Is Spanking Child Abuse?

[exitstageright]

A football player, for the Vikings, was charged with child abuse for physically punishing one of his children. Now, this is what I have observed that generally is the case.

Black parents are too authoritative, by physically disciplining their children. White parents, on the other hand, are too permissive toward their children. Both need to ......Stop!!!

Many times, in public, I have observed white children yell at their parents, scream at their parents, laying on the floor while having a temper tantrum, and just out right disrespecting their parents.

If I had tried any of that,my mother would have told me,"Stop crying!.....or I will give you something to cry for!"


When I was a black child, when I did something wrong,I was whipped, not spanked, but whipped by my father ,who was also a strict disciplinarian.

While watching, "Leave It To Beaver ",I knew that" Leave It To Beaver" was fiction, because Ward Cleaver never whipped or spanked Wally and/or The Beaver.

However ,the things Ward told his boys, and what" The Rifleman" told his son Mark ,my father told me the same things, such as thinking about the consequinces before you act, being responsible for your own actions, and instead of trying to prove yourself, you should try to........... improve yourself.

That discipline kept me out of jail,caused me to get a good education, get a great job, so that I am able to afford to travel, while enjoying life.

 

[dayhiker]

I spanked my sons a few times. They learned from those spankings much quicker than any talk I ever gave. But I never spanked them for small trivial things. The line I told them most was, "Don't make the situation worse."

 

[exitstageright]

I spanked my sons a few times. They learned from those spankings much quicker than any talk I ever gave. But I never spanked them for small trivial things. The line I told them most was, "Don't make the situation worse."

The worse whipping that I received was on one Sunday before we went to church. My father was a Deacon at our church. I forgot what wrong that I did that day. All I remember was that he told me to take off all of my clothes, which had never happened before. He whipped me with a belt. After whipping me, he kept asking me, "S......what are you? What are you?"

I did not understand, at that time, what he was asking me. What some Christian fathers do not realize is,if they tell their children that GOD is our heavenly father, while they are not a loving affectionate father themselves. How can they expect their children to love, and to have affection for their heavenly father,if all they see is a father who is someone who is a strict disciplinarian who denies you things? You see? I had a father. But, I never had a ...........dad!

Now, can you women understand why I just crave the tender touch of an affectionate woman? There was a lot of emotional and physical pain for me while growing up. I did not like being in that Black American culture of put downs, constant negativity, and pain!

My mother, one time, when we were visiting on my grandfather's farm, when I did something wrong, made me cut a switch, from a bush, and bring it to her.
She whipped me with that same switch.

Well, on a side and a lighter note, if those referees ,at the the 49er game last Sunday, were raised like me, those referees would have had to do a whole lot of switch cutting.

 

[South Bound]

I spanked my sons a few times. They learned from those spankings much quicker than any talk I ever gave. But I never spanked them for small trivial things. The line I told them most was, "Don't make the situation worse."

The only thing I've ever spanked our children for was for doing something that would hurt them or for outright defiance.

I also tried very hard to take the temperament of our children into account.

One child may respond to a spanking, while another may not.

 

[MorkandMindy]

Getting it wrong

My parents were both disciplinarians. I never gained control of my life while at home and only very gradually did after leaving. They struck when angry.


Also my mom gave the implied message that school work was unpleasant and always that any chores were too, and just to buckle down and do them. If I had 15 min of school work she would ensure that I was sitting at the desk, that there were no distractions, and would look in every 20 min or so to check that I was sitting at the desk looking like I might be doing something. As long as I didn't give any trouble I was ignored. 3 hours later she might tell me to take a break. I got very good at daydreaming, and developed the most undisciplined mind I've ever encountered.


I do however have two handles that control me, I am financially strongly motivated, if I'd ever been paid anything at all for doing schoolwork I'd have been a top performer instead of usually at the bottom. And even more than that I'm socially motivated, so if someone wants something done and is there I will work very well and efficiently.


But I definitely struggled a lot with college and university studies owing to appalling work habits. My need to learn Buddhism and present awareness is very urgent and I'm now about 2% of the way there.

 

[MorkandMindy]

Getting it right


A Bible-believing and even Bible reading Christian for 10 years, I gave up for a number of decades by coincidence a year before my oldest son was born. So Dr. James Dobson 'Dare to Discipline' was out and I just played things by ear, using a bit of what was known from experimental psychology.

I took a zero discipline approach. Pretty much anything I suggested to my son to do was either an interesting learning experience or something else he would like to do, so he was always attentive to what I said - no need to ever say 'pay attention'.

I essentially never took him where he didn't want to go, the exception was school, but we managed to get through that fine, yes I often did any part of the homework he didn't like, so he could talk and I would type.

