Isn't it just a point of view?

[ClosetoChrist]

Um, I don't know exactly how to say this, and Im not certain if this is the right place. But gee, I just have a question about stuff.

My mom n dad taught me that most churches are pretty much the same. And I read about all this stuff here and wonder if anbody agrees with anything?

My grandpa taught me about the Bible n stuff, but you guys seem to have different points of view on lots of stuff he said.


So here is what I guess I want to know.

When is a small doctrine enough to be a different gospel, like we are not s'posed to believe. I mean I see you guys differ and just have to wonder.

If I believe in Jesus and His shed blood am I still a Christian if I believe in speaking in tongues? When that guy in the New Testament said about the diffrent gospels, what was he saying? Shouldn't everybody just believe the same stuff?

 

[CaDan]

Um, I don't know exactly how to say this, and Im not certain if this is the right place. But gee, I just have a question about stuff.

My mom n dad taught me that most churches are pretty much the same. And I read about all this stuff here and wonder if anbody agrees with anything?

We all agree on the Nicene Creed to be able to post here. If you think about it, that's a pretty big thing to agree with.

My grandpa taught me about the Bible n stuff, but you guys seem to have different points of view on lots of stuff he said.


So here is what I guess I want to know.

When is a small doctrine enough to be a different gospel, like we are not s'posed to believe. I mean I see you guys differ and just have to wonder.

If I believe in Jesus and His shed blood am I still a Christian if I believe in speaking in tongues? When that guy in the New Testament said about the diffrent gospels, what was he saying? Shouldn't everybody just believe the same stuff?

You will find a lot of apparent disagreement in this forum because we are all so close that we have a common language and context. A Christian and, say, an atheist, can't even agree on whether God exists, so they are not going to be arguing fine points of ecclesiology (which seems to be the biggest thing argued in this forum).

Here's something to keep in mind: It's fun to talk about God! But people have different ideas of what kind of fun to have. CF provides a wide range of forums for how we can talk. For some folks, they like to talk about God by way of fellowship and just chatting. For some folks, the fun way to talk about God is through pointed argument.

 

[ClosetoChrist]

We all agree on the Nicene Creed to be able to post here. If you think about it, that's a pretty big thing to agree with.



You will find a lot of apparent disagreement in this forum because we are all so close that we have a common language and context. A Christian and, say, an atheist, can't even agree on whether God exists, so they are not going to be arguing fine points of ecclesiology (which seems to be the biggest thing argued in this forum).

Here's something to keep in mind: It's fun to talk about God! But people have different ideas of what kind of fun to have. CF provides a wide range of forums for how we can talk. For some folks, they like to talk about God by way of fellowship and just chatting. For some folks, the fun way to talk about God is through pointed argument.

What's ecclesiology? is that like the Bible n stuff?

I don't kno about the whole argument thing. I think that might be a sin 'cause it might hurt peoples feelings or something.

 

[CaDan]

What's ecclesiology? is that like the Bible n stuff?

Ecclesiology is the study and theory of the Church. It is a subdivision of general theology.

I don't kno about the whole argument thing. I think that might be a sin 'cause it might hurt peoples feelings or something.

Arguing and quarreling are two different things. Quarreling is bad because it intends to hurt the other person. Arguing is good because it is a way to get at the truth and validity of beliefs and statements, or at least a method of understanding the beliefs and statements of another.

Think of the difference between brawling and wrestling (not "pro" wrestling!).

 

[nephilimiyr]

Hi ClosetoChrist

Yes there are differring opinions and beliefs in what the Bible says but please don't allow the arguements and judgmental attitudes that go on here in this internet message board give you any strong opinions on christians in general.

There are alot of different ways on how to interpret what the Bible is saying. The basic reason for this is because it's a translation from a ancient language that basicly doesn't exist anymore. Most of us can agree on some very basic truths such as the ones spelled out in the Nicene creed and sometimes that even isn't agreed upon all the time.

You're basicly asking a question that we all are and it takes time to learn the answer. We all here are seeking to know God more and to understand him more and in the process ideas and opinions will clash.

 

[nephilimiyr]

Arguing and quarreling are two different things. Quarreling is bad because it intends to hurt the other person. Arguing is good because it is a way to get at the truth and validity of beliefs and statements, or at least a method of understanding the beliefs and statements of another.

Think of the difference between brawling and wrestling (not "pro" wrestling!).

