I do plenty but what is it YOU want us to do, NP?
Produce something. Show, don't tell -- and stop trying to tear down those who have already done so.
It reeks of petty jealousy -- some of you "Christian" bretheren here never seem to have anything else, but you...
Of course NP, probably before you were born.
You know the fable -- remember it.
I talk to you about Jesus, NP, because He loves you and wants me to. Contrary to what you might think. He's everything to me. He is my Lord and I love to please Him. My plan is to do what He has commissioned us to do....tell as many people about Him as we can.
And now that you have -- and I have to tell you, you haven't told me anything I hadn't heard before -- what happens now?
If you heard from the science community that there was an impending doom, such as a giant asteroid smashing into the earth about to destroy millions of people, wouldn't you tell them? Wouldn't you let them know there was a way out? Well, that is what I am doing.
So -- show me the asteroid.
You can do that, right? C'mon, Inan, show me what makes your prediction of impending doom any different from the parade of doomsayers that have come before you -- with a 100% failure rate.
It's more like someone standing on the beach, noticing that the water level is slowly rising -- she runs through the town warning of the impending flood, when the reality is, it's just high tide -- doing what it's always done.
I KNOW there is a tomorrow. We've got at least 1007 years left on this earth and I'm expect more. It's a good future and I certainly do not expect to be left holding the bag. I'm going to endure to the end. I'm going to occupy till He comes. I keeping my eyes open. I'm planning for it but I want to take as many with me as I can.
It's the future here that needs to be addressed first.
There will be those who are left behind though. They will stay for the judgement, but even then, IF they turn to the Lord, He will be with them through it and protect them. It's better to be ready beforehand.
"Live every day as if it were your last -- one day you'll be right."
People will be going on with their lives not knowing or ignoring the signs and one day... bam!! ... eveything is going to change. All I'm telling you NP is look at the signs.
Oh, but I have, Inan -- Everything has changed. Everything has always changed. Everything is always changing. Everything will always change.
The big question is: how do you react to change? Do you fear it, accept it, or embrace it?
This world is NOT the way it was when I was born, and not even since you've been born.
Which is perfectly normal and to be expected.
We are going in a totally different direction.
Different from what? What direction were we going in before.... before... before what, exactly?
It's all been shown in the Bible and it is happening.
Funny -- all those doomsayers before you read the Bible and saw it happening too.
One world government is on the rise about to happen and was prophesied thousands of years ago in the Bible.
Because the Bible was compiled during a "one world government" -- the Roman Empire.
Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose.
Globalization is on the rise -- and I suspect that you guys lash out at scientists because it's technology which made it possible. In the last century, the world has gone from large to small to tiny. No nation-state can afford to ignore that it is part of a larger community, and that its actions have repercussions which affect others.
If an individual realized this, we'd applaud it as a sign of maturity -- yet your interpretation of the Bible causes you to fear this.
But don't fret -- borders will still exist. There's still enough petty jealousy, rivalry, tribalism, territorialism, ethnocentricism, and religious arrogance, intolerance, and downright hatred to keep the people apart, even as it becomes increasingly easier and more prudent for them to come together.
Isn't that interesting, Inan, that your interpretation of the Bible not only requires you to be suspicious of people doing what they should, but also cannot happen unless people abandon the very principles which they have been using to rationalize killing each other since the fist caveman slapped the second?
Things are coming more and more to a head. Look at the signs. That's why you should listen to me.
I've seen the signs -- and as much as I'd hate to disappoint you*, the sky is not falling.
*(okay, in the interest of honesty, I'd thoroughly enjoy disappointing you)
You're right about one thing -- the world is changing. You're not prepared for it; I'm not either. But I'm not afraid of that.
One thing I'm NOT going to do is set a date. Jesus said that no man knows the day or the hour. He aslo warned not to let anyone deceive you.
You know, there's actually a lot that I agree with Jesus on -- this is one of those things.
I think Buddha said it better, though:
"Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."
He then went on to tell them though, that there would be "signs" of the His coming and of the end of this world system but He made sure to add.
Mat 24:36 But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
In the gospel of Mark it is recorded that He includes Himself also, as not knowing.
I'm aware of that -- Look what else he said:
Matthew 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.
Matthew 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
Matthew 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
Seems to me that Jesus was explicitly saying that it was all going to come to a head immediately -- and obviously, it didn't.
That leaves two choices: Admit that Jesus (and by extension, yourselves as believers) was wrong, or find a way to creatively reinterpret His words to save face.
Alas, that choice was hardwired into Christianity before the ink dried on the first Bible:
1 Corinthians 15:17-19 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished. If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
^ Can't have that, now can we?
For someone to set the day or hour, it is an indication that they should be avoided and NOT followed. To follow someone who does, you are setting yourself up to be deceived. It's very clear.
Only slightly less deceived than someone who says "soon -- real soon; we know for sure this time!"
