My Graduate Challenge

[AV1611VET]

In your opinion, what are the chances of a YEC entering a secular college or university today and graduating as a YEC after getting a degree in life sciences?

 

[bhsmte]

In your opinion, what are the chances of a YEC entering a secular college or university today and graduating as an evolutionist after getting a degree in life sciences?

No way to tell what the percentages would be.

What we do know though, is there is a strong correlation between; higher levels of education and an acceptance of the TOE.

 

[AV1611VET]

No way to tell what the percentages would be.

What we do know though, is there is a strong correlation between; higher levels of education and an acceptance of the TOE.

You answered too quickly.

QV my OP after edit.

 

[bhsmte]

You answered too quickly.

QV my OP after edit.

Nope, I answered appropriately.

 

[AV1611VET]

In your opinion,

No way to tell ...

Was asking for your opinion asking for too much?

Do you see why I called this a "challenge"?

 

[bhsmte]

Was asking for your opinion asking for too much?

Do you see why I called this a "challenge"?

Was asking for your opinion asking for too much?

Do you see why I called this a "challenge"?

It would depend on the degree they would be obtaining as to how many would stay YEC. If it was a degree heavy into biology, it would be likely a high percentage of them would depart from YEC. Other, less biology driven majors, would reduce the number.

 

[AV1611VET]

It would depend on the degree they would be obtaining as to how many would stay YEC.

Would intimidation play a role in his deconversion?

(In your opinion.)

 

[bhsmte]

Would intimidation play a role in his deconversion?

(In your opinion.)

Only if one would call learning about science intimidation.

Again, education appears to be the kryptonite of YEC beliefs. As education goes up, YEC beliefs go down.

 

[AV1611VET]

Only if one would call learning about science intimidation.

Again, education appears to be the kryptonite of YEC beliefs. As education goes up, YEC beliefs go down.

Okay.

Thank you for your answers.

 

[crjmurray]

Without having any hard data I can't give a definite answer. It's very possible that a YEC could go through the motions, graduate, and still remain a YEC. If they were a YEC due to ignorance of current science then I would say the chances of them still being a YEC after graduation is fairly low. If they are a YEC due to self delusion then the chances are higher that they will remain a YEC.

 

[Zosimus]

Only if one would call learning about science intimidation.

Again, education appears to be the kryptonite of YEC beliefs. As education goes up, YEC beliefs go down.

Your post implies a causal connection between education and losing YEC beliefs. This claim is unjustified. It is just as likely that someone who believes in YEC is not particularly motivated to be part of an educational system that teaches things he or she views as incorrect.

 

[RickG]

In your opinion, what are the chances of a YEC entering a secular college or university today and graduating as a YEC after getting a degree in life sciences?

YEC refers to a young earth perspective, i.e., geology. Life sciences refers to the biological sciences. The two are completely different. A person in any university can earn a degree in life sciences and never attend a single geology class.

 

[AV1611VET]

If they were a YEC due to ignorance of current science then I would say the chances of them still being a YEC after graduation is fairly low. If they are a YEC due to self delusion then the chances are higher that they will remain a YEC.

What if they're a YEC due to faith in the Bible?

 

[AV1611VET]

Your post implies a causal connection between education and losing YEC beliefs.

Either that, or the answers, not the question, would.

 

[crjmurray]

What if they're a YEC due to faith in the Bible?

I covered that.

 

[AV1611VET]

YEC refers to a young earth perspective, i.e., geology. Life sciences refers to the biological sciences. The two are completely different. A person in any university can earn a degree in life sciences and never attend a single geology class.

This sounds like a good point.

Perhaps a YEC would be willing to address this?

 

[bhsmte]

Your post implies a causal connection between education and losing YEC beliefs. This claim is unjustified. It is just as likely that someone who believes in YEC is not particularly motivated to be part of an educational system that teaches things he or she views as incorrect.

I am not claiming causation, I am saying there is a clear correlation. It is a fact, the higher education achieved, the lower the belief in YEC. Same applies to beliefs in a God.

There is a clear correlation, take from it what you will.

 

[bhsmte]

YEC refers to a young earth perspective, i.e., geology. Life sciences refers to the biological sciences. The two are completely different. A person in any university can earn a degree in life sciences and never attend a single geology class.

True, but if one claims the earth is 6000 years old, chances are they are a biblical creationist as well and deny evolution.

 

[Zosimus]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religiosity_and_education#Positive_relationships

Sociological research by Patricia Snell and Christian Smith on many dimensions of general American youth have noted that older research on baby boomers showed correlations where higher education undermined religiosity, however, studies on today's youth have consistently shown that this has disappeared and now students in college are more likely religious than people who do not go to college.

 

[Ada Lovelace]

In your opinion, what are the chances of a YEC entering a secular college or university today and graduating as a YEC after getting a degree in life sciences?

I think many Young Earth Creationists begin college with a resolution to remain unyielding in their beliefs, and even view the challenges they'll encounter as an honor of sorts. Part of the problem I've encountered when learning about how science is taught from a creationist perspective is that the faulty knowledge really isn't the primary problem. It's not what they are taught, but how they are taught to think and to regard science that is far more problematic. It's like how you form muscle memory from the repetition of exercises or movements; your brain becomes accustomed to instinctively reacting to information in a certain way. New training can reform the old, but there has to be a willingness to make the effort.

I don't know how many people brought up to believe in YEC pursue a degree and profession in the life sciences. I think it's quite rare, though there are two threads I've read on here from teens with this exact dilemma.

It seems more common that a creationist will encounter problems with the science classes that are a part of the General Education Requirements. It's virtually impossible to avoid evolution and fulfill the GERs at UCLA. The inadequate preparation of creationist textbooks was at the heart of this lawsuit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_Christian_Schools_International_v._Roman_Stearns

As I've mentioned before, one of my real-life friends who I befriended last summer taking a biology course that focuses on ecology and evolution at UCLA had been raised as a creationist and began college as one. She spent her first year with an attitude about it, and certain she'd never, ever, ever, ever, ever change her mind about creationism. But, over time she did. She is pursuing a degree in nursing, and science courses were a part of it. And it had a crushing impact on her faith as a whole, but eventually she was able to rebuild it.

Even at Christian colleges debates over literalism have been divisive. The faculty at Bryan College, which was named after Willing Jennings Bryan, the prosecutor in the Scopes Trial, overwhelmingly voted "no confidence" in their president last year after he issued a clarification to the statement all faculty and some students must sign to include an affirmation of Adam and Eve being "historical persons." 25% of the staff bolted.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/21/e...er-bolstering-its-view-on-evolution.html?_r=0

And:
http://www.christianitytoday.com/gl...ionism-makes-life-difficult-for-everyone.html
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...ts-christian-colleges-and-their-students.html