LOL, I agree!

 

[ClosetoChrist]

LOL, I agree!

So your sayin that if mom n dad say something I think isn't right about God n we talk about it then its good even if people get mad? Im still not so sure. ? Hey this is neat I jst saw these smiles n stuff.

So that ecclesiology thingy is that about all the churches? I mean is it just a Cathlic thingy or something?

 

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings Close to Christ,

How old are you? It is good that you are asking important questions, but if you really want to KNOW the answers, you have to get REAL with God. That is to read His Word, pray and be obedient to what He says. If you find yoursel disagreeing with your parents, you must always remember that you are to Honor and obey them. When you are out on your own you may express your difference of opinion with them, but always with fear and meekness, even as you would anyone else.

God loves you more than you can ever know, and He has given us Christ and His Word as indicators of that great love. Seek Him, His Kingdom and His Righteousness FIRST and all your questions will be answered and you will find comfort in His loving arms.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[achuzan]

Greetings Close to Christ,

How old are you? It is good that you are asking important questions, but if you really want to KNOW the answers, you have to get REAL with God. That is to read His Word, pray and be obedient to what He says. If you find yoursel disagreeing with your parents, you must always remember that you are to Honor and obey them. When you are out on your own you may express your difference of opinion with them, but always with fear and meekness, even as you would anyone else.

God loves you more than you can ever know, and He has given us Christ and His Word as indicators of that great love. Seek Him, His Kingdom and His Righteousness FIRST and all your questions will be answered and you will find comfort in His loving arms.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[ClosetoChrist]

Greetings Close to Christ,

How old are you? It is good that you are asking important questions, but if you really want to KNOW the answers, you have to get REAL with God. That is to read His Word, pray and be obedient to what He says. If you find yoursel disagreeing with your parents, you must always remember that you are to Honor and obey them. When you are out on your own you may express your difference of opinion with them, but always with fear and meekness, even as you would anyone else.

God loves you more than you can ever know, and He has given us Christ and His Word as indicators of that great love. Seek Him, His Kingdom and His Righteousness FIRST and all your questions will be answered and you will find comfort in His loving arms.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

Im not s'posed to say how old I am. I do try to obey mom n dad. My freinds told me about Jesus and I said a prayer n now I just want to know everything. I guess not everything 'cause I think everything is lots so no I just want to know a little bit to start. I read that theology word in my paps books so I thought this was the place to ask questions. 'cept people here seem to use big words n stuff so I only sort of get what they say.

 

[achuzan]

Im not s'posed to say how old I am. I do try to obey mom n dad. My freinds told me about Jesus and I said a prayer n now I just want to know everything. I guess not everything 'cause I think everything is lots so no I just want to know a little bit to start. I read that theology word in my paps books so I thought this was the place to ask questions. 'cept people here seem to use big words n stuff so I only sort of get what they say.

It is probably best to talk to like a youth leader or sunday school teach that way they can answer direct questions you may have.

 

[Saint_George]

CloseToChrist, I am no-one to tell you how to live your life but I can tell you that you are on the right path. Just remember these three things and your faith will grow stronger.

Have faith that Jesus Christ is our savior
Remember to pray and thank him
Live your life trying your hardest to follow in his footsteps (Be sure to read your bible and see the stories of him helping those in need)

Peace be with you,

Saint_George

 

[Dad Ernie]

So here is what I guess I want to know.

When is a small doctrine enough to be a different gospel, like we are not s'posed to believe. I mean I see you guys differ and just have to wonder.

If I believe in Jesus and His shed blood am I still a Christian if I believe in speaking in tongues? When that guy in the New Testament said about the diffrent gospels, what was he saying? Shouldn't everybody just believe the same stuff?

Greetings Close to Christ,

Are you speaking of Paul? i.e.:

Galatians 1:7-9 ... but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Paul is the major writer of the New Testament. He expounds on what Jesus said:

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

You will notice often that it is the "Gospel of the Good News of Jesus Christ" that is preached in the New Testament. We are told in the following how important this Gospel is:

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Acts 4:10-12 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. 11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner. 12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

There are many who claim to follow Christ, but He is also known as "the Word", which means He is the epitomy of fulness of the Revelation of God to man. You can tell these "false prophets" or "wolves" by whether or not they are obedient to Christ, or are they following men's made up doctrines?

