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SonWorshipper

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We had a thread on this before but I think it went the way of the crash. I would like to discuss this again.

Mechizedek


The first we hear of this "person" is in Genesis:

Genesis 14:


I have included the verses preceeding and following to show how this is "inserted" during this scenario.

The next is in King David's Psalms ( in full) :




Now in the Brit Hadasha:



And

 

SonWorshipper

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Just wanted to note that This King is mentioned in Hebrews, chapters 5 and 6 and chater 7 is fully devoted to him. I think this says a lot right there.
 
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SonWorshipper

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This is interesting from the The Nag Hammadi

http://www.najaco.com/books/christianity/nag_hammadi/melchiz.html
But all the tribes and all the peoples will speak the truth who are receiving from you yourself, O Melchizedek, Holy One, High-Priest, the perfect hope and the gifts of life. I am Gamaliel,
... (1 line unrecoverable) ...
of Adam, [...], Abel, Enoch, Noah, [...] you, Melchizedek, the Priest of God Most High, [...] those who [...] women ... ...
(lines 14-eop unrecoverable
)



 
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SonWorshipper

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This may also be used in our discussion:

Link-------->Melchizedek in the Dead Sea Scrolls
11QMelchizedek (11Q13)
Exerpt: Melchizedek (whose name means "king of righteousness" or "righteous king") also presides over the final judgment and condemnation of his demonic counterpart, Belial/Satan, the Prince of Darkness, who is elsewhere called "Melchiresha." (See 4Q280 "Curses of Melchiresha"; 4Q544 "Testament of Amram.") The name Melchi-resha ("king of wickedness/wicked king") darkly mirrors that Melchi-zedek.



Rabbinic Tradition
In later rabbinic tradition, Melchizedek receives little attention, perhaps because of the discussions of him in the New Testament and the speculations about him in earlier Second Temple era Jewish documents, such as 2 Enoch (chaps. A71-72). In the Babylonian Talmud, he is pictured as the judge of the last days (Sukkah 52b) but he's generally treated unfavorably in other texts (Nedarim 32b; Sanhedrin 108b). The Palestinian Targum (Targum of Jonathan ben Uzziel) on Genesis 14:18 says Melchizedek was "Shem son of Noah, the king of Yerushalem." Whether this means he was thought to be a reincarnation of Shem is unclear.
 
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D

Drotar

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What is important to know is that tithes traditionally were given to people that were greater in authority than the person offering them. Abraham was the father of God's chosen, and the grandfather of Jacob (Israel).

Melchizedek had to be positionally even greater than Abraham.

Perhaps he was a manifestation of Christ. But remember that the man and person Jesus was born in seed of Abraham as well. He would have been looking His great, great, great (etc.) grandfather in the eyes and taking a tithe from him. Something to think about.

BTW, isn't the Nag Hammadi a Gnostic text? I was JUST holding one on the shelf of a bookstore about 30 minutes ago, irony of ironies. I was thinking about purchasing it, but that's when I saw that it was a Gnostic teaching? What is the Nag Hammadi?
 
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Bastoune

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It is also noted that Melchizedek had no genealogy, as if to say that his priesthood came directly from God, not from a Levitical line.

Now, what did Melchizedek offer as a sacrifice with Abraham? Bread and wine.

This is a foreshadowing of the Eucharist as seen in the Last Supper.
 
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Bastoune

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Ingrafted Beth said:
Now everybody knows what my husband looks like, rofl!

Yeshua was fully God and fully man, yes?

I agree, the bread and the wine foreshadowed Yeshua, though not the "eucharist". I do not believe transubstantiation is biblical.


That's a whole other thread!

"Eucharist" means "Thanksgiving" by the way, from the Greek "eucharistia." (cf. Matt. 26:26)

http://www.therealpresence.org/eucharst/scrip/a6.html

The Didache:

"Let no one eat and drink of your Eucharist but those baptized in the name of the Lord; to this, too the saying of the Lord is applicable: 'Do not give to dogs what is sacred'". -Ch. 9:5

"On the Lord's own day, assemble in common to break bread and offer thanks; but first confess your sins, so that your sacrifice may be pure. However, no one quarreling with his brother may join your meeting until they are reconciled; your sacrifice must not be defiled. For here we have the saying of the Lord: 'In every place and time offer me a pure sacrifice; for I am a mighty King, says the Lord; and my name spreads terror among the nations.'" -Ch 14


"Since then these things are manifest to us, and we have looked into the depths of the divine knowledge, we ought to do in order all things which the Master commanded us to perform at appointed times. He commanded us to celebrate sacrifices and services, and that it should not be thoughtlessly or disorderly, but at fixed times and hours. He has Himself fixed by His supreme will the places and persons whom He desires for these celebrations, in order that all things may be done piously according to His good pleasure, and be acceptable to His will. So then those who offer their oblations at the appointed seasons are acceptable and blessed, but they follow the laws of the Master and do not sin. For to the high priest his proper ministrations are allotted, and to the priests the proper place has been appointed, and on Levites their proper services have been imposed. The layman is bound by the ordinances for the laity."

