My grandchildren have not been baptized

[wondrousgnat]

My wife's son has been having trouble finding a nanny for his 3 kids since his wife died. A couple of days ago he said he thought he found someone who seemed perfect. But then stated that her beliefs were unacceptable. "What beliefs?" my wife asked. She casually mentioned that she just had her three month old baptized and that belief was unacceptable. (Last year his kids were through a "dedication" rite at some store front church. Since he has gone though a lot of stress since his wife died last month and he is also one who absolutely refuses to listen to differing opinions we did not argue.
He then looked at me and said that I am not lie other Catholics because I go to church and volunteer.

Questions about the bible:
1. Where in the bible do you find a "dedication" rite?
2. Where in the bible does it say to not baptize children?
3. Where in the bible does it mention that children of Christians were baptized at a later date?
What we do find in the bible:
1. In the epistles we read that "entire households" were baptized. Naturally entire households includes children.
2. In the gospels Jesus said "Let the children come unto Me and forbid them not for of such is the kingdom of God."


Continuing:
I remember once reading a study that the percentage of Catholics who attend church on a regular basis is higher then in any Protestant denomination (he has always belonged to store front churches with self ordained ministers). (Also, I have known people who have not been to mass for 50 years but still identify themselves as Catholics. I Have never seen such a pattern among Protestants.)
I have never noticed a difference in volunteer work among denominations. (Although picketing abortion clinics it can be hard to find the lone Protestant.)

 

[wondrousgnat]

Actually I know that it is wrong but the thought came to mind that maybe I should sneak the kids into the bathroom and baptize them with tap water. I won't do it but could that method be any less sacramental that a baptism in a store front church by a self-ordained minister?

 

[bill5]

She casually mentioned that she just had her three month old baptized and that belief was unacceptable.

This made me go on several levels. Like

- why does he care what religious beliefs his NANNY has? It's not like they're engaged, or even a relationship. Is she going to be "home schooling" them too? Even if so, if he's that untrusting of someone he otherwise thought was so great, good luck finding anyone he considers "acceptable."

- what is so unacceptable about that? I know some people/beliefs don't go for baptism, but offhand I'm not aware of any which forbid it.

He then looked at me and said that I am not lie other Catholics because I go to church and volunteer.

I appreciate that he's hurting from his loss, but that's a pretty ridiculous and insensitive statement to make. Not to mention inaccurate. A great many Catholics go to church and/or volunteer. How many of his religion or whatever it is do either, I wonder? There are people of all denominations who do (and don't).

Questions about the bible:

1. Where in the bible do you find a "dedication" rite?

The New Testament, mostly regarding John the Baptist (hence the name )

2. Where in the bible does it say to not baptize children?

It doesn't, of course. (I suspect you already knew that....)

3. Where in the bible does it mention that children of Christians were baptized at a later date?

It doesn't say that either. Baptism pretty much started with John but is a tradition/rite that came from the Church, and also has its roots in the Jewish tradition (though they were immersed vs just water touched on the forehead).

Actually I know that it is wrong but the thought came to mind that maybe I should sneak the kids into the bathroom and baptize them with tap water. I won't do it but could that method be any less sacramental that a baptism in a store front church by a self-ordained minister?

I wouldn't. They're his kids, his business, like it or not.

That reminded me of this classic clip from a classic sitcom about a similar situation though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_YutZBOcYk

 

[GoingByzantine]

Greetings brother in Christ! Passage after passage in the Bible indicates the need for baptism. This dedication rite I have been told is simply a pre-baptismal construct, a placeholder if you will, until a child is ready for an adult believers baptism. Adult baptism is practiced for converts into our Church, but for children, infant baptism is still a must.

Since we do not know how God judges children who pass at an early age, before baptism. It is considered wise to baptize a child as soon as possible! As it stands your grandchildren are currently at risk, since they remain unbaptized. If I were in your situation, I might arrange for a priest to visit with your wife's son and discuss Baptism with him.

A more tricky route you might want to consider is bringing him and his children to a monastic community, some of them are considered "tourist spots" so you could make a mini vacation out of it. I have noticed that those who see monastic life first hand often feel compelled to find out more about their faith. Perhaps seeing a group of monks, or nuns living the Catholic faith (which is in stark contrast to store front churches) your son will feel compelled to baptize his children and embrace Catholicism.

Lastly, if he is one of those people who hates anything Roman Catholic (there are so many of them ), then it might be best to find him a non-latin alternative. Perhaps you have an Anglican Use parish nearby (these are Anglicans in communion with Rome) or maybe you have an Eastern Catholic community nearby, it is possible he might feel more comfortable at one of these. There are also charismatic catholics, and parishes with contemporary music, once again these might be up his alley. Ask Jesus for help in this endeavor.

If worse comes to worse, as a very last resort, if he refuses to join Catholicism and abide by its teachings; I would teach the children all about the Catholic faith whenever you have a chance. Hopefully when they become an adult they will join and be baptized due to what you taught them.

 

[LoAmmi]

Edit: Read something wrong.

 

[AMDG]

Actually I know that it is wrong but the thought came to mind that maybe I should sneak the kids into the bathroom and baptize them with tap water. I won't do it but could that method be any less sacramental that a baptism in a store front church by a self-ordained minister?

Don't do that hush-hush sneak Baptism. Yes, in bygone times even hospitals did it routinely when a baby was born in distress, and Faithful Grandparents were often told to just sneak a Baptism of the child when parents refused to honor their obligations to their child. However even the Church now simply says to trust Jesus who loves the children because the PARENTS are the ones God has entrusted the children, not anyone else. It is their pledge to raise the child that matters. (Baptism is only one part--RAISING THE CHILD TO KNOW JESUS is the other necessary part and remember that the Baptism is a Sacrament and can be given only once.)

Talk to your priest or read about Baptism in the Catechism of the Catholic Church or read about Baptism in the Faith Facts at Catholics United for Faith (Home - Catholics United for the Faith - Catholics United for the Faith is an international lay apostolate founded to help the faithful learn what the Catholic Church teaches.) or even write them about it.

Oh don't think that I don't know about the grief this causes. I've gone through this situation when one of my daughters married a non-Catholic who thought that his children should remain unbaptized until they specifically ask for it . (Without missing a beat, my husband embarked on teaching the baby her first word: Jesus. And many--including several priests--prayed along the way. And many Divine Mercy Chaplets were said. The child WAS Baptized at 2 years of age, but the PARENTS decided and it was a celebration not a hush-hush sneak attack that would have to be explained at each coming Sacrament and would cause distrust when parents found out.)

Also, I would assume that a Dedication to the Lord is a little like a Consecration to the Sacred Heart or like the one many Catholics have of their homes being Consecrated to the Sacred Heart of Jesus and the Immaculate Heart of Mary or even the Consecration many Catholics have to the Blessed Mother. Although not a Sacrament, it probably gave some comfort.