This is why it is so very important to get to know the Word of God and to incorporate it into your daily life. Without it, we have no basis upon which to judge whether or not someone is telling us the truth or trying to deceive us.

We are also told that in the latter days, which I believe we are in, there will be many, many false prophets, so our relationship with God and knowing His word is all the more important.

Within the Orthodox Christian Community, we have a number of disagreements, but often they are not about the fundamentals of the Gospel. Though it is true that "All who call upon the Name of the Lord shall be saved", it is also true that "by their works shall you know them". What this means is that it is through "God's grace, through faith in Jesus Christ, by which we are saved. Not by works that we do, for we cannot earn our salvation, however, when we are created anew in the image of Christ, God will work in us to perform good works." There are those who stress WORKS over grace and I would avoid them, but I would also avoid anyone who stress an easy believism, that all we have to do is believe in God and then go on our merry way without demonstrating the Work that God has done in us.

Speaking in tongues or not speaking in tongues has nothing to do with salvation. If you do, great, if you don't, perhaps you ought to seek God and ask Him if they are for you.


It would be nice if everyone believed in the same thing. But of course there are MANY religions and even many groups or denominations within Christianity. Consider this verse:

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

What this is saying, is that even among Christians, differences of opinions will exist. You can tell those who are TRULY Christian by whether or not they obey and teach the true, whole Word of God. These show themselves to "be approved of God."

Well, if there are any other questions, I'm sure someone can help you out, but I would suggest you start a serious Bible study program and try to read the whole Bible at least once a year. In my first year, I read the whole Bible, minus a few of the OT books about 6 times, so it can be done if you are serious about getting to know God.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[constance]

Im not s'posed to say how old I am. I do try to obey mom n dad. My freinds told me about Jesus and I said a prayer n now I just want to know everything. I guess not everything 'cause I think everything is lots so no I just want to know a little bit to start. I read that theology word in my paps books so I thought this was the place to ask questions. 'cept people here seem to use big words n stuff so I only sort of get what they say.

Hi!

One thing that you will notice that there are some people on these boards (me too, sometimes) who use big words to make ourselves sound smart.



There are lots of people on CF who would be a great "buddy" for you - feel free to PM someone whose posts you like, and ask them for answers to your questions.

Constance

 

[stray bullet]

When is a small doctrine enough to be a different gospel, like we are not s'posed to believe. I mean I see you guys differ and just have to wonder.

If I believe in Jesus and His shed blood am I still a Christian if I believe in speaking in tongues? When that guy in the New Testament said about the diffrent gospels, what was he saying? Shouldn't everybody just believe the same stuff?

Well, I have my own thoughts on that, but the time to be concerned is when doctrine clearly contradict early doctrine, such as the bible. For example, Islam rejects the infallibility of the bible and presents theology in direct contradiction to it.

Doctrine is really nothing more than a defining of early Tradition in the early Church. I would urge one to stick with Tradition and not newer theologies. The book of Mormon, for example, isn't doctrine created out of Tradition, but newly presented doctrine.

 

[Delta One]

Hi ClosetoChrist,

Um, I don't know exactly how to say this, and Im not certain if this is the right place. But gee, I just have a question about stuff.

You've found the right place (besides, even if it weren't the mods would kindly move it to the correct forum).

My mom n dad taught me that most churches are pretty much the same. And I read about all this stuff here and wonder if anbody agrees with anything?

Many different churches have different views on some theological issues; the Catholics, for example, place a higher importance on Mary than the protestant churches -- I think that Mary (mother of Jesus) although she may have been special for God to have entrusted His Son into her care, is nothing more than a sinful and dead woman. She died a long time ago and is still dead until the time when Jesus returns and raises the dead "in Christ" at the end of time where she will be judged by God.

My grandpa taught me about the Bible n stuff, but you guys seem to have different points of view on lots of stuff he said.

That doesn't matter ; our different views are just based on different readings of the Bible. Depending on what your grandpa taught, it might not be such a bad thing to believe it. What kind of stuff did he teach you about the Bible?

When is a small doctrine enough to be a different gospel, like we are not s'posed to believe. I mean I see you guys differ and just have to wonder.