There's plenty of work to be done. The most important is getting the word out.
The Bible is the most popular book in human history; Christianity boasts over a billion professed followers. Who hasn't gotten the word yet?
As for waiting till Jesus swoops me up, I'm looking forward to it.
And then what? What will you do after you get swooped? In the past, I've compared religion (Christianity in particular) to a giant ponzi scheme -- everyone pays; nobody collects. So why don't you tell me, in your own words, what happens next?
Doesn't it interest you that the scriptures have predicted this day.
It does, as a matter of fact -- does this interest you?
"The Earth is degenerating today. Bribery and corruption abound. Children no longer obey their parents, every man wants to write a book, and it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching." -- Graffiti found on the walls of Pompeii.
The Bible is a wholly remarkable book -- the compilation of an entire ancient civilization's sacred and wisdom literature. And after 2,000 years of people latching on to it as a source of guidance in their own lives, it's easy to interpret it in any era, for any situation, to produce the desired effect.
And the best part is --- It's "The word of God" -- who among the faithful is going to argue?
That things are happening all over the world and scripture is being fulfilled right before our very eyes. Israel is a key sign. It has not been a nation for almost 2000 years and now they are. That may not seem so odd to you or me on the surface because in our life time we haven't known anything else. But think about it approximately 2000 years ago Jesus prophesied that they would be scattered into all the world and when they came back this was the beginning sign of the end. They were scattered in 70 ad and in 1948 they again became a nation. Jesus also said this is the sign of the beginning. The times of the Gentiles has come to an end. Israel will be in focus now. Big, big sign, NP. That is what stirs it ALL up.
Doesn't it interest you that the people who made that prophecy happen were fully aware of it, and had plenty to gain by deliberatly making it come to pass?
You're the scientist, figure it out. Aren't we seeing more earthquakes, more famines, more wars and rumors of wars, more diseases, these are all signs of the end times.
Of course we're
seeing more -- we're more capable of paying attention.
Do you think the number of Earthquakes has risen since 2,000 years ago? What are you basing that on?
As for the rest -- more people = more famines, more wars and rumors of wars, more diseases.
It's not divinity; it's doing the math.
Not the end of the earth but the end of this world system.
Just like the end of the last world system, and the end of the world system before that one, and the end of...
Again, change is a constant -- why should
this one be different from the long line of changes that appeared before?
Still a few things more to happen, though. The anti-christ will be set up as a global ruler for seven years. (seven years of tribulation on the earth) Prior to that is when Jesus is coming back in the clouds to "swoop" His people up. After the seven years Jesus is coming back TO the earth and He is going to at that time to set up His kingdom. That will be the millenial reign.
I've heard this all before -- it's a charming story, and is useful for giving hope to those who might otherwise wallow in despair at their lot in life.
That all being said, why should you listen to me, NP because even though the earth will be going on for awhile and you might go on with it. There will be a judgement soon on this world. It's not going to be an easy time.
It never is, Inan -- but we'll get through this one just like we got through all the hard times before it.
It won't be because of aliens it will be because of judgement. It's not aliens coming, it's Jesus. Once in the clouds to take those who are His away while judgement happens and then once again to take over the kingdoms of this earth and set up His kingdom and His followers will rule and reign with Him. You might last through the judgement or be here during the millenial reign both I hope for you but it is even better to join the side of the Lord and receive ALL that He has promised for those who are faithful to Him.
Well, there's the bait -- but I've seen the hook.
Maybe you won't believe this but contrary to what you might think... I am not saying, "so that's what going to happen to you, you wicked person. you're going to be judged and I'm glad!!" That is the LAST thing I want for you or anyone on this forum. I WANT you to be on the RIGHT side of the judgement.... on the Lord's side. I would love to stand side by side with you all. I hate to think of anyone falling short of God's best for them but some will unfortunately. Don't listen to me, if you don't want to, but look at the signs. Do a search and hear it from others with a greater understanding than I. Talk to the Lord, let Him tell you. I don't know what else to tell you.
I do believe you're sincere, Inan -- a little misguided in your ciriticisms (as I am from time to time), but you mean well -- which puts you head and shoulders over the usual cavalcade of narcissists and windbags I've been debating around here for
far too long (perhaps I need a vacation?)
And yes, I have seen the signs -- I just don't see them as signs of doom. I've done searches -- I just didn't find the same things you have. And I have spoken to those with greater understanding than you -- I just didn't hear the same bad news.
Change is coming, Inan -- I do agree with you there -- but change is already here, and has been with us for quite some time. It's when things
don't change that you should be worried.
So I believe that we're all going to make it though just fine.
I haven't given up NP, there's a lot to look forward to.
How much of it's here?
Once again I ask you, what is it YOU want me to do?
Living up to the words you've said here is a start.
As for the rest, I've already mentioned what it is about religious types that aggravates me. If you want to do something for me -- prove me wrong.
Not just in words, but in deeds.