Mark 13:12 question

[Mike4Christ]

Jesus talks about brother betraying brother, father betraying child and child betraying parents to death. I tried to copy and paste the verses but since my post count isn't to 50 yet, it wouldn't accept my post.

So, my question is, is this betrayal caused by the Holy Spirit during the tribulation? Neither of my study bibles elaborate on this particular verse at all. Any clarifications are greatly appreciated! Thanks, everybody!

 

[calluna]

Jesus talks about brother betraying brother, father betraying child and child betraying parents to death. I tried to copy and paste the verses but since my post count isn't to 50 yet, it wouldn't accept my post.

So, my question is, is this betrayal caused by the Holy Spirit during the tribulation? Neither of my study bibles elaborate on this particular verse at all. Any clarifications are greatly appreciated! Thanks, everybody!

'"I am sending you out like sheep among wolves. Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves. Be on your guard against men; they will hand you over to the local councils and flog you in their synagogues. On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as witnesses to them and to the Gentiles. But when they arrest you, do not worry about what to say or how to say it. At that time you will be given what to say, for it will not be you speaking, but the Spirit of your Father speaking through you. Brother will betray brother to death, and a father his child; children will rebel against their parents and have them put to death. All men will hate you because of me, but he who stands firm to the end will be saved."' Mt 10:16-22 NIV

This was said to the Twelve, and concerned mission limited to the Jews only, at first. It must be said to have the broadest application, though. It is certainly true in modern times that families have been split after one or more members have been converted.

 

[SummaScriptura]

Jesus talks about brother betraying brother, father betraying child and child betraying parents to death. I tried to copy and paste the verses but since my post count isn't to 50 yet, it wouldn't accept my post.

So, my question is, is this betrayal caused by the Holy Spirit during the tribulation? Neither of my study bibles elaborate on this particular verse at all. Any clarifications are greatly appreciated! Thanks, everybody!

And when you hear of wars and rumors of wars, do not be alarmed. This must take place, but the end is not yet. For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be earthquakes in various places; there will be famines. These are but the beginning of the birth pains.

But be on your guard. For they will deliver you over to councils, and you will be beaten in synagogues, and you will stand before governors and kings for my sake, to bear witness before them. And the gospel must first be proclaimed to all nations. And when they bring you to trial and deliver you over, do not be anxious beforehand what you are to say, but say whatever is given you in that hour, for it is not you who speak, but the Holy Spirit. And brother will deliver brother over to death, and the father his child, and children will rise against parents and have them put to death. And you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved.

But when you see the abomination of desolation standing where he ought not to be ( let the reader understand), then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains. (ESV)

Following the passage as if it were a chronology of end-time events, it does indeed seem to be describing conditions during the Tribulation. More specifically, it seems to describe conditions during the first half of the Tribulation because in the next few verses Jesus speaks of the Abomination that Causes Desolation which is something that occurs at the mid-point of the Tribulation.

Here's how I take it, during the first half of the Tribulation, when the peace pact between certain Jews and the Antichrist is still in place, the greatest danger to believing Jews will be from their own national kinsmen and even direct relatives. Some of this persecution will occur in synogogues, which emphasizes the fact some degree of normalcy will be on-going among Jews at the time.

Once the Abomination is set up in the Jewish temple however, the greatest danger to all Jews believer or not, will be from the Antichrist. At the time the Jews will have to take flight to the desert for survival. There they will be winnowed and purified to become a people of faith.

That the Holy Spirit should cause this sort of betrayal, however, would be contrary to God's nature, so it would not be caused by Him. The Helper-Counselor-Comforter will not be the author of these betrayals.

 

[Mike4Christ]

Following the passage as if it were a chronology of end-time events, it does indeed seem to be describing conditions during the Tribulation. More specifically, it seems to describe conditions during the first half of the Tribulation because in the next few verses Jesus speaks of the Abomination that Causes Desolation which is something that occurs at the mid-point of the Tribulation.

Here's how I take it, during the first half of the Tribulation, when the peace pact between certain Jews and the Antichrist is still in place, the greatest danger to believing Jews will be from their own national kinsmen and even direct relatives. Some of this persecution will occur in synogogues, which emphasizes the fact some degree of normalcy will be on-going among Jews at the time.

Once the Abomination is set up in the Jewish temple however, the greatest danger to all Jews believer or not, will be from the Antichrist. At the time the Jews will have to take flight to the desert for survival. There they will be winnowed and purified to become a people of faith.

That the Holy Spirit should cause this sort of betrayal, however, would be contrary to God's nature, so it would not be caused by Him. The Helper-Counselor-Comforter will not be the author of these betrayals.

I agree. I couldn't possibly imagine the Holy Spirit causing these betrayals. The way the verse and surrounding context read is a little confusing in this aspect. I didn't intend to come off as blasphemous at all, and if I gave that appearance, then I apologize.

 

[calluna]

I agree. I couldn't possibly imagine the Holy Spirit causing these betrayals. The way the verse and surrounding context read is a little confusing in this aspect.

It is quite easy to understand that the Holy Spirit would cause betrayals by causing faith in some family members but not others. The flesh counts for nothing, does it not, and there is no hereditary inclination to faith. It is rare for whole families to be converted, all at the same time, anyway. Christians are not unaware of conflicts due to this quite regularly in the church.

Almost all prophesies of this sort have at least two applications, often three. One should certainly not be led to suppose that this whole passage does not have application in every age, because the same instincts to faith and persecution of faith exist universally. The 'local councils' that Jesus referred to no longer exist, but secular interests still combine with worldly churches to oppose the real church. If one knows no persecution, one will never know God, either.