grasping the after wind
That's grasping after the wind
- Jan 18, 2010
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What is the nature of this eternal self? If it is eternal, then it can never change, correct?
I don't disregard things that don't exist. I'm resigned to reality and all of the evidence is that I'll die and be gone. I don't worry about things I can do nothing about. Life's too short.
I don't know if you're a fan of the Mad Max trilogy...but even if you'd never seen any of them before I'd still recommend seeing the new one. Great movie.
Do you think that your personal past is infinite? Or do you think that it is bounded, but with "no discernible beginning", meaning something different than an infinite past?
And why do you think this? Are you suggesting that you are not a creation of God, and having something of a divine nature? Or what?
It has nothing to do with anything but subjectively viewed objective physical experience. In that experience I have no beginning. I have always been.
Indeed. Actually, I sometimes wonder if qualia is the "purest" form of communication available to us.
How about birth? You were born right?
How about death? You're mortal like the rest of us I assume.
You were around in 1789? Tell me what the food was like.
That double negative bothers me. And yes there will be, but you won't know it because well yea. I understand what you're actually saying, that you have only known you as long as you've been around and never a time before you, but there's flaws in that thinking.
Okay, let me see if I understand you correctly. Your life is your eternity because you can only have a subjective experience of your life while you are alive. You have no beginning because you cannot witness yourself transition from non-conscious to conscious. Are you getting at something like that?
Or are you making an epistemological point? Are you saying that since you have no experience of having no experience, you don't have sufficient reason to think that there ever was such a time?
I think that the fact that some have been discovered living normally without a brain shows that the brain is not the self.
Haven't seen it. I bet I know why it got a negative review...it's not the standard action flick. There's so much attention to detail that it looks like a high-art indie movie...if an indie movie had a 100 million + budget and more cars to wreck than a demo derby.Yes, I am a fan of the trilogy of movies, but was scared off a bit by a negative review of the new movie. But I will keep your endorsement in mind.
Any opinions about the latest Avengers movie? Is it worth seeing?
eudaimonia,
Mark
Why did you misquote me? I said I don't worry about things that I can't change. That only seems reasonable doesn't it? I come here to discuss ideas and advocate for reason. Plenty of Christians join atheist forums to try to convert. I just advocate for reason. To tell you the truth, I have to limit my time here because I start to get very discouraged about the state of the world when I spend too much time here. But I love ideas, always have.Well of coarse, that's exactly what I would do if I "didn't worry about things" in a life that's "too short"....join a Christian forum because there are no forums for people whose life is too short.
I will say it was a surprise to me that you read the Urantia Book not once but twice yet couldn't find anything helpful. "They will see without seeing and hear without hearing."
It is very good. Like so many modern movies, the pace is so frenetic that it kind of almost made me seasick but the story is good and the special effects and the new characters are really interesting. The second half of the movie was excellent. The best one of the series so far. I'd definitely watch it again and I'm glad I saw it on the big screen.Okay, let me see if I understand you correctly. Your life is your eternity because you can only have a subjective experience of your life while you are alive. You have no beginning because you cannot witness yourself transition from non-conscious to conscious. Are you getting at something like that?
Or are you making an epistemological point? Are you saying that since you have no experience of having no experience, you don't have sufficient reason to think that there ever was such a time?
eudaimonia,
Mark
Why did you misquote me? I said I don't worry about things that I can't change. That only seems reasonable doesn't it? I come here to discuss ideas and advocate for reason. Plenty of Christians join atheist forums to try to convert. I just advocate for reason. To tell you the truth, I have to limit my time here because I start to get very discouraged about the state of the world when I spend too much time here. But I love ideas, always have.
I read the Urantia Book when I was in my 20's. My Grandmother's boyfriend was into it but then he was into reincarnation and all sorts of other things as well. Anything mystical, that was him. I found it to be interesting reading and nothing more. More interesting than the Bible and a part of me would like it to be true. I'd like to visit other planets when I die. But there is no way of validating any of it so why would I take it seriously? To me there's no difference between faith and believing something because you want it to be true. I know that my wants and desires have no effect on reality. It will continue to be what it is no matter how much I might wish it to be different.
So, would you say that your "essential self" is God?I've been reading a lot of Teilhard lately, so stuff I come across is going through that filter right now. Using the 5 mutable things that you listed, the development of the conscious self could be seen as a spiritual evolutionary process as one moves from matter forward to consciousness. The question asked is comes after consciousness and what will the future human being look like in that regard.
And being a Lover of God, where God is the only reality, the "essential self" would be seen as an activity of God. Which than makes the soul totally eternal, not corruptible in any manor, not changeable, infinite in nature and one with the widest reach of the cosmos while shining forth with the light of the Divine.
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What part(s) of your soul is eternal? If it is eternal, it is immutable, correct? If it's immutable, then it should forever retain its "original holiness", being untaintable by any deed or unbelief or sin done in this temporal existence, correct?Our souls came from a place that time doesn't exist, and will return there.
So...people say "eternal."
Buddhists would say no - that change does not exist in nibbana.Certainly not. Change itself is eternal is it not?
I believe I am understanding it correctly. A professor of pediatrics determined that a number of individuals with hydrocephalus had brains less than 5% of normal size, one of which only had "a millimeter thick layer of brain tissue" yet he had an IQ of 126. What did I understand incorrectly?Are you sure that you understand that story correctly? I don't recall any story about anyone living without a brain. However, I have heard of stories of a few rare individuals living with a physically very tiny brain. That's not the same thing.
Given the amount of evidence for a mind-brain connection, I think that you'd have to ignore a great deal of evidence to draw the conclusion that you'd like to draw.
eudaimonia,
Mark
I realize on the face of it, the idea that qualia in such a context has anything to do with shareable communication or even the possibility of being shared between two people is counterintuitive and contradictory, however I was considering both the no private language concept, along with some debatable phenomena.They have little to do with communication. Communication works best when there's a shared external reality to use as a basis. I.e. you both can point at something and agree that they are blue and round and there are 2 of them. Then when we use the words later we both understand what they refer to.
Qualia are strictly internal feelings. An individual can't even be sure that the qualia they had in the past are the same as the qualia they are currently feeling, much less communicate anything about them in any way to anyone else. All one can say is they are having a feeling of what it is like to experience feelings of an experience. Not much information there.
More like an activity of God. But God in a Panentheist sense. Human beings is the cosmos being aware of itself.So, would you say that your "essential self" is God?
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