I think that when people explain away Jesus' virgin birth, His divinity (i.e. Him being the Son of God), the miracles that He performed, the reason and meaning for His life and subsquent death; when they say that He either didn't die on the cross or that He did but He didn't raise again; when people say that He will not return again do away with the devil and create a new heaven and new earth where there will be no more curse (the curse was placed on creation as a result of Adam's sin as recorded in Genesis). All of these things are absolutely critical to the Christian faith. I would also argue that a literal Genesis is also an essential basis that explains why Jesus' earthly life was made neccessary and the events that caused Him to die on the cross and rise three days later.

If I believe in Jesus and His shed blood am I still a Christian if I believe in speaking in tongues? When that guy in the New Testament said about the diffrent gospels, what was he saying? Shouldn't everybody just believe the same stuff?

To answer your first question, yes you are still a Christian. I believe that there are many people who have the God given ability to speak in tounges; it is recorded that the Apostles did it in Acts (I think). I'm not quite sure who you are talking about in the second question... I've got a sneaking suspicion that you're talking about Paul; but it looks like Dad Ernie is on the track right away if that's what you're refering to.

God be with you and may He shine His righteousness and blessings upon you and give you peace.

Have a nice day,
Delta One.

 

[ClosetoChrist]

Hi ClosetoChrist,

Um, I don't know exactly how to say this, and Im not certain if this is the right place. But gee, I just have a question about stuff.

You've found the right place (besides, even if it weren't the mods would kindly move it to the correct forum).

My mom n dad taught me that most churches are pretty much the same. And I read about all this stuff here and wonder if anbody agrees with anything?

Many different churches have different views on some theological issues; the Catholics, for example, place a higher importance on Mary than the protestant churches -- I think that Mary (mother of Jesus) although she may have been special for God to have entrusted His Son into her care, is nothing more than a sinful and dead woman. She died a long time ago and is still dead until the time when Jesus returns and raises the dead "in Christ" at the end of time where she will be judged by God.

My grandpa taught me about the Bible n stuff, but you guys seem to have different points of view on lots of stuff he said.

That doesn't matter ; our different views are just based on different readings of the Bible. Depending on what your grandpa taught, it might not be such a bad thing to believe it. What kind of stuff did he teach you about the Bible?

When is a small doctrine enough to be a different gospel, like we are not s'posed to believe. I mean I see you guys differ and just have to wonder.

I think that when people explain away Jesus' virgin birth, His divinity (i.e. Him being the Son of God), the miracles that He performed, the reason and meaning for His life and subsquent death; when they say that He either didn't die on the cross or that He did but He didn't raise again; when people say that He will not return again do away with the devil and create a new heaven and new earth where there will be no more curse (the curse was placed on creation as a result of Adam's sin as recorded in Genesis). All of these things are absolutely critical to the Christian faith. I would also argue that a literal Genesis is also an essential basis that explains why Jesus' earthly life was made neccessary and the events that caused Him to die on the cross and rise three days later.

If I believe in Jesus and His shed blood am I still a Christian if I believe in speaking in tongues? When that guy in the New Testament said about the diffrent gospels, what was he saying? Shouldn't everybody just believe the same stuff?

To answer your first question, yes you are still a Christian. I believe that there are many people who have the God given ability to speak in tounges; it is recorded that the Apostles did it in Acts (I think). I'm not quite sure who you are talking about in the second question... I've got a sneaking suspicion that you're talking about Paul; but it looks like Dad Ernie is on the track right away if that's what you're refering to.

God be with you and may He shine His righteousness and blessings upon you and give you peace.

Have a nice day,
Delta One.

I like you 'cause you write so I can sort of understand. My pap was a methdist preacher n he told me stories from the bible n stuff. He was really nice and I cried when he died. Mom says he's gonna be in heaven waiting for us so i guess I feel better.

Thers no book called Paul in my bible n so im not sure. 'cause the bible names are funny. Do you go to methdist church? Dad says there libral n I asked a lady what that meant n she said its like democrats so Im not sure what it means.

 

[ClosetoChrist]

Greetings Close to Christ,

Are you speaking of Paul? i.e.:

Galatians 1:7-9 ... but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

Paul is the major writer of the New Testament. He expounds on what Jesus said:

Matthew 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

You will notice often that it is the "Gospel of the Good News of Jesus Christ" that is preached in the New Testament. We are told in the following how important this Gospel is:

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

Acts 4:10-12 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole. 11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner. 12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

There are many who claim to follow Christ, but He is also known as "the Word", which means He is the epitomy of fulness of the Revelation of God to man. You can tell these "false prophets" or "wolves" by whether or not they are obedient to Christ, or are they following men's made up doctrines?

