If it where "game over" then that would mean we would not exist, if hell were literally a place of fire then the game would not be over since we are still in existence.
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If it where "game over" then that would mean we would not exist, if hell were literally a place of fire then the game would not be over since we are still in existence.The omnipresence of God is as the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is on the Earth to attract people to salvation through Jesus. It's game over for those in Hell. There's no point in the Holy Spirit going there.
If it where "game over" then that would mean we would not exist, if hell were literally a place of fire then the game would not be over since we are still in existence.
God is not omnipresent? I think separation from an omnipresent being would mean being cast out of existence.But God is not in hell, it is Godless. Only filled with the unrepented souls that did not follow Jesus Christ. One can not be in hell and with God, that is why there is Heaven and Hell. With or without God.
We will exist forever. God made spirit beings to be eternal. He didn't want a temporary family where members go poof every so often into nothingness. This is why devils and unsaved people are imprisoned rather than just executed, they can't be destroyed.If it where "game over" then that would mean we would not exist, if hell were literally a place of fire then the game would not be over since we are still in existence.
I want to comment on your thread LeonTrotsky. If I understand your question correctly, you pretty much want to know how can a person burn in fire eternally? I will need to quote scripture:
Luke 16: 19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day. 20. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, 21. And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich mans table:moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.22. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom:the rich man also died, and was buried. 23. AND IN HELL HE LIFT UP HIS EYES, Being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off and Lazarus in his bosom. 24. AND HE CRIED and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his fingerin water, and cool my TONGUE; for thou art tormented.
Please read this closely::: 26. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, from hence. 27. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my fathers house: 28. For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into thisplace of torment.
One More:::
Mathew 25:46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous will go into eternal life.
This is because the Bible says it is so:OK I have a question. How can hell be literally a place of fire?
May I ask, what do you base this on? How do you know the attributes of the spiritual body, and how do you know the nature of spiritual fire, or if you don't believe it is spiritual fire, how do you know that fire will not harm these bodies?It seems being in a spiritual body the fire would not affect us.
This is correct, which is why some Christians do not believe that Hell is eternal, in the sense that you are conscious and it lasts forever, Hell is finite. You are tossed into the lake of fire, and your spiritual body is destroyed, and that's it. The second death.And if we had physical bodies/characteristics that would mean we would eventually burn up and die since all physical living things go through the process of death.
Jesus said that there would be a time when all the dead would rise from their graves. So those in Hell one day will be there in the flesh. While it's safe to assume that the fire of Hell is a literal fire I don't see any reason not to also assume that "fire" is a way of describing the torment felt from being eternally separated from God. It's just a thought though.
Heya Leon, howya doing?
This is because the Bible says it is so:
Revelation 20:14Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Revelation 20:15If anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
May I ask, what do you base this on? How do you know the attributes of the spiritual body, and how do you know the nature of spiritual fire, or if you don't believe it is spiritual fire, how do you know that fire will not harm these bodies?
This is correct, which is why some Christians do not believe that Hell is eternal, in the sense that you are conscious and it lasts forever, Hell is finite. You are tossed into the lake of fire, and your spiritual body is destroyed, and that's it. The second death.
I'm currently trying to decide which version I believe, as both can be reasoned with Biblically, I'm just not sure.
May I ask, why have you asked this question originally?
All the best!
Digit
Yeah, it's an interesting study for sure. Again I am not sure which one to me speaks truly, as it also says the punishment is eternal. But you can interpret that to mean either ever-lasting or permanent. In which case, again, both could be true. Maybe the original text has more clues?
But, I feel you may be operating on an assumption which is that fire would destroy an eternal spiritual body. What if it could not destroy it? I mean, how do you know the nature of these things?
See what I am saying?
Digit
My questions earlier, is how do you know this? Obviously if there is a lake of fire, it's not in the physical realm as it's the spiritual hell so to speak. So how do you know, that this spiritual fire, will not harm spiritual creatures?If it were spiritual (which means non physical) then fire would not affect it, if it had feelings and other physical characteristics it would be a physical body and would be destroyed.
My questions earlier, is how do you know this? Obviously if there is a lake of fire, it's not in the physical realm as it's the spiritual hell so to speak. So how do you know, that this spiritual fire, will not harm spiritual creatures?
My second question, is how do you know the characteristics of either, when neither are elaborated on in the Bible?
Do the sticky situation we get into if we begin to make these assumptions?
Cheers!
Digit
This was a factual account, not a parable. The beggar has a name. What's the point of that if it's a parable? Why didn't Jesus stop at saying there was a certain beggar?Luke 16: 19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day. 20. And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus,...
LeonTrotsky said:The first one was a parable, why are you taking it literally?
Well, what were you expecting when you addressed the thread to Christians? The Hindu POV or a quote from Stephen Hawking?LeonTrotsky said:You base your beliefs on a book written by men which has been around for over one thousand years and you believe pretty much everything in it. So you automatically assume its correct.
It would follow that spiritual fire, would be fire in the spirit realm no? Or do you think that the spirit realm has normal fire? I don't think hell was described in symbolism at all, I think it's very literal, but I do not think we should assume that this fire is normal by any means. For example the Bible says it's a lake where the fire is eternal. That immediately doesnt' sound like normal fire to me, which requires fuel to burn, without it, it extinguishes. Clearly it's not normal in that light.
My point however, is that I felt you were perhaps getting confused by some assumptions, which you were taking to be definite facts. So in this respect, try to question things not from our human perspective, but from what the Bible tells us. I mean to say, you have already distinguished between physical and spiritual, and in the first sentence of your above reply, you mentioned physical fire. Which is fire that iss you describe, in the physical realm. So following that, does it not take that fire in the spiritual realm is spiritual fire?
Does that make sense?
All the best!
Digit
Who knows why?This was a factual account, not a parable. The beggar has a name. What's the point of that if it's a parable? Why didn't Jesus stop at saying there was a certain beggar?
Well, what were you expecting when you addressed the thread to Christians? The Hindu POV or a quote from Stephen Hawking?
I don't know for sure. But I think so yes.So hell contains special fire that never burns out and which does not need oxygen?
From the Bible:Were are you comming up with this? Do you not know what fire needs to survive?
That is almost a two-parter. First up is that if you come to a Christian forum and ask Christians questions based on Christianity, then you will quite obviously get responses from that perspective. You cannot ask a Christian about their religion, and then tell them to leave the Bible out of it. It is their religion.Why should I rely on a book written by men years and years ago when science was not nearly as advanced as today?
Again, isn't that a seperate thread? For myself, I not only believe in what the Bible says, but I feel what it says is true. I have felt God in my life and from that I conclude it is the Christian God, not another god.Why not believe in the Koran?
Christians all believe the central message of the Bible, yet we differ on our specific focuses, the denominations are there as a sort of guideline so we can find people who focus and hold views like us, but who are of one faith. They are not seperate religious views as you say.Obviously the Bible is not a good source since Christianity has many denominations and have never been able to agree on all subjects, I figured an error free book would be able to make that happen.
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