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Just A Question

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Orthodox Andrew

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I was speaking with Protestant guy and he sent me a story about Abraham Lincoln basically bad mouthing the Roman Catholic Church, and seemingly blaming Rome for a America's woes in the Civil War. I have a sinking suspicion that this may be just Propaganda. So have any of you heard about this story before? I don't want to post the story or the link because it might be seen as Anti-Catholic, but I will post it if you folks do not have a clue about what I'm talking about.


God bless you all.:)
 

nyj

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Andreas said:
I was speaking with Protestant guy and he sent me a story about Abraham Lincoln basically bad mouthing the Roman Catholic Church, and seemingly blaming Rome for a America's woes in the Civil War. I have a sinking suspicion that this may be just Propaganda. So have any of you heard about this story before? I don't want to post the story or the link because it might be seen as Anti-Catholic, but I will post it if you folks do not have a clue about what I'm talking about.
If the quote I think you're talking about is the one I vaguely recollect ( ummm, yah :) ), I believe the answer is: Abraham Lincoln never said it.
 
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Godzman

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nyj said:
If the quote I think you're talking about is the one I vaguely recollect ( ummm, yah :) ), I believe the answer is: Abraham Lincoln never said it.

And if he said it, would that bother you. Because if Bill Clinton or George W. Bush bad mouthed pentecostals that would still not change who I am, I could care less.

And I believe that you guys have nothing to worry about. Those who bring it up to make you guys feel like you are worthless are being silly.
 
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Orthodox Andrew

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nyj said:
If the quote I think you're talking about is the one I vaguely recollect ( ummm, yah :) ), I believe the answer is: Abraham Lincoln never said it.
That's what I thought.:) It was the one where he spoke of the Jesuits quite a bit.
 
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nyj

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Andreas said:
That's what I thought.:) It was the one where he spoke of the Jesuits quite a bit.
If it came from the pen of CHARLES P.T. CHINIQUY, it is a lie.

http://www2.bju.edu/resources/library/research/fund_file/lincoln.html

Charles Chiniquy (1809-99) was a priest who converted to Protestantism in 1860 and became a leading critic of Catholicism in America after the Civil War. In his Fifty Years in the Church of Rome, Chiniquy recounts three interviews over several visits with Lincoln during the Civil War. In these conversations, Lincoln not only professes to orthodox Christianity but also fervently denounces Catholicism. 19


How dependable is Chiniquy? There were no witnesses to the private conversations that Chiniquy relates. One can form some idea of his accuracy, though, by comparing one incident he recounts with other available historical evidence. In his autobiography, Chiniquy says that while he was still a priest in 1856, some enemies in the church hierarchy set out to discredit him. At the instigation of a bishop, alleges Chiniquy, one Peter Spink accused him of immorality and had him dragged into court. There Chiniquy was defended by lawyer Abraham Lincoln. The first trial ended with a hung jury. At the beginning of the second trial, Lincoln helped uncover a Catholic plot against Chiniquy, and Spink withdrew his charges, saying that he knew Chiniquy was not guilty. However, Lincoln's work so angered the Jesuits that they became his mortal enemies, their hatred climaxing when John Wilkes Booth (a Jesuit agent, Chiniquy alleges) assassinated Lincoln in 1865. 20

As the research of Joseph George shows, 21 the records of the Illinois law courts give a somewhat different account. Spink did bring suit against Chiniquy but for slander, for in a sermon Chiniquy had charged Spink with perjury. Chiniquy did hire Lincoln as one of his attorneys, and there were two mistrials. When the case came up the third time, Lincoln negotiated an out-of-court settlement. In that settlement, written by Lincoln, Chiniquy swore that he had never accused Spink of perjury, except by repeating a secondhand story that he personally did not believe; furthermore, he said that he believed Spink had never committed perjury. Spink and Chiniquy then split the court costs. The differences in detail in this account compared with that in Fifty Years in the Church of Rome at least call into question Chiniquy's unsubstantiated accounts of lengthy conversations with Lincoln written twenty years after the president's death. 22 The most that one can say, based on Chiniquy's account of the Illinois court case, is that Chiniquy may have met with Lincoln during the war but that the former priest's own views deeply colored his recollection of those meetings. 23
 
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nyj

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Godzman said:
And if he said it, would that bother you.
No, not really. The history of the United States is not one that is sympathetic to the Catholic (especially the Catholic immigrant), so if the words were true (and I believe they are not), it'd be more along the lines of the norm than out of the ordinary.
 
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nyj

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Andreas said:
Great info! I'm sending it to that guy now.:)
And he can't claim that the article is biased. That article is housed on the Bob Jones University website. BJU is not known for their overly pro-Catholic stance. :)
 
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Orthodox Andrew

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nyj said:
And he can't claim that the article is biased. That article is housed on the Bob Jones University website. BJU is not known for their overly pro-Catholic stance. :)
That's very true.:D
 
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Actually, Lincoln had no particular feelings towards Catholics thru most of his life. He was quite a phlegmatic guy. But, after he was hospitalized in DC for a short time, he spoke very affectionately and reverentially of the Catholic nuns who nursed him back to health.

Thanks for your post. I was wracking my brain for the name of that defrocked priest but couldn't remember it. Anti-Catholicism in nineteenth century America was incredible.
 
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Orthodox Andrew

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Michelina said:
Actually, Lincoln had no particular feelings towards Catholics thru most of his life. He was quite a phlegmatic guy. But, after he was hospitalized in DC for a short time, he spoke very affectionately and reverentially of the Catholic nuns who nursed him back to health.

Thanks for your post. I was wracking my brain for the name of that defrocked priest but couldn't remember it. Anti-Catholicism in nineteenth century America was incredible.
Thanks for the post.:)
 
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Veritas

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Greetings Andreas!:wave:


As you can see, this is an old conspiracy theory. Basically, the Jesuits are responsible for everything bad that has ever happened in the world including the Holocaust, all assasinations, 9-11, etc. It's really quite funny anymore. Why there are people who choose to believe these things, I don't know. I guess you just have to want to.

Blessings and come back anytime!:hug:

Veritas
 
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