This is why it is so very important to get to know the Word of God and to incorporate it into your daily life. Without it, we have no basis upon which to judge whether or not someone is telling us the truth or trying to deceive us.

We are also told that in the latter days, which I believe we are in, there will be many, many false prophets, so our relationship with God and knowing His word is all the more important.

Within the Orthodox Christian Community, we have a number of disagreements, but often they are not about the fundamentals of the Gospel. Though it is true that "All who call upon the Name of the Lord shall be saved", it is also true that "by their works shall you know them". What this means is that it is through "God's grace, through faith in Jesus Christ, by which we are saved. Not by works that we do, for we cannot earn our salvation, however, when we are created anew in the image of Christ, God will work in us to perform good works." There are those who stress WORKS over grace and I would avoid them, but I would also avoid anyone who stress an easy believism, that all we have to do is believe in God and then go on our merry way without demonstrating the Work that God has done in us.

Speaking in tongues or not speaking in tongues has nothing to do with salvation. If you do, great, if you don't, perhaps you ought to seek God and ask Him if they are for you.


It would be nice if everyone believed in the same thing. But of course there are MANY religions and even many groups or denominations within Christianity. Consider this verse:

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

What this is saying, is that even among Christians, differences of opinions will exist. You can tell those who are TRULY Christian by whether or not they obey and teach the true, whole Word of God. These show themselves to "be approved of God."

Well, if there are any other questions, I'm sure someone can help you out, but I would suggest you start a serious Bible study program and try to read the whole Bible at least once a year. In my first year, I read the whole Bible, minus a few of the OT books about 6 times, so it can be done if you are serious about getting to know God.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

Um i don't know what some of this stuff means. Yur using bible stuff n my bible isnt like that. It says stuff more like I talk so I can know. What does expounds mean? n you said some stuff bout heresies so whats that? I looked in my bible n it says something bout everybody wants to be known n stuff n it says lots of people argue too.

ok I'll try n read my Bible cause that what Jesus would do too right. Its a big book n I don't read fast so I dont know if I can read it in a year. Your a fast reader if you can do that 6 times n you must know lots. So how come the bible names are so funny and hard to say? I found one that talk bout the churches cause its called Eccleiastes but it doesnt say who wrot it. somebody said thats what that word meant.

 

[jangnim]

Um i don't know what some of this stuff means. Yur using bible stuff n my bible isnt like that. It says stuff more like I talk so I can know. What does expounds mean? n you said some stuff bout heresies so whats that? I looked in my bible n it says something bout everybody wants to be known n stuff n it says lots of people argue too.

ok I'll try n read my Bible cause that what Jesus would do too right. Its a big book n I don't read fast so I dont know if I can read it in a year. Your a fast reader if you can do that 6 times n you must know lots. So how come the bible names are so funny and hard to say? I found one that talk bout the churches cause its called Eccleiastes but it doesnt say who wrot it. somebody said thats what that word meant.

There are lots of different Bibles. Some are written for young people like you, and others for us old folks.

Expounds means that a person is telling about something. It is telling more about a thing than you know already. Understand?

Heresies are hard to explain. People think things sometimes, about God and church. Other people think that what the first people think is wrong. When a church thinks differently from another one it can be a heresy.

Your Bible might be for children or for teens. I have a living Bible that sounds like what you are saying. Just read it, and God will show you the truth.

The Bible names are very old. They all come from another place in the world too. So they are harder to read than names in our country.

Ecclesiastes is a book of the Bible that talks about life. It really isn't about church at all.

You should talk to your pastor or preist about these things. I am certain they can help you. If you have other questions I'll respond.

 

[achuzan]

Hello again ClosetoChrist Do you go to school?
If so, have you noticed that there are groups of people that like to hang around each other? Most of the time it is because they like the same things, or the have the same things in common. Denominations (different churches) are kinda like those groups.
If people believe things alike then they will go to church where people believe like they do.
If someone has an accedent on the road and 3 people see it they may all have a simular, but different story, because they were all standing in different places and all noticed different things.
The different churches are kinda like this, they all see the same bible (for the most part) , but they may explain and focus on different parts of it.
The more you read the bible, and ask God for His guidance, the more you will know Him.

For now, The best places to get info are your parents, and grand parents and your youth pastor, and or pastor.

Hope this make since.
God bless.