reflections and As Bill Sees It...

I still go to meetings and get involved in one in particular... for I know that keeping on going and meeting with others like me helps me keep sober...

 

[PBA]

I'm in full agreement with that. I go to AA also.