When his teacher mentioned to me that he was doing badly at the spelling tests I took over the task and reversed it. My son would test my spelling, which is infamously bad, and I did about the same as he did. He would mark my paper. My wife is just as infamous for being a bad speller so he would test her too.

After my son got his spelling list to take home he would test both of us and compare our results, then retest us both again to see how much we had improved. So he read out the words four times to us, and reread them four times again to mark our papers, and reread the ones we got wrong again to explain where we had gone wrong. This may sound like a trick but it wasn't; we are genuinely bad spellers. This may sound like fun, and it was.

 

[MorkandMindy]

How can it be shown that zero discipline was right?


In short; by the results.


When he was very young I let my son do whatever he wanted in the store, I might have commented not to go through certain doors to where he is not allowed, but I don't recall, but he would look under the shelving and go into the clothing rack, but usually only once or twice, he was curious, and after seeing what was there didn't generally look again.

Other parents were having a Dr. James Dobson type clash of wills at all times on a Saturday afternoon shop; parents and children both shouting, usually in the more down market stores.

It is completely unnecessary. They want to learn so let them as long as it is safe and not too much of a problem for others. As an ex teacher I'm a bit keen on learning it has to be said.

So a tantrum free childhood. No terrible twos, no adolescent rebellion.


He found school work was OK with a bit of help here and there, and there and here as well, and progressively took pride in his independence and took over everything I was doing when he was ready. At 17 I did bits he couldn't do on two occasions, and have never needed to since. By then he was better at most subjects than I was.


My mom, a Christian, told me I was doing it all wrong.

Eventually after my son had got into the top University in the country for the course he took, did a lot better than I did, and got a job many times better than mine, she agreed that maybe I had got it right.

 

[MorkandMindy]

Winning and losing conflict with the child


I agree with Exitstageright that both winning conflict by overwhelming force (overkill) and losing it give undesirable results.

Where I would like to differ is that I don't think the battle should be fought at all. Really in my opinion the child and adult should be on the same side in the battle and the battle is against the difficulties and tragedies that life will bring. Together to work out how to cope with the death of a parent, brother or sister or spouse or child. How to cope with declining job availability and the consequences that the horrendous trade deficit is going to eventually lead to. How to cope with bullies at school and in the work place.

There are plenty of challenges to face together without adding conflict with each other. Just my opinion.

 

[dayhiker]

Yes, I didn't punished my boys just because they were curious about something. Likely I wasn't punished that way either. I got spanked a handful of times because of things I did. But by the time I was Jr. high I was living my own life, making my own decisions. Now I was in church so that helped me not do crazy things. I think I smoked one cigarette. Saw no value in that!
By the time I was raising my kids I was familiar with the verse in Romans about there is no rebellion without the law. I didn't want my boys having a rebellious heart, so I had the minimum rules possible. Sure enough they didn't. I think the youngest son had a rebellious attitude for a couple of weeks. Then that passed.

 

[iambren]

"Is Spanking Child Abuse?"

No,it isn't as long as it is not abusive. There is a difference,ya know.

 

[keith99]

If spanking comes down to forcing compliance by inflicting pain it is abuse.

In my case trying that could also have proved fatal. At 16 my father was not a physical match for me. Luckily for both of us dad had created respect for him rather than fear long before that age.

 

[JCFantasy23]

I don't spank - just not me - and my parents didn't either. I don't find it to be child abuse, but I think punishment should not be seen as black and white when prescribing it. Spanking won't work for every child or parent, some punishments are more effective based on the personalities. I don't like the aspect of public spanking and humiliation, though, as to me it's a psychological form of abuse.

 

[iambren]

At times,like when I'm at Walmart, I think NOT spanking a child is abuse.

 

[exitstageright]

I don't spank - just not me - and my parents didn't either. I don't find it to be child abuse, but I think punishment should not be seen as black and white when prescribing it. Spanking won't work for every child or parent, some punishments are more effective based on the personalities. I don't like the aspect of public spanking and humiliation, though, as to me it's a psychological form of abuse.

Spanking worked for me, because I have never liked.......pain.
However ,the only month that I was always good ,was the month of December, because of Christmas.


"He's making a list
checking it twice
gonna find out
who's naughty or nice"

 

[MorkandMindy]

At times,like when I'm at Walmart, I think NOT spanking a child is abuse.

You can always wear ear defenders.


Sorry to take an amusing point seriously but here goes:

Is Walmart somewhere with a lot of low income group families?

Over here the 'less successful' usually make it to the stores on Saturday afternoon, and I've noticed the 'being badly behaved' is actually a game.

