My faith is weak and I'm finding myself increasingly attracted to Islam...

TLSF · Sep 20, 2011

ElizabethGould said:
I'll answer here to help me think this out.

Simple answer is that Christianity is all I have known most of my life. I went to two Church of England schools, spent most of my time right through until uni graduation within a Christian setting, going to Christian Union in uni, going to church since I was 8 etc.

During this time of your life did you have any 'Experiences'? miracles? anything explained by - God did it.

ElizabethGould · Sep 20, 2011

TLSF said:
During this time of your life did you have any 'Experiences'? miracles? anything explained by - God did it.

There is perhaps one experience which stands out from the rest and which I'll recount here.

I used to play in a worship band on bass. Now I'd never even stood up infront of a crowd to play music before, and certainly not in church to 400 people, and I was petrified out of my wits. I eventually just went backstage and said this:

''God, I'm playing my bass for You. Just help me out here'' (my exact words)

And then as I turned to go back to the main stage something very amazing happened. I suddenly felt very warm, deliriously happy and couldn't move a muscle. I couldn't even breathe, but despite that I wasn't scared or in any sort of distress. All I could do is stand beside the bass amp with my arms by my side, looking upwards towards the cross we had on the wall. And for that performance, nothing went wrong, nothing seemed to worry or trouble me at all. It seriously felt like I was being helped by God Himself (can God play the bass?).

I remember every single detail of this whole thing like it was yesterday, right down to the clothes I was wearing, the bass I used and the songs we did. I even remember the words of the sermon pretty much word-perfect.

And so far I've never found a good non-God explanation.

TLSF · Sep 20, 2011

ElizabethGould said:
''God, I'm playing my bass for You. Just help me out here'' (my exact words)

That's absolutely Beautiful!

There is perhaps one experience which stands out from the rest and which I'll recount here.

So there's more?

And then as I turned to go back to the main stage something very amazing happened. I suddenly felt very warm, deliriously happy and couldn't move a muscle. I couldn't even breathe, but despite that I wasn't scared or in any sort of distress. All I could do is stand beside the bass amp with my arms by my side, looking upwards towards the cross we had on the wall. And for that performance, nothing went wrong, nothing seemed to worry or trouble me at all. It seriously felt like I was being helped by God Himself (can God play the bass?).

How does it feel when you look back on this experience?

This begs the question, why when you have experienced God in your life do you want to leave him?

Sure Islam might be more simplistic (according to you). In South Africa people love their VW MK1's, because of their simplisity. You know what they love even more? BMW 7-series, Merc S-class not because of their simplisity, but because they are AWESOME! (Allah = VW, God = Mercedes Benz)

God loves you! You know this, because you have experienced it ...

Hopefully I have been helpful.

ElizabethGould · Sep 20, 2011

TLSF said:
That's absolutely Beautiful!

I couldn't think of anything else to say. I was so scared, I thought ''let my heart and not my head do the praying for once''.

So there's more?

There's been other instances. I went through a really bad time a couple of years back when I was practically suicidal, in danger of dropping out of uni, and just generally a mess. But I still went to church, still attended prayer meetings, and still ultimately relied on God to somehow do something.

At the time it felt like He wasn't doing anything, like He was watching me suffer. BUT (and it's a big but) when I finally recovered and got over that bad time, I realized VERY quickly that this wasn't the case at all. Indeed, people who I was friends with, but who I didn't consider a really good friend, turned out to be the very opposite and were the greatest of support to me. I got the courage too to seek help in my problems and got the help I needed. I realized very quickly that far from standing back, God had put in place certain things to help me survive.

How does it feel when you look back on this experience?

This begs the question, why when you have experienced God in your life do you want to leave him?

There was a time when I was trying to write the whole thing off to some very Earthly cause, such as nerves, the medication I took at the time or something else. But the more I tried to do this, the more I realized there was one thing missing in my explanation- God!

As to that second part, I just don't know. As I said, I keep returning to the Bible, time and time again. I've even spent part of today in church for the first time in ages.

I think part of my problem is that for me, I spent the better part of my life with a very vague Christian knowledge and it seems to have put me at a major disadvantage. I was 20 (and had been Christian for three years) before anyone had told me what the Holy Spirit was, or what was meant by 'ministry'.

Sure Islam might be more simplistic (according to you). In South Africa people love their VW MK1's, because of their simplisity. You know what they love even more? BMW 7-series, Merc S-class not because of their simplisity, but because they are AWESOME! (Allah = VW, God = Mercedes Benz)
God loves you! You know this, because you have experienced it ...
Hopefully I have been helpful.

You have indeed been helpful.