- St. Clement, third bishop of Rome, A.D. 80 ., Epistle to the Corinthians

"Consider how contrary to the mind of God are the heterodox in regard to the grace of God which has come to us. They have no regard for charity, none for the widow, the orphan, the oppressed, none for the man in prison, the hungry or the thirsty. They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer, because they do not admit that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, the flesh which suffered for our sins and which the Father, in His graciousness, raised from the dead."

Ignatius of Antioch, disciple of Apostle John, "Letter to the Smyrnaeans", paragraph 6. circa 80-110 A.D.

"This food we call the Eucharist, of which no one is allowed to partake except one who believes that the things we teach are true, and has received the washing for forgiveness of sins and for rebirth, and who lives as Christ handed down to us. For we do not receive these things as common bread or common drink; but as Jesus Christ our Savior being incarnate by God's Word took flesh and blood for our salvation, so also we have been taught that the food consecrated by the Word of prayer which comes from him, from which our flesh and blood are nourished by transformation, is the flesh and blood of that incarnate Jesus."

- Justin Martyr, "First Apology", Ch. 66, inter A.D. 148-155.
 
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Ruhama

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METATRON is not seen as God but rather his mouthpiece. He is to some mystics a form of manifestation of God himself, to others merely a high angel whose role is something akin to that in the movie Dogma (i.e. to give an intelligible voice to God's words). If I recall correctly the second is the more traditional take on it, so if you're using it to convince Jews that it's the same as Jesus/Melchizedek I expect you'll want that they be mystics.
 
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SonWorshipper

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Ruhama, I completely don't understand what you are saying. If ( who) is using what, ???

Can an angel ( of any caliber) accept offerings? Are they Kings? especially of Righteiousness? Are they called L-RD? ( as in Genesis 18:13). Do they wrestle with men and bless them? ( Genesis 32) Where Jacob names the place P'ni 'El meaning Face of G-d, because he said " I have seen G-d face to face and lived!"
 
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rbaker7385

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Melchizedek is a type of Christ. The Bible gives very little information about Melchizedek. All that we know are found in Genesis 14, Psalm 110, Hebrews 5,7 the most is found in this chapter. Types are frail illustrations at best. They are analogies and like all analogies, they correspond to the person or thing to which they are compared only in certain ways. The bronze serpent typified Christ in that it was lifted up for all the people to see and in looking up it brought deliverance. The sacrificial lamb typifies Christ in that it is very meek ( innocent ) and that it was sacrificed on behalf of the sins of others.
The focal point of chapter 7 is the most important part of Judaism the priesthood. No sacrifices could be made except by the priest and no forgiveness for sin apart from the sacrifices.
The writer first introduced Melchizedek in chapter 5 but before he could explain he gave a warning to the immature Jews before he could go on with this topic. Understanding Melchizedek is for the mature
Who was Melchizedek, some think he was an angel or Christ himself. I believe he was an historical human being whose priestly ministry typifies Christ. A man whom God chose to use as a picture of Christ. He wasn’t Christ because Hebrews 7:3 says he was made like the son of God not the son.
To the Jews there was no other priesthood established by God and the writer is indicating scripture recognizes another apart from the Levitical.
 
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rbaker7385

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Heb 7:3 Without father or mother, without genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God he remains a priest forever.
. This does not mean that he did not have a father or mother but that there is no record of them or of his origin. The point is that parentage and origin are irrelevant to his priesthood. Where as the Levitical Priesthood was entirely hereditary, through Aaron. There genealogy determined everything. There were no personal qualifications. The priest were more concerned about there pedigree than there holiness. Jesus like Melchizedek as far as priesthood was concerned had no priestly genealogy and need none. He was chosen because of he was and not from where he came from. Qualifications were personal and not hereditary.
Without beginning of days or end of life, LIKE THE SON OF GOD (like the son not the son)he remains a priest forever. It does not mean that he lived forever but that the order of priesthood in which he ministered was forever. It is a type of Christ eternal priesthood. Levitical priesthood was temporary from age of 25 to 50 for service. They were priest until death but served until 50 years of age. In 70 A.D. all this ended.
 
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