What happens is various kids take turns to act up, get the mother or both parents annoyed who then start threatening them, it is very much brinkmanship. Eventually they get the parents to make a promise that if they behave they will get something. They get a bit better and then a bit better, not enough make it obvious that was the objective, and eventually behave so well they get their reward.

To me that is a stupid game, I just give them something nice anyway for coming along, but they all grow up into sane capable adults so perhaps the stupid game teaches them things about how to handle human relationships.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

I think spanking is fine when done with control and when the children are younger. When they get to be around 11-12 there are many more options to choose from that work much better than a spanking, plus the children are getting older so the spanking wont have as much of an effect. And I only think spanking works when it fits the severity of the "crime".

 

[TheyCallMeDavid]

A football player, for the Vikings, was charged with child abuse for physically punishing one of his children. Now, this is what I have observed that generally is the case.

Black parents are too authoritative, by physically disciplining their children. White parents, on the other hand, are too permissive toward their children. Both need to ......Stop!!!

Many times, in public, I have observed white children yell at their parents, scream at their parents, laying on the floor while having a temper tantrum, and just out right disrespecting their parents.

If I had tried any of that,my mother would have told me,"Stop crying!.....or I will give you something to cry for!"


When I was a black child, when I did something wrong,I was whipped, not spanked, but whipped by my father ,who was also a strict disciplinarian.

While watching, "Leave It To Beaver ",I knew that" Leave It To Beaver" was fiction, because Ward Cleaver never whipped or spanked Wally and/or The Beaver.

However ,the things Ward told his boys, and what" The Rifleman" told his son Mark ,my father told me the same things, such as thinking about the consequinces before you act, being responsible for your own actions, and instead of trying to prove yourself, you should try to........... improve yourself.

That discipline kept me out of jail,caused me to get a good education, get a great job, so that I am able to afford to travel, while enjoying life.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with a little open handed swat on the fleshy part of the rear end of a child if they refuse to behave after a few warnings. The purpose is to jolt them out of the rebellion by making them see rebellion is wrong, it comes with consequences , and its behavior that cant be tolerated.

The key is to MAKE SURE your child knows that you still love your child even though you were disappointed with them. Its very good to hug, show affection, etc...to a child after a stern correction.

God certainly chatises us when we need it .

Its not necessary to use a belt or throw an object at a child, for, that's only going to instill fear and disrespect into a Child and it could leave emotional scars if its a common thing...even into adulthood.

 

[blackribbon]

I think any spanking done while the parent is angry has the potential for being abuse. It becomes a path for relieving the anger and not focused on correcting behavior lovingly. I made a rule in our house that spanking was only for direct defiance...and used a method that I got through a Christian parenting class. The child had to bend over the couch (or chair) and get into "spanking position". This was an act of bowing their will. Three spanks was it. only on the butt where it was least likely to cause physical harm...no belts or switches...a wooden spoon was recommended. (hands are for loving, not disipline)..after the 3 swats, the child had to appologize for the defiance (owning the behavior)...and the parent then had to accept the apology and hug the child and tell that that they loved the child even if they didn't like the behavior.

I remember wasting an entire afternoon waiting for my daughter (around 4 or 5) to get into "spanking position" on her own...she waited standing in the corner and I sat there waiting for her...it was the turning point for changing my very strong willed child.

 

[Kingsdotter]

I needed spanking as a child because I was strong willed! Am glad I got lots of it even tho it wasn't fun at that time, but I stayed in school even when I was having difficult teenage experiences because I was scared of what my mum would do if I didn't. I think I would have taken advantage of her if she hadn't been tough. That said, it depends on the child's personality; my younger sister didn't need much spanking, scolding worked well for her.

Spanking becomes child abuse when the intension behind it is wrong

 

[mmksparbud]

Spanking isn't abuse--beatings are!---A swat on the behind never hurt anybody--anything more than that is just not discipline, but beating. Some kids seem to need a few more spankings than they get.
My first husband only had to look at the kids and they would straighten up. He swatted his little girl only once. One quick swat and she was stunned and quiet for the rest of the day! He had a rule, you got spanked on the bare butt (well, you got to keep your underwear on, but pants came down and dresses up.)--His boy tried acting up at the supermarket with me and his friend was with him. (I was the stepmom)- I looked him straight in the eye and told him if he continued, his pants were coming down right there in front of God and everyone. He stared defiantly at me -- for about 5 seconds, and he knew I meant it. He lowered his eyes and was as good as gold for the rest of the day! The threat was enough.
My father had four belts tied together, he used the buckle end on the boys--that was not discipline, nor spanking--they were beatings, and did more harm than good.