Johnnz · Sep 20, 2011

Your last post sort of confirmed by suspicions that your Christian background was somewhat inadequate. I have already given you some websites that address issues Christians face from an intelligent and well informed basis, which you have acknowledged. They should fill in many gaps in your understanding.

You might find Tom Wright's book 'Surprised by Hope' worth reading. He is an Anglican Bishop and outstanding biblical scholar.

The crux of the issue really boils down to Jesus vs Mohammed. The Koran was written some centuries after Jesus and the NT writers. Mohammed was influenced by a Jewish sect who opposed Christian teaching. It was against those and other teachings, later labelled 'heretical ' that Athanasius and others clarified the nature of the Trinity and arrived at the Nicene Creed.

In order to promote his own viewpoint Mohammed obviously needed to diminish Jesus as God incarnate. As such, Jesus' authority would override his. Thus Jesus was demoted to being merely a prophet. But that ignores the entire NT and the testimony of the church fathers who followed after the apostles. Paul's statement in 1 Corinthians that without the resurrection of Jesus we have no Jesus and belief worth following makes the watershed issue very apparent. With the resurrection we attest that Jesus was God, that he has broken the powers of darkness's stronghold over creation, and that death itself has been conquered. Experientially the immediacy of the Holy Spirit in our lives is our guarantee that Jesus did rise from the dead and will be returning as the Father's only recognised Lord of this world to fully reclaim His creation. That goes well beyond being a mere or even a major prophet. None of the OT prophets ever claimed that about themselves.

John
NZ

ElizabethGould · Sep 21, 2011

Johnnz said:
Your last post sort of confirmed by suspicions that your Christian background was somewhat inadequate. I have already given you some websites that address issues Christians face from an intelligent and well informed basis, which you have acknowledged. They should fill in many gaps in your understanding.

You might find Tom Wright's book 'Surprised by Hope' worth reading. He is an Anglican Bishop and outstanding biblical scholar.

Yes, those links you provide are really helpful, and I thank you.

The crux of the issue really boils down to Jesus vs Mohammed. The Koran was written some centuries after Jesus and the NT writers. Mohammed was influenced by a Jewish sect who opposed Christian teaching. It was against those and other teachings, later labelled 'heretical ' that Athanasius and others clarified the nature of the Trinity and arrived at the Nicene Creed.

It would certainly explain why the Qur'an attribute some practices to 'Christians' that are blatantly wrong. Like the passage about worshiping Mary, something not one sect of Christianity actually does.

In order to promote his own viewpoint Mohammed obviously needed to diminish Jesus as God incarnate. As such, Jesus' authority would override his. Thus Jesus was demoted to being merely a prophet. But that ignores the entire NT and the testimony of the church fathers who followed after the apostles. Paul's statement in 1 Corinthians that without the resurrection of Jesus we have no Jesus and belief worth following makes the watershed issue very apparent. With the resurrection we attest that Jesus was God, that he has broken the powers of darkness's stronghold over creation, and that death itself has been conquered. Experientially the immediacy of the Holy Spirit in our lives is our guarantee that Jesus did rise from the dead and will be returning as the Father's only recognised Lord of this world to fully reclaim His creation. That goes well beyond being a mere or even a major prophet. None of the OT prophets ever claimed that about themselves.

John
NZ

This is a very good argument.

1watchman · Oct 27, 2011

As a Christian one can see things from that perspective, and as a Moslem one will see things from that perspective, and with all others the same.

Faith in the true God is not about religion, but a relationship, and only Christianity has that. With the Lord Jesus in one's heart they walk and talk with Him and are saved. Islam's leader died and is gone; their God was invented after the biblical Old Testament, and after the Lord Jesus Christ in the New Testament. It is basically an attempt to use some of the same language as the OT and NT, and imitate the biblical record.

One can have any religion they want and believe whatever they want, but the true Creator-God set forth Himself and His "great salvation" in His beloved Son, the Lord Jesus Christ. The choice is yours, so be careful and prayerful about it. Look up!

- 1 Watchman

Rishad · Oct 28, 2011

Koran 5:51 Believers, take neither Jews nor Christians for your friends. They are friends with one another. Whoever of you seeks their friendship shall become one of their number. Allah does not guide the wrong-doers.
How would you explain this Elizabeth?

And secondly,
talking about sensibilty which you said you don't find in the Christian concept of grace,
how sensible is the islamic concept of men having 72 virgins in heaven?

Thirdly,
Why is it that an increasing number of muslims are migrating from islamic countries to non-sharia practising countries?

Why is it that Saudi Arabia has no churches, Why is it that Iran is prosecuting the increasing number of Christian converts? Are Muslims so insecure about their faith???
Yes they are and its because deep down in their sub-conscience they probably know that their religion isn't true.

freedmfighter · Oct 28, 2011

It's very interesting that as woman...your looking into Islaam to find some sort of fullfillment. Noting where you are from...I've read lots of articles from the UK and it has mentioned that many women are turning to Islaam for reasons like you said.
After going on youtube and seeing how women are treated in the middle east regions like Afghanistan...there was nothing on earth that would make me turn to Muslim.
Even though, I've never have ventured into the muslim religion..I have bought some books from our local Christian bookstore about men/women who converted to Christianity. The women came from familys who lived in states or UK and were born into muslim families that basically treated them rotten. One good book is called "the daughter of an imam." A good read.
Maybe if you can get into some good reading books about Muslim girls that converted to Christianity...it might help to take a stand where you are at right now...especially if you haven't dedicated yourself to the muslim religion/culture yet.
I hope this will help you.

Paige_something · Nov 15, 2011

Hello beautiful,

This sounds like a complicated and confusing situation which you are in. I just want you to know that Jesus Christ absolutely loves you. In all of your struggles, confusions and doubts, He is with you. He is the way, the truth, and the life (John 14:6).

“Jesus said, "I am the Road, also the Truth, also the Life. No one gets to the Father apart from me. If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him. You've even seen him”
- John 14:6-7 (MSG)

Did you know that in the quran, only Jesus Christ is a miracle worker and healer? – He stands out as unique. Not even mohammad could do the miracles which Jesus Christ could, and why? – Because, as recorded accurately in The Bible, Jesus Christ is God and exists at the very heart of God, and therefore He is able to perform miracles by the power of God. He stands out as unique.

I recently read a book called ‘The Torn Veil’, which is about a girl who followed islam closely and who really believed in the quran. She was a cripple, and went to Mecca, fully expectant that allah was going to heal her – but she was not healed. It was some time after this, that she found herself, for the first time in her life, praying honestly; not with the set prayers of islam, but praying personally to God – This led to her having a miraculous vision of Jesus Christ, in which He healed her and told her that He was God. She discovered her passion was Jesus – that He offers a personal relationship which islam cannot. Only Jesus Christ can really, truly satisfy the soul.

Also, The Bible tells us to guard our hearts:

“Keep and guard your heart with all vigilance and above all that you guard, for out of it flow the springs of life.”
- Proverbs 4:23 (AMP)

I heard an amazing talk at Church once which spoke about how we need to be careful what we surround ourselves with – because the things which we watch and listen to and read, affect our perceptions and emotions (Matthew 6:22-23 speaks about our eye being a light to our body).

Now, the enemy has never had an original idea in his entire existence. What the enemy often does is this – he takes the beautiful, gracious, amazing truths of God, and he twists them, or tries to get us to add to them, or take away from them in our minds, to distract us from the truth and to take us away from the amazing revelation of the grace and the love of God through Jesus Christ, Who is the glory of God. The enemy is a liar and a thief, and seeks to devour us Christians, and “pull the wool over our eyes” because he hates that we can have a personal relationship with God. the enemy hates that God wants to lavish His love onto us and create us in a pure heart through Jesus Christ. he is jealous that we, God’s heirs, are His masterpieces, created anew in Christ Jesuss.

“Casting the whole of your care [all your anxieties, all your worries, all your concerns, once and for all] on Him, for He cares for you affectionately and cares about you watchfully.

8Be well balanced (temperate, sober of mind), be vigilant and cautious at all times; for that enemy of yours, the devil, roams around like a lion roaring [in fierce hunger], seeking someone to seize upon and devour.”
- Peter 5:7-8 (AMP)

The Bible also tells us that the enemy is “the father of lies”. Therefore, we need to guard our hearts from that which is not the truth.

What I am saying is that the enemy has set out to deceive us through things such as the quran, by trying to imitate the beautiful truths of God (which are recorded in The Holy Bible), which the heart responds to and longs for. Did you know that The Bible says that the enemy can appear as an angel of light? – “And it is no wonder, for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light” – 2 Corinthians 11:14 (AMP).

So if you wonder why you feel this strange attraction to islam, that is why. The enemy likes to appear as an ‘angel of light’, but he isn’t one, as you know. Only Jesus Christ has a heart of light, grace, love and truth. Only Jesus Christ is holy, holy, holy purity and perfection.

The enemy is also probably working overtime to try and hide the heart of The Bible, and the spiritual truths contained in The Bible, from you. Keep praying and asking The Holy Spirit to breathe life onto His Word for you, so that you can have a revelation of the heart of it. Remember, God’s Truth are spiritual, so they are understood as The Holy Spirit reveals His Word to us. If we try and reason and rationalise out His Word, without His Spirit, then we’ll just get confused! (Well that has been my experience!)

Jesus Christ is Lord and He is perfect love. God, The God of Christianity, is love. The allah of islam cannot compare.

Now, I imagine that you want to keep your faith in Jesus Christ as Lord, that you want to discover Him as your First Love again, and that is why you keep coming back to His Word, hoping to find the truth – so I would encourage you for a few weeks, to try and ignore your thoughts about islam. Stop searching for islam, because it will keep you in a state of confusion and satan will try and tempt you through it.

Instead, focus with eyes of faith, upon Jesus Christ, the lover of your heart and your creator. He has more to offer you – living waters to quench your thirst! He wants to breathe life onto The Bible for you, and He wants to bless you so that you can see the beauty of a life with Him, as His child, once again.

Each day, spend a little bit of time at the feet of Jesus Christ, receiving from Him, and not from islam. Keep doing that, and keep putting on worship music that can connect you with the heart of Jesus Christ (if you need any tips of how to re-connected with God, just email me!). The Bible tells us that we love because Jesus Christ first loved us. So sweetheart, remain in that love and see how Jesus Christ begins to heal your perceptions and calm your worries.

Allow the peace which Jesus Christ gives, to guide you into all truth, and try not to rationalise your way out of the revelation of His truth. Sometimes, we can’t see the full picture – we can’t see the answers to all of our questions. Sometimes, we’ve got to live by faith and not by sight, and we’ve got to trust even when our emotions don’t correspond. Step out of the boat, take a leap of faith, and Jesus Christ will pour His love and peace into your heart.

“14And above all these [put on] love and enfold yourselves with the bond of perfectness [which binds everything together completely in ideal harmony].
15And let the peace (soul harmony which comes) from Christ rule (act as umpire continually) in your hearts [deciding and settling with finality all questions that arise in your minds, in that peaceful state] to which as [members of Christ's] one body you were also called [to live]. And be thankful (appreciative), [giving praise to God always].
16Let the word [spoken by] Christ (the Messiah) have its home [in your hearts and minds] and dwell in you in [all its] richness, as you teach and admonish and train one another in all insight and intelligence and wisdom [in spiritual things, and as you sing] psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, making melody to God with [His] grace in your hearts.
17And whatever you do [no matter what it is] in word or deed, do everything in the name of the Lord Jesus and in [dependence upon] His Person, giving praise to God the Father through Him”
- Colossians 3:14-17 (AMP)

“and the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.”
- Philippians 4:7 (NKJV)

I find that The Message Bible really can help to connect people with the heart of God. So if you are struggling, maybe check that out (You can check it out on Biblegateway . com) ?

harvester77 · Nov 27, 2011

ElizabethGould said:
Actually there is much emphasis in the Qur'an and Hadith on treating women and particularly wives and mothers with the greatest respect.

From what I can tell, salvation in Islam is a matter of personal responsibility and personal discipline. One must align himself with the will of Allah, and those who love and accept Allah will be transformed to do so naturally, and for their spirit to develop in the way of Allah.
Also note two of the names of Allah: Al Rahman (The Most Merciful) and Al Rahim (The Especially Merciful). The Grace of Allah is highlighted especially in Islam- it is only due to the Grace of Allah that ANYONE (including the Prophet Muhammad!) is saved.

And to me this is a much more reasonable concept- let's say you forgive someone for some wrong they've done to you. You'd expect them to then think about their bad behavior, correct it and then avoid it in future, from their own conscience. I can't imagine a situation where you'd say to someone 'I forgive in advance all your wrongs towards me and your past ones' and then be expected to then just say nothing about all their future wrongdoing as this takes away the element of personal responsibility that person has in Islamic thought.

Islam teaches (as far as I'm aware) that there is a spiritual ledger in which our wrongdoings take away from our account, whilst good deeds, thoughts and words will add to the balance (such as prayer 5 times a day, charity and even kind words). It is whether our credit is outweighed by the debits on our part that is crucial.m

Terrorism is very much against Islamic principles on suicide, the treatment of other religious and cultural groups, and the rules on Islamic warfare.

As for the second bit of that, the majority of converts to Islam as far as I'm aware ARE women. There's much to be praised about the Islamic treatment of women. And yes, I've read the entire Qur'an in French, Bosnian and Arabic.

sorry to bring up old thread but you are from the UK and say you live in dominantly muslim area. The UK is not like America, Christianity is kept under wraps for some reason. I suppose you are more attracted to the fact that muslims seem to stick together and have a better community but look deeper and see that whilst Muslims are nice the religion itself is far from the truth. The relationship you have with God as a Christian is far more real and true.
Read CS Lewis mere Christianity. It isn't a simple religion to understand Christianity and Islam is far more simple of you like, but that is what makes Christianity so amazing and knowing that God is beyond our simple minds.

Study some more and may God lead you.

My faith is weak and I'm finding myself increasingly attracted